Here are some more hypothetical figures,
There are about 500 pilots and they should get $20000/p.a. pay rise, minimum.
500 pilots x $20,000 = $10,000,000.
Management are not going to come to the party.
That is how bean counters work. Thay use there fingers on both hands.

$10,000,000 sounds like a lot but it is merely:

1 mans salary and bonus for 1 year - good on ya GD.

As for genex:

QF pilots are paid only very slightly above the average for ALL airlines (and that's after the 9/11 inspired pay cuts in the US). Interestingly QF pilots are paid below many LCC's (QF 737 is significantly less than Southwest for example).

The problems you predict for QF may well come true, but it is because our management is too busy worrying about screwing wages down rather than running the business. Just one example out of a thousand is those ageing 744's you speak of, they should have been supplemented and replaced by 777-300ER's by now, but shusssssshhhhh! don't tell anyone, GD wants us to believe they're old technology.

With those aircraft we could fly direct to DFW, ORD, YVR rather than just LAX and SFO, therefore the inevitable competition on the Pacific would be much less of a problem then it will be with the present Pacific strategy.

Nothing to do with Pilots, Legacy carrier or AIPA, just poor management pure and simple.

Ask any QF employee we can point out many many obvious problems with the way management is running this airline.

By all means take a below par salary to help management out, but forgive me if I think you are worth more, and forgive me if I think management should be coming up with better ideas given the amount they are paid.

Just one question: What is unique about the Jetstar business that "requires" their pilots to be the lowest paid in the western world? Serious Question....

tenretni,

Would the hand of friendship and solidarity that you are extending to J* pilots belong to the same outfit that for the selfish needs of its members knifed the then solid Pilot Union in OZ in the back some time ago?

Would it be the same one that now wants to steal from that same Union, by legal means rather than by the choice of those concerned, coverage of other QF group pilots that up until now have been left to fend for themselves?

Would it be the same one that does not appear to give a rats about any other members of the aviation community, preferring to leave that task to the aforementioned Union minus the membership it now wants?

It doesn't appear to have a track record of solidarity and therefore possibly no record of friendship to anyone other than itself. How can you expect J* or Qlink pilots to trust it?

We kicked out the guys that you refer to in an overwhelming rejection of previous AIPA regimes.

Since then there has been no inconsistency within AIPA regarding the desire to get all group pilots on a common list.

Remember the guy who spat in the Impulse pilots faces all those years ago (to the absolute horror of most AIPA members) is now the CP, clearly it could be taken that he was not acting in AIPA's best interests; as many of us thought at the time.

Like Speeeedy says

The QF pilots got rid of the old AIPA regime.

That hand of friendship that I and others are extending does not hold a gun mate!

AIPA has fought a court battle seeking the legal right to represent all QF group pilots and won.

The choice for my colleagues at Jetstar and Qlink is now a real one!

You talk of trust.

Well then lets join forces and give that trust a run for its money shall we!

Now there's two blokes trying to rewrite history!

Heres some figures for you:

50 pi55ed off Captains flying 800 hrs a year = 40000 hrs.
Every time they go flying, they just want to get home in a hurry, 330/.79 or .80 = extra 200kgs of gas/hour = 250 litres x 40000 = 10,000,000 litres @ ( approx ) $1/litre = $10,000,000

Not even touching on : working on days off, answering phone outside of reserve period, " interpretation " of MELs at out ports, " yep, we can make that taxiway ( brakes are pretty expensive ), " think I'll carry an extra ton of fuel, just in case " etc etc etc.

All things that a) are not safety issues and b) you and GOD have no control over AJ, so stick that in your pipe and smoke it :}

It's not looking good, the JPA (used car salesman as far as i'm concerned) really do believe this is great offer and keep telling us that if we don't sign the company will walk away from negotiations for at least 18 months (too busy with 787)

I think they have been knocking heads with the comapny for too long and don't know which way is up....

They don't seem to realise that we are the hardest working lowest paid airline pilots in the country..Well it's time for that to end..

I hope and urge all fellow JQ pilots to presure AIPA to represent us ASAP so Jetstar can be an airline people want to fly for, instead of being seen as a bunch of pilots willing to sell their mothers for a jet job!!

Details anyone......anyone?????????????

"They don't seem to realise that we are the hardest working lowest paid airline pilots in the country..Well it's time for that to end.."


That is a very arrogant statement to make. I know of a lot of other pilots(airline) in other companies IN OZ earning not as much and working just as hard.

At the end of the day NOBODY is making you stay there and NOBODY twisted your arm to go there in the first place. If you don't like it, you do have a very real choice.

Laying in one's bed that one made comes to mind.

Well Jake, after saying loud and often that J* was going to be crewed by QF mainline (and you KNEW because you were SO CLOSE to the negotiations) you then tried to say that the MOU meant it WAS being crewed by QF mainline.....

So we'll make that THREE blokes, shall we?

Wiz,

It was so close to being true but for a personality clash which created a few hiccups and the fact that a group of Impulse Pilots decided to become the lowest paid drivers in the western world.:D

Can't help bad luck eh! You feel sorry for the poor old legacy pilots? :{

AIR Warren
 

All pilot's considering joining JQ need to seriously consider their choice.
This EBA presents them with very little compared to what the Captains will receive via the proposed bonus scheme.
ALL Current Captains will receive the proposed bonus and any F/O's with greater than 3 years in the company will also get it.Lets face it, this is nothing
more than blatant B scale pay scheme that as always favours Captains.Combine this with JQ's current disregard for seniority and you get a scenario where an F/O who has been in the company for 2 3/4 years gets squat where a Direct entry Captain who joins today is entitled to a Bonus! Is this fair or a reward for a senior F/O? NO!! Its a crap deal and not only are junior pilot's being shafted by management but also by their senior mates.Well done lads Rob Peter to pay Paul.Send this EBA back where it came from and new starts need to watch this one closely before leaping into this mess.

How is the Jetstar Pilot Council selected? Are they elected? Can you hold an EGM and oust them? How does that side of it work?

These bottom dwellers were rejected by QF, AN, NJS, Kendell, Hazo, Easterns, Sunnies, Southerns and everyone else. So they had to PAY for a job with Impact via AirScrew Controls. Now they negotiate your T&C's!!!!
You blokes are yer own worst enema's. Sorry enemies:}


See youse!:ok:

Bottom line? Most Ozzy pilots who are qualified to operate the heavy metal have an inbox full of contracts and offers from the world over.

They are all just biding there time to see what JQ offers before they decide whether to come home or take the big money contract elsewhere.

JQ boys and girls, don't get spooked by the drawer full of "expressions of interest".

So No One knows what the offer is then from what I can work out. Plenty seem ready to talk about something they know nothing about though.

Nobodies business
 

I would say J* EBA is nobodies business bar the current pilots employed. Those outside so keen to know should hold their breath till it's agreed and registered or not. Then it will be posted on the various government websites.
What I can tell you is A320 jet commands in less than 24mths and forecast to continue for for quite a while to come.

It is an amazing world isn't it where a bloke/blokess with just over two years in an airline, maybe 4500 hours total 1500 jet considers themselves a "Senior First Officer". Average time to command at J* just on 2 years now, and probably for some time to come.

I can only emphasize what I posted previously:-
Genex, one day you,ll wake up to the fact that LOYALTY to managers like Alan Joyce is a one way street. He expects it from his staff but gives nothing in return. If all LCC's are in the same position re the pilot shortage then they can pay their pilots more without destroying their competitive position. A significant increase in salary would increase ticket prices only slightly and would probably not be noticed by Joe Public.