Ex AN pilots now in QF - the cancer within
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Further to Gnads post,
A well placed source in touch with AIPA that the "Lawnmower Man" will be made a 'landee second officer'
This means that he will get a first class endorsement on the aircraft and will operate as an F/O when he flies
I also understand that their will be further appointments soon along the lines of the above - as I stated in the first post.
There is no way to describe this behaviour as anything else but an act of scabbery of the highest order.
To the ex AN crowd on this thread who have lept to LM's defence - fcuk off, you have had your chance and blew it.
A well placed source in touch with AIPA that the "Lawnmower Man" will be made a 'landee second officer'
This means that he will get a first class endorsement on the aircraft and will operate as an F/O when he flies
I also understand that their will be further appointments soon along the lines of the above - as I stated in the first post.
There is no way to describe this behaviour as anything else but an act of scabbery of the highest order.
To the ex AN crowd on this thread who have lept to LM's defence - fcuk off, you have had your chance and blew it.
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Winstun
“I really don't see how hiring any ex-Ansett management is a smart move. The company drove themselves out of business”
The person in question was not a business manager but an operations department manager.
Fartsock
Exactly what behavior are you talking about? He has done nothing more than accept a new position within the organization. Take it up with QF if you don’t like it.
“To the ex AN crowd on this thread who have lept to LM's defence - fcuk off, you have had your chance and blew it.”
Ahmm. No. We wont fcuk off. Sorry, does our presence bother you. (Exactly what chance did “we” blow anyway)?
One person has been promoted within QF as a result of his experience on the new airbus and you guys are acting like it’s the end of the world.
How are you going to cope when the real action starts – ever heard of jetconnect.
“I really don't see how hiring any ex-Ansett management is a smart move. The company drove themselves out of business”
The person in question was not a business manager but an operations department manager.
Fartsock
Exactly what behavior are you talking about? He has done nothing more than accept a new position within the organization. Take it up with QF if you don’t like it.
“To the ex AN crowd on this thread who have lept to LM's defence - fcuk off, you have had your chance and blew it.”
Ahmm. No. We wont fcuk off. Sorry, does our presence bother you. (Exactly what chance did “we” blow anyway)?
One person has been promoted within QF as a result of his experience on the new airbus and you guys are acting like it’s the end of the world.
How are you going to cope when the real action starts – ever heard of jetconnect.
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Fartsock.
Do you think QF is a profitable carrier because you and your co-workers are efficient and productive employees?
Do you think AN went under because the pilots were inefficient.
Do you realize QF was more unprofitable back in the days of being a Government enterprise than AN ever was in its darkest hour.
Do you think QF is a profitable carrier because you and your co-workers are efficient and productive employees?
Do you think AN went under because the pilots were inefficient.
Do you realize QF was more unprofitable back in the days of being a Government enterprise than AN ever was in its darkest hour.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
FE, I would assume the "chance" that fartsock has mentioned was aimed at the scabs of '89 - those that greedily rushed in to take a position to which they had previously been found unacceptable, or considered unqualified - and that having stolen that position, took delight in then further rorting the Ansett system by flying around at stick shaker speeds to further line their pockets!
The result - they killed the goose that laid the golden egg.
RIP Ansett.
One is the thin end of the wedge. In an airline that - until now - has had an established seniority system, this may WELL herald the beginning of "end of the world" of that system.
A precedent is being set on this front.
And on another, Jet Connect and Australian.
Hopefully AIPA has a bypass clause in place, that will at least allow the 800 or so QF pilots who have been dis-advantaged by the Lawn Mower Man's promotion, to be financially compensated.
The argument that "it's only 1", is the same as the "only a little bit pregnant" excuse. These things have a habit of growing!!
"There is no way to describe this behaviour as anything else but an act of scabbery of the highest order.".
Second time around, FS - and to think that you (QF) guys thought that 1989 wasn't part of your fight as well, back then.
You sure got the title of your thread right!
The result - they killed the goose that laid the golden egg.
RIP Ansett.
One person has been promoted within QF as a result of his experience on the new airbus and you guys are acting like it’s the end of the world.
A precedent is being set on this front.
And on another, Jet Connect and Australian.
Hopefully AIPA has a bypass clause in place, that will at least allow the 800 or so QF pilots who have been dis-advantaged by the Lawn Mower Man's promotion, to be financially compensated.
The argument that "it's only 1", is the same as the "only a little bit pregnant" excuse. These things have a habit of growing!!
"There is no way to describe this behaviour as anything else but an act of scabbery of the highest order.".
Second time around, FS - and to think that you (QF) guys thought that 1989 wasn't part of your fight as well, back then.
You sure got the title of your thread right!
Some of the exAN posters here would have us believe Flight Management played no part in the demise of Ansett.
The most influential catalyst was a bumbling exQF Fleet Manager whose role in the 767 groundings reprehensible.
The stuff ups by Ansett Flight Management were regular and monumental. Difficult to put a financial figure on that but i would be confident in saying their ineptitude cost Ansett irrecoverably.
The most poignant point I can make is that Ansett failed to introduce a single aircraft type post 1989. A promising Ansett International never reached the heights or recovered after the 747 bungling. The CRJs failure, actual total concept failure, was a final spiral. And that was TJ's baby.
Myself and many of my former Airbus colleagues, who flew the aircraft for years at home and now approaching our first years abroad, would say you have been bluffed regarding the "experience" required for this position. The bluff would have a pompous TJ's backing. Only a QF Flight Management team, who takes themselves a little too seriously, could fall for this ladder climbing exercise.
FS
I feel you are tarring all us exAN with the same brush. There was only ever one Lawn Mower Man. And all of us normal blokes at Ansett always thought he was in the wrong airline. We felt he better served the QF Long Haul stereotype!
Still glad the bloke got a job. Wouldn't wish unemploment hell on anybody.
The most influential catalyst was a bumbling exQF Fleet Manager whose role in the 767 groundings reprehensible.
The stuff ups by Ansett Flight Management were regular and monumental. Difficult to put a financial figure on that but i would be confident in saying their ineptitude cost Ansett irrecoverably.
The most poignant point I can make is that Ansett failed to introduce a single aircraft type post 1989. A promising Ansett International never reached the heights or recovered after the 747 bungling. The CRJs failure, actual total concept failure, was a final spiral. And that was TJ's baby.
Myself and many of my former Airbus colleagues, who flew the aircraft for years at home and now approaching our first years abroad, would say you have been bluffed regarding the "experience" required for this position. The bluff would have a pompous TJ's backing. Only a QF Flight Management team, who takes themselves a little too seriously, could fall for this ladder climbing exercise.
FS
I feel you are tarring all us exAN with the same brush. There was only ever one Lawn Mower Man. And all of us normal blokes at Ansett always thought he was in the wrong airline. We felt he better served the QF Long Haul stereotype!
Still glad the bloke got a job. Wouldn't wish unemploment hell on anybody.
Last edited by Gnadenburg; 11th Jul 2003 at 02:26.
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Gnads,
Good point (in yr last post) well made.
I too have many ex-AN friends, some in QF.
I have only been ever refering to the worst of a small bad bunch. Unfortunately like a high fibre turd they are beginning to float to TJ's top...
Good point (in yr last post) well made.
I too have many ex-AN friends, some in QF.
I have only been ever refering to the worst of a small bad bunch. Unfortunately like a high fibre turd they are beginning to float to TJ's top...
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GB seems to imagine his facts are correct in relation to the AIPA deal in '89.
The truth was Bobby bought off the AIPA with a deal which gave them around 20% over three payments. He certainly did not want QF involved. To suggest he wanted to involve QF pilots is a nonsense.
AIPA being lead as it was/is, bought it and again snubbed the professional colleagues they loved to hate.
QF flying domestic routes sanctioned by the AFAP is irrelvant to this argument.
AIPA was, and remains, extraordinarily weak as a body, and completely disinterested in the profession of airline pilot, thanks to the GW's who lead them out of the AFAP.
The big picture escaped them, and the day cometh when you will regret it, because the rot has set in.
You best realise, all pilots, that united you can stand, and divided you will fall, and if you can't see that that has happened as much to the scabs as you think it did to the 89er's, then I am afraid you lack the intellect to hold an ATPL.
The truth was Bobby bought off the AIPA with a deal which gave them around 20% over three payments. He certainly did not want QF involved. To suggest he wanted to involve QF pilots is a nonsense.
AIPA being lead as it was/is, bought it and again snubbed the professional colleagues they loved to hate.
QF flying domestic routes sanctioned by the AFAP is irrelvant to this argument.
AIPA was, and remains, extraordinarily weak as a body, and completely disinterested in the profession of airline pilot, thanks to the GW's who lead them out of the AFAP.
The big picture escaped them, and the day cometh when you will regret it, because the rot has set in.
You best realise, all pilots, that united you can stand, and divided you will fall, and if you can't see that that has happened as much to the scabs as you think it did to the 89er's, then I am afraid you lack the intellect to hold an ATPL.
Sub-Sonic MB
From your posts I can only assume that you are very bitter and are not prepared to accept facts. The low life who was PM at the time did not make any deal with AIPA (he hated International pilots as much as he hated domestic pilots) and the only pay rises that QF pilots got post 89 were as a result of giving away a lot of conditions through the EBA process - and we do regret giving away some of the conditions.
If you had talked to any QF pilots during the dispute, you would have seen just how much support that we were giving our domestic peers - this is fact wheras the assertions in your post are just bull$hit.
GB
From your posts I can only assume that you are very bitter and are not prepared to accept facts. The low life who was PM at the time did not make any deal with AIPA (he hated International pilots as much as he hated domestic pilots) and the only pay rises that QF pilots got post 89 were as a result of giving away a lot of conditions through the EBA process - and we do regret giving away some of the conditions.
If you had talked to any QF pilots during the dispute, you would have seen just how much support that we were giving our domestic peers - this is fact wheras the assertions in your post are just bull$hit.
GB
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Well, I gotta tell ya Going Boeing, if you're trying to tell us that your lot supported the domestics during the 89' dispute, then you're either a fool or weren't around at that point in time!
So I suggest you're the one sprouting Bull$hit, not SubSonic!
Besides, the Qantas acceptance of scabs during and after 89' is the reason why Qantas is known around the world as a scab airline!
Are you not aware of that?
So I suggest you're the one sprouting Bull$hit, not SubSonic!
Besides, the Qantas acceptance of scabs during and after 89' is the reason why Qantas is known around the world as a scab airline!
Are you not aware of that?
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Isn't anybody who joined Ansett after 89'.......a "high fibre turd"
.....................Qantas is known around the world as a scab airline!
