Productivity Of Qantas Longhaul Pilots
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What a load of crap.
Some people really do need to get a grip on what it is they really do.
It is not brain surgery.
You get paid what you are worth, if you no like, you leave.
If Joe Bloggs gets more, then good luck to him.
Finally, I cannot believe that a QF F/O and a SQ skipper got together at a party and discussed pay rates.....did they compare dick sizes also?
It is no wonder many people do not understand pilots. Thank god they put it down to 'mystery' of the job.
I
Some people really do need to get a grip on what it is they really do.
It is not brain surgery.
You get paid what you are worth, if you no like, you leave.
If Joe Bloggs gets more, then good luck to him.
Finally, I cannot believe that a QF F/O and a SQ skipper got together at a party and discussed pay rates.....did they compare dick sizes also?
It is no wonder many people do not understand pilots. Thank god they put it down to 'mystery' of the job.
I
Well said Borg!
just the jealousy of a few methinks...
allowances are not an "addition to your pay" either. They are part of an overall package, and believe it or not, every year that I have had allowances on my tax return, I have always been paid less than what the ATO declare a "fair amount" for the ports i visit.
Don, it has been my experience that the captains have only been able to use the satfone effectively whilst onboard the aircraft. If you know anohter way, then please let us know... wrt tollfree numbers and office facilities... keep dreaming pal!! Every time i have called the front desk to be put thru to ops, they have billed my room! Even calls to the doctor are put on the room bill. All at hotel rates. And to answer your original 2nd question re longhaul rostering... rules that allow me to fly 10 SYD-MEL sectors in 3 days are not overly restrictive...
To echo what others have said on this forum... what is the problem with all you people who seek to bring down the wages and conditions that others work hard for!? I believe they call it "tall poppy syndrome"...
just the jealousy of a few methinks...
allowances are not an "addition to your pay" either. They are part of an overall package, and believe it or not, every year that I have had allowances on my tax return, I have always been paid less than what the ATO declare a "fair amount" for the ports i visit.
Don, it has been my experience that the captains have only been able to use the satfone effectively whilst onboard the aircraft. If you know anohter way, then please let us know... wrt tollfree numbers and office facilities... keep dreaming pal!! Every time i have called the front desk to be put thru to ops, they have billed my room! Even calls to the doctor are put on the room bill. All at hotel rates. And to answer your original 2nd question re longhaul rostering... rules that allow me to fly 10 SYD-MEL sectors in 3 days are not overly restrictive...
To echo what others have said on this forum... what is the problem with all you people who seek to bring down the wages and conditions that others work hard for!? I believe they call it "tall poppy syndrome"...
I for one can believe that the BBQ comparisons of pay occurred. But, possibly, what was not clarified is peripheral stuff which amount to disposable income at the end; tax rates, housing allowances, expat travel priveleges etc? Balance the package and I find it hard to imagine a QF F/O making more than a SQ Capt.
I thought I was wrong once, but it turns out I was mistaken
I thought I was wrong once, but it turns out I was mistaken
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I would like to quote the most influential CEO of the 20th century when he said:
"the only people that can provide job security are your customers."
Until you guys stop worrying about who has the biggest dick and understand what that statement means, your company is great danger of not existing in 10 years.
Cop U Later
The Rev
"the only people that can provide job security are your customers."
Until you guys stop worrying about who has the biggest dick and understand what that statement means, your company is great danger of not existing in 10 years.
Cop U Later
The Rev
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To all non Commercially qualified drivers!
Those of you out there that are PPL's etc., please take note .....
This is called PROFESSIONAL pilots rumour network for a reason.
It is a network for those who derive their main income from flying these things and those who are in the process of doing so.
In saying that, particularly those who are not even PPL or not even considering a career flying - sorry this site is not for you.
I may only be yet another GA loser, but I find it annoying that muppets who have no direct "WORKING' experience being big authorities on Airline pay/productivity/conditions.
Most (surely?) GA drivers like me understand that the majority of Airline drivers have put up with years of crap before finally making it to a position where they can actually start to reel in some reward for their efforts/ankle holding.
Hey, if it is so damn good, for so little actual work, have a go your self.
It is just so easy.
Just spend $70,000 (and I mean you ..... not your Daddy). Your job prospects will be difficult and expect to spend the first 1-3 years working 50 hrs.+(duty time) for less money than a 16 yr old gets for pushing trollies at Woolies. Then maybe if you achieve all this by age 30 (preferably 25), then you probably have a 10-20% chance of making the "big time".
If this sounds a bit too hard, you are probably right.
If you are not a qualified driver (or in the process of ....) then maybe better not to log onto this forum, and just keep reading "Austalian Flying" so they can keep telling you about the HUGE pilot shortage that they have said has been coming since the Wright Bros first flew.
Boney
This is called PROFESSIONAL pilots rumour network for a reason.
It is a network for those who derive their main income from flying these things and those who are in the process of doing so.
In saying that, particularly those who are not even PPL or not even considering a career flying - sorry this site is not for you.
I may only be yet another GA loser, but I find it annoying that muppets who have no direct "WORKING' experience being big authorities on Airline pay/productivity/conditions.
Most (surely?) GA drivers like me understand that the majority of Airline drivers have put up with years of crap before finally making it to a position where they can actually start to reel in some reward for their efforts/ankle holding.
Hey, if it is so damn good, for so little actual work, have a go your self.
It is just so easy.
Just spend $70,000 (and I mean you ..... not your Daddy). Your job prospects will be difficult and expect to spend the first 1-3 years working 50 hrs.+(duty time) for less money than a 16 yr old gets for pushing trollies at Woolies. Then maybe if you achieve all this by age 30 (preferably 25), then you probably have a 10-20% chance of making the "big time".
If this sounds a bit too hard, you are probably right.
If you are not a qualified driver (or in the process of ....) then maybe better not to log onto this forum, and just keep reading "Austalian Flying" so they can keep telling you about the HUGE pilot shortage that they have said has been coming since the Wright Bros first flew.
Boney
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Its all just industrial relations
knowing quite a few people in the industrial relations world, I have been fortunate to be privy to many a discussion on pay and conditions. If QF long haul pilots are happy with what they are getting and the company agrees, I can't see the problem. Whether they are deserving is irrelevant to me if all parties involved are happy with the status quo! If the company is getting ripped off (not sure they are in this case) then the company should negotiate new conditions. We ALL want better pay and conditions, why fall on your sword if you have too!!
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VB_Capt, go back and read Boney's post again, he mentioned twice that he is a GA driver - not QF.
I hope you read your checklist more carefully than you read this forum.
Cheers
CC
I hope you read your checklist more carefully than you read this forum.
Cheers
CC
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balance,
your parents must be pleased that you have finally mastered the art of reading and writing.
I bet they look forward to the day that you make the next big step and comprehend what it is that you are reading.
to make it easy for you dearie, ITCZ=jet RPT pilot. ITCZ not QF. ITCZ not VB. ITCZ not management. ITCZ like it that other industry colleagues making a reasonable living out of aviation.
If you ever lose your medical, balance, you show all the necessary qualities of making a successful aviation manager. Reads but doesn't comprehend, hears but doesn't listen, and expends a lot of energy going in the wrong direction after hearing 10% of the argument, and being bloody rude to sensible people nearby while he/she is at it.
your parents must be pleased that you have finally mastered the art of reading and writing.
I bet they look forward to the day that you make the next big step and comprehend what it is that you are reading.
to make it easy for you dearie, ITCZ=jet RPT pilot. ITCZ not QF. ITCZ not VB. ITCZ not management. ITCZ like it that other industry colleagues making a reasonable living out of aviation.
If you ever lose your medical, balance, you show all the necessary qualities of making a successful aviation manager. Reads but doesn't comprehend, hears but doesn't listen, and expends a lot of energy going in the wrong direction after hearing 10% of the argument, and being bloody rude to sensible people nearby while he/she is at it.
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ITCZ=jet RPT pilot. ITCZ not QF.
Convergance old buddy. Apologies if you believe I got your post wrong. Truth is, I didn't. You think QF pilots salaries are stable? Now way hose.
We used to be in perhaps the top 1% of wage earners. Now I'd be surprised if we are in the top 30%. Our salary has not kept pace with those plumbers, plasterers and builders that I talk about.
My brother in law is an ordinary plasterer. He brings home almost as much as me. Whichever way you look at it, thats insane.
CZ, you aren't from QF as you say, so you haven't been there to witness this slow downward trend. And now, the beancounters are talking war, as though we still earn too much?
THIS IS a weird world.....
Convergance old buddy. Apologies if you believe I got your post wrong. Truth is, I didn't. You think QF pilots salaries are stable? Now way hose.
We used to be in perhaps the top 1% of wage earners. Now I'd be surprised if we are in the top 30%. Our salary has not kept pace with those plumbers, plasterers and builders that I talk about.
My brother in law is an ordinary plasterer. He brings home almost as much as me. Whichever way you look at it, thats insane.
CZ, you aren't from QF as you say, so you haven't been there to witness this slow downward trend. And now, the beancounters are talking war, as though we still earn too much?
THIS IS a weird world.....
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I wish QF pilots all the best when it comes to retaining their hard won conditions, particuilarly 737 guys. If they take a hit, then we can never hope to get up a bit, let alone a lot. But I can see Dixon using our rates to try to get you guys down . That's the danger as I see it.
Managements will always screw their workers. It doesn't matter how well they're performing or how good they aree. Can't and won't comment on the rorts or alleged rorts. In this age of the less the workers get the more the managers get, it''s easy to see why the managers try to screw us down. That's life. I don't like it but I can't control it. What do we do go on strike?
Managements will always screw their workers. It doesn't matter how well they're performing or how good they aree. Can't and won't comment on the rorts or alleged rorts. In this age of the less the workers get the more the managers get, it''s easy to see why the managers try to screw us down. That's life. I don't like it but I can't control it. What do we do go on strike?
Nunc est bibendum
Well there are at least some fairly high up the totem pole at QF who seem happy with the costs of QF tech crew- and thats all I'm going to say about that! Sure, there probably are ways that we can all be more efficient- most 767 drivers would LOVE to be more efficient and get more time at home- but no reason to be getting all antsy about it the way that Don has. 
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lever in etc...I agree that if the crews and managemnet are happy then why should it change. The problem there is that the management are never happy if theyre paying anything and Dixon will use Virgin as the benchmark and try to get his workers down three. They'd have us working for nothing if they could and here were damn near are working for nothing.
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Unfortunately what QF management seem to forget is that due to the CAO 48 dispensation, they don't have to employ as many pilots and I have heard that due to this the QF 737 pilots are actually cheaper than the Virgin ones.
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Keg- couldn't agree with you more...more time at home, decent stick hours per day away- maybe a CAO 48 dispo so we can do things like SYD-PER-SYD (I know the A330 is doing a few of those) or SYD-DN-SYD..etc
My biggest wish for QF management is that they stop looking at cost reduction as start having a good look at revenue increase- looking at new opurtunites to GROW instead of cost cutting...
PS Why do the call Geoff Dixons office the art gallery??
Because it is wher the big picture is...
My biggest wish for QF management is that they stop looking at cost reduction as start having a good look at revenue increase- looking at new opurtunites to GROW instead of cost cutting...
PS Why do the call Geoff Dixons office the art gallery??
Because it is wher the big picture is...
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Guys
Sorry to be doing a bit of thread drift...........back onto the topic!
How many hours are the QF B744 guys and gals flying at the moment?
N2000
(Presently projected 893 hours for the rolling 12 months Sep 02 to Aug 03, BA B744)
Sorry to be doing a bit of thread drift...........back onto the topic!
How many hours are the QF B744 guys and gals flying at the moment?
N2000
(Presently projected 893 hours for the rolling 12 months Sep 02 to Aug 03, BA B744)