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Check out the map
http://www.airlineprofiler.eu/wp-con...USOAP_2012.png which helps to understand who pays the most. You see that QF isn't penalised for getting maintenance done in China, but the A380 heavy maint in second rate Germany (read the map) could be a factor. Or indeed QF getting reconfig work done in the Philipines and Thailand give minus brownie points. But Virgin Oz is OK with it getting lots of maintenance done in NZ. |
Qantas has never killed a passenger in the jet age. Beat that!
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How about killing an airline?
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"Beat that!"
Easy. Southwest. And they have flown waaaay more sectors in their history than QF have. And in much more challenging places too!!!! Want some others? |
Qantas has never stopped flying involuntary or otherwise.
Oh hang on a minute...... Seriously though, the Qantas longhaul mainline folk have got to get out and sniff the roses. It's a big world out there. There are many different ways to skin a cat ,and as the MOU folk are finding out, they are not the best of the best. They are just another Pilot trying to pass their checks and get by. |
Zapatas Blood:
Easy. Southwest. And they have flown waaaay more sectors in their history than QF have. And in much more challenging places too!!!! Southwest Airlines Flight 1248 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia |
"Qantas has never killed a PASSENGER in the jet age" was the quote.
I think the family of the 6 year old would agree that she was not a passenger on the plane though! QF have been VERY lucky compared to some other carriers. Maybe this safety rating values luck less than hard evidence. |
QANTAS has had at least 2 non-pax fatalities in recent years; cleaner falling from a/c and flight attendant in galley lift. Plus I think a pax had fatal fall when disembarking down stairs. So Southwest wins - most flights without a pax fatality
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There was also HNL caterer killed by a 742 lower lobe galley personal elevator.
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Having worked for a Hainan subsidiary, I can tell you that their safety record is far more to do with luck than anything else, that and not all accidents in China find there way into western records, I'd rather fly Qantas any day.
Is this the mob that rated Air France in the top 10 last year? If so, it's not worth a knob of goat 5hit |
Where is poor old Tiger?
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Green Goblin, I haven't heard any of the MOU guys suggesting they are the best of the best.
Of the MOU guys, quite a few have flown for different airlines outside Australia, so your comments are just plain dumb. WRT the survey there is a different survey out each month, with a different result. Whilst Qantas may have had an over inflated perception amongst the public for their safety record in the past, I don't think it holds much credence these days. There are bigger issues at play regarding negative perceptions of Qantas. |
Reality hurts. Under the leadership of AJ
Qantas has collapsed from a class act to an ass act. |
Reality hurts. Under the leadership of AJ Qantas has collapsed from a class act to an ass act. already the main headline online today for the smh Qantas downgraded on Safety Index Qantas only ranks 13th in the world in terms of airline safety according to a European group of airline safety enthusiasts, a far cry from the previously prized number one ranking immortalised by Dustin Hoffman's character in Rain Man. Read more: Qantas downgraded on Safety Index Qantas safety list story also about Fairfax's decline | Plane Talking This is the same Fairfax that has invested scarcely any time even reporting the privileged disclosures of grave safety deficiencies in CASA, the ATSB, Airservices Australia, and in the operations of Jetstar and Pel-Air, even though they have been served up on a plate in Senate committee hearings and protected air safety investigation reports for several years. It is a Fairfax with some excellent reporters that nevertheless appears to be managerially totally gutless and unfocused when it comes to directing resources into real coverage of seriously relevant matters for its readerships even when they are begging for attention. But list stories, especially those with PR involvement, are pushed out, even when they are manifestly unsatisfactory in terms of lack of details or have credibility red flags fluttering all over them. There is no question, on the publicly available safety data, that all of the top 13 carriers in the list have good safety records today. But the rankings are strange. If Fairfax is prepared to give top of site billing to the rankings done by the tiny Jet Airliner Crash Data Evaluation Centre based in Hamburg without telling its readers exactly how Finnair ended up on top, and Virgin trumped Qantas, and so forth, it is making itself a party to something very odd to say the least. |
Many more staff fatalities during servicing or heavy maintenance over the years.
Big list unfortunately. Pax deaths due illnesses also don't count although I am not trivializing this. Just a fact. Qantas has been very, very lucky. |
"Qantas has been very, very lucky."
But so have all good and 'less good' airlines in the world... But as in one's own life, even an airline can influence its own luck.
Skygods? No. Perfect? No. A notable poorly-handled 'off-roading' event? Er... Yes, just like Southwest, American, Emirates, Air France etc etc etc. But there are several other very creditable team efforts which relied on the all the very best of attributes in any airline's crew; oxy bottle explosion (744), major electrical failure(744), unforeseeable complications of air data failures (A330), uncontained engine failure (A380)..... just like the permutations experienced at Cathay, British Airways, Air Canada etc etc etc. For all the QF bashing here, and all QF's in-house navel gazing(sheesh!), it must be remembered that QF is still very close to the top of any global safety list, and this particular list is just a fairly "interested amateur" one at that if Sandilands is to be believed. I will, with a clear conscience, still put my family on any QF flight. :ok: |
I was put on one of those "amazing" ppls programs a several years back that the company was pushing all of its staff through at the time. The instructor had a few of his own interesting theories. One was that the company had run several public surveys asking why people flew our carrier, the result was that they were mainly interested in OTP. Safety was a few places down the list, and he kept driving home issues affecting the cost of running an airline (none of which covered bonuses and overmanagement, money pi$$ed up against the wall on failed projects, fines, poor fleet choices, poor morale amongst staff, poor adverstising or the lack of).
Ever since then I have heard the growing war drum from my management trying to drive home that we do not have the monopoly on safety, and we must conform to world's best practice (or worlds standard practice as I see it). Everyone has the right to draw their own conclusions, I know I have. As a kid I grew up on "The spirit of Australia, the flying Kangaroo". I knew and was proud of our carriers safety record. Today my kids know of our national carrier probably for no other reason than because I worked there. Who will the kids of today choose to fly tomorrow?? |
I will, with a clear conscience, still put my family on any QF flight. |
If anyone is 'lucky' it is EK twice coming within a poofteenth of crashing an aircraft on takeoff. The one in MEL wiped out the LLZ! which are about 20' high if you're lucky.
I agree with Jetbest in that whilst QF may have had some luck and that the operating environment in Australia is relatively benign, they have got themselves out of some horror situations. I think at one stage they were at 10 engine failures within a 2 year period all of which ended well. |
Lets talk probability not luck. You make your luck. More and better training less chance of a disaster.
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