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Ineffectual government institutions get ridiculed, ignored and finally broken up The meek shall inherit the earth Blackhand........'if that's OK with you. |
Blackie I would bet that those comments are just from the professional pilots! I am often staggered by the complete lack of interest that pilots have in what's going on in the wider industry. For a lot of us who I classify as the old pilot generation accidents such as Kegworth and Sioux City were important markers as to how and why we do our job. To the cadet generation it's just so much boring history that might pop up on Nat Geo when they are finished watching the Kardashians.
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Unfortunate press.
Sandilands - Plane Talking.
"What the committee finds out about how the ATSB and CASA contrived to issue a report in which none of the material failings of the operator of the jet were explored will be of immense importance to the future integrity of air safety review procedures in both bodies". Ben Sandilands Plane Talking. Who is fairly easy to define; who ordered the corruption of the ATSB report and who orchestrated the audit cover up, the Senate have proof in all those lovely emails. ATSB have confessed their part of the conspiracy. It's just a matter of resignations and the laying of real criminal charges, by real coppers in a real court now. No soft, slushy evidence in the AAT for this crew. It will be more interesting to find out WHY the CASA actions were so out of character; and who managed the 'unfortunate' charge to self destruction. I hear some of the 'in camera' evidence was so devastating to the CASA position that even the most ardent 'true believers' have been shaking their heads. The next thing (Shirley) for the Senate must be to open up a general inquiry into the real impact of CASA actions across the industry. A full and open assessment will lead to a Royal Commission, because if the lid is coming off this crock, whoever is the minister will want control. I wonder if a new government will institute a reformation? They sure need to. There, I feel much less deluded now. |
I hear some of the 'in camera' evidence was so devastating to the CASA position..... Both CASA and ATSB have questions to answer, but not the questions imagined here. There are two options in this matter, a conspiracy or a fcku up, I'm going for a fcku up Okham's Razor says so. I don't think that CASA is presently capable of actually doing that. |
You probably mean ‘less disillusioned’, but it’s possible that you indeed meant ‘less deluded’. ;)
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some of the "in camera" evidence was the most puerile, "I'm a victim", mishmash of fact and fiction ever "heard Or are you confusing fact with opinion of what may have been your wildest imagination. Given the public hearing, I can't see how any "in camera" evidence would have vindicated the three Directors of Aviation Safety or Mr Dolan. And that's just a wild guess! |
Frank beat me to it...so what he said blackie! Or you could end up revisiting the CDPP for an entirely different matter...
I'm also with Frank (and probably most of the aviation fraternity that has taken the time to read the Hansard) and believe there is more than enough evidence of malfeasance, obfuscation and maladministration contained within the public hearing that any 'in camera' evidence is just icing on a rotten cake. Therefore what Kharon said: The next thing (Shirley) for the Senate must be to open up a general inquiry into the real impact of CASA actions across the industry. A full and open assessment will lead to a Royal Commission, because if the lid is coming off this crock, whoever is the minister will want control. I wonder if a new government will institute a reformation? They sure need to. |
Out of interest, the internationally-read AVWEB is picking up on all this.
AVwebFlash Complete Issue |
I can't see how any "in camera" evidence would have vindicated the three Directors of Aviation Safety or Mr Dolan. |
Keep the dream alive
It's a game of 'leap frog' on the deck of the S.S CASA Titanic.
Senator X at the front directing activities, the other Senators are riding the Aviation Directors and a fed up industry is at the back of the line waiting it's turn. A strange turn of events indeed considering it is usually CASA leaping industry, the Minister and the Senate with it's spin. http://cruiselinehistory.com/wp-cont...jc8957-001.jpg |
Top link Captain Dart!
Here's a copy of the article that CD linked to:
ASTB Gets Earful on Norfolk Islanding Ditching The Australian Transport Safety Bureau got a grilling before the Australian Senate this week over its investigatory work into the 2009 ditching of a Westwind medical flight off Norfolk Island. The bureau and Australia's Civil Aviation Safety Authority were castigated by witnesses for taking too long to complete the report (more than 1000 days), with one witness terming the investigation flawed and incompetent. According to a web report by The Australian,, the Senate investigation was initiated following a report by ABC Four Corners that revealed some 57 regulatory breaches, deficiencies and oversights of the flight's operator, Pel Air, that CASA was aware of but did not address. The investigations also revealed that the ATSB made few if any safety recommendations as a result of the accident. The Westwind ditched in November 2009 after completing a long flight from Samoa with six aboard, including a stable patient who was being flown to Melbourne for treatment. The captain of the flight, Dominic James, departed with legally sufficient fuel into a forecast of good VFR. En route, the weather soured and the Westwind was forced to ditch after three approach attempts. All six occupants survived. Under questioning during the hearing, according to The Australian, ATSB chief commissioner Martin Dolan admitted the bureau could have done better work in the Pel Air probe. He conceded that it took too long to complete the report, blaming a backlog of investigations. Other witnesses were less generous. Aviation consultant Byran Aherne told the panel the ATSB's report was factually incorrect and contained flawed analysis of the flight. The Australian quoted Aherne as saying the ATSB's intentional omission of critical facts would substantially change the report's findings. For his part, Dominic James previously told AVweb that he accepts full responsibility for the incident but in seeking the Senate hearing he said the ATSB failed to provide a balanced view of why the accident occurred and glossed over shortcomings in Pel Air's operating rules that were factors in the accident. He said CASA knew of these shortcomings but declined to enforce against Pel Air and that the ATSB failed to illuminate these issues in its report. In response, ATSB's Dolan said the bureau believed that Pel Air was in compliance with both its own ops specs and CASA regulations, which evidently made it legal for the flight to be made with minimum fuel reserves with a favorable weather forecast. CASA's John McCormick rejected James' complaint that he was unfairly treated by CASA during the investigation. James told us that when he challenged the investigators' findings on fuel calculations, they refused to explain how the calculations were derived. Further, the record revealed that James was given incorrect weather information en route, which was later corrected in a radio transmission that was too garbled to read. Sticking to his script, McCormick said James "may not have had the necessary aeronautical skill to take on the appropriate command judgments." For additional information on the crash and James, see this post on the AVweb Insider blog. Norfolk Ditching The comments are especially worth a read...:ok: |
blackhand
Kharon, some of the "in camera" evidence was the most puerile, "I'm a victim", mishmash of fact and fiction ever "heard". In the fight against injustice; Your statement is the epitome of what is wrong with "the system" of Lawyers, and their lacky's, and an inherit demonstrated desire to fail on the questions of; 1) accountability and transparency. 2) Failure to hold incompetent's and fools to answer for their actions. 3) Improper use of alcoholics, deviants, psychopaths, bigot's and the intelligence deprived criminals highlighting their incompetence that permeates our "regulator" at it's core. 4) The failure to create a fair and reasonable regulatory review programme in a timely manner. 5) Promoting and investing in our future aviation industry by actively attacking the participants with vexacious and unreal charges to deliver a "performance based outcome" like cops with a quota. Yourself, blackhand, are part of the problem. You have no other answer than to belittle the besieged with your quasi intelligence of dubious legal value and support a corrupt entity. Your input has been read by me, digested and summarily DISMISSED. It is my considered opinion that you have nothing to contribute to this discussion and I will add you to my "fools list" which is now approaching the end of a three column A4 sheet. |
PAIN - Norfolk Poll.
The authorities response to the Norfolk ditching if allowed to pass unchallenged has the potential to create a serious, far reaching impact on industry safety management.
The Senate response is crucial to how future events will be defined, reported and dealt with. The authorities credibility within the aviation community is compromised and needs to be addressed both internationally and domestically. Your response will assist in defining the direction and management of those events. The link below will take you to a simple, anonymous poll. There are only five YES/ NO questions to answer. Norfolk incident poll. |
POLL day 1 results.
Thank you all for a good first day response, particularly the overseas participants.
The 'poll' site provides a map which shows the countries that replies came from, just a simple world map with shading. Well done the Czech Republic, North America, Taiwan, UK and Vietnam. Q1) 92% Yes – 2.7% **Option – 5.3% No. Q2) 95.6% Yes – 0.9% Option- 3.5% No. Q3) 89% Yes – 3.0% Option – 8.0% No. Q4) 78% Yes – 12.3% Option – 9.7% No. Q5) 83.2% Yes – 2.6% Option – 14.7% No. ** Option was included to allow an alternate 'soft' option to Yes or No. Just a caution, although the site is simple and uncomplicated, there are safeguards built into the data base to help keep the poll honest. P4. |
Crisis point – Oh, you bet.
PD Phelan on track for yet another award with another excellent article published today.
Crisis point for aviation.- Aviation Advertiser. Find a beer, wine or a coffee, as pleases and have a read; it's worth it. Good luck on awards night Paul http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...ies/thumbs.gif |
Very informative article by Paul, as always.
One question though: However CASA has deemed that this aircraft may only be maintained by a LAME from a Part 145 maintenance organisation, LBH/GD Bipolar Brave who's other name is Two Heads Talking: As wise indian said to me, better to be tears of crocodile than poo of wombat for only when you listen to sound of one hand clapping does the scales fall from your eyes. |
Blackhand.
Are you alleging GD has multiple personalities? |
LBH where can I get a copy of that pictionary book sounds as if the author has some inside info on Pelairgate that needs further dissemination over a McCinno at the local golden arches!:E
HMHB: Are you alleging GD has multiple personalities? Now LBH is also Gobbles! Hmm blackie if you only knew mate you'd realise how funny that accusation is....anyway thread drift sorry mods! |
Little do you know about how little he knows about how little I know about how little you know.
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Blackhands comments may be safely dismissed since he has admitted he makes money out of "interpreting" the current regulations for the rest of us. This is perfectly legal, however one should point out that the more convoluted, confusing, ambiguous and deceptive the regulations are, the more his services are required.
To put it another way, "well he would say that, wouldn't he?" applies to everything he writes. I would not characterize his behaviour as corrupt, but the current CASA and ATSB behaviour is an open invitation to official corruption - which thrives on poorly drafted regulations that give public servants latitude in "interpreting" things. That is the subtext of phelans article in my opinion. To put that another way, if the law and regulations are not applied identically in all cases but depend on the menstrual cycle of the FOI involved, then that is corrupt. If the Gillard Governemnt will not act, then perhaps the attention of the FAA and ICAO should be drawn to the state of CASA and the ATSB. For a start, the revelation that ATSB passes identifying information to CASA immediately terminates its usefulness since nobody in their right mind will now report anything that they can successfully conceal. |
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