Wheels up - Go Around!
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A few months back, whilst on the ground awaiting departure, I saw an Airbus A320 go around from about 200 feet AGL - apparently because the gear was still up.
I first saw the Airbus when it was about 500 AGL and had been cleared to land, and I thought, "What's wrong with this picture"?
Then I thought "He's got no gear down!!!"
Then I thought "Nah - couldn't be! Must be the viewing angle or the engine nacelle must blocking my view of the gear."
Then I thought "He bloody-well hasn't got the gear down!!!!! OMG!!!"
The other pilot and I looked at each other in disbelief, and I tried to recall what the standard radio phraseology is for, "Do you REALLY want to do this?" when the recently trained tower guy pipes up, "[callsign] check wheels." and that's when the Airbus first started to pitch up for the go-around.
John Wayne plane indeed!
I first saw the Airbus when it was about 500 AGL and had been cleared to land, and I thought, "What's wrong with this picture"?
Then I thought "He's got no gear down!!!"
Then I thought "Nah - couldn't be! Must be the viewing angle or the engine nacelle must blocking my view of the gear."
Then I thought "He bloody-well hasn't got the gear down!!!!! OMG!!!"
The other pilot and I looked at each other in disbelief, and I tried to recall what the standard radio phraseology is for, "Do you REALLY want to do this?" when the recently trained tower guy pipes up, "[callsign] check wheels." and that's when the Airbus first started to pitch up for the go-around.
John Wayne plane indeed!
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There are two types of pilots out there.
1. Those who have tried to do a wheels up approach ... and
2. Those who haven't yet ...
Be Alert - the world needs more Lerts
DG
1. Those who have tried to do a wheels up approach ... and
2. Those who haven't yet ...
Be Alert - the world needs more Lerts
DG
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Do tower always look for the wheels? Or only sometimes? I thought something like an airbus would have a horn that goes off at least... a 210 does!
Many a pilots nightmare - the scariest are airplanes that don't need the gear to slow you down.. very scary.
I wince when i hear these stories!
Many a pilots nightmare - the scariest are airplanes that don't need the gear to slow you down.. very scary.
I wince when i hear these stories!
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Anyway back to the original post from the 'master'.
This same airline had a VERY near wheels up at YKSC within the last year, and now with a Multi Crew Operation yet another. It makes one wonder about the companies check and training dept,
not to mention SOP's!
This same airline had a VERY near wheels up at YKSC within the last year, and now with a Multi Crew Operation yet another. It makes one wonder about the companies check and training dept,
not to mention SOP's!
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A few years ago I was waiting for departure at the runway 07 holding point at Albury, NSW, whilst a locally-based RPT Chieftain made it's approach to land. I think the Chieftain might have been coming from Canberra.
I saw the Chieftain turning from left base onto final, and as it got a bit closer I got that "What is wrong with this picture?" feeling.
Yep - no wheels!
Fearing that a gutsed Chieftain on the one and only runway might delay my departure somewhat, and out of a sense of civic duty (actually, mainly the former
) I was just about to press the transmit button to suggest that the Chieftain driver might like to consider his career options at this point (the Chieftain was at about 200 feet at this stage) when the Albury tower guy transmits, "[callsign] check wheels."
By this stage the Chieftain was at about 100 feet. You think he went round? Nah! That would have been for sissies - apparently!!!
Wheels fell out from everywhere, and the Chieftain continued to land!!!!
As I backtracked the runway for departure, and the Chieftain taxied towards the parking area, I heard the Chieftain driver say "Thanks for that - that could have been embarrassing!".
So come on - who was it? Fess up! I bet he reads these pages!
Hugh Jarse, 404 Titan and Mr. Hat,
I am not an Airbus advocate nor aficionado, but I am reliably informed that the “ECAM” system in the Airbus has an aural and visual gear warning function. I am told that some ECAM software versions has the gear warning armed below 2,000 feet radio altitude, whilst on other software versions it’s armed below 800 feet radio altitude.
Besides the ECAM system, the vast majority of Airbus A320s are also equipped with GPWS, which has a mode 4A aural warning : ”Too low – gear.”
Again, I dunno how the Airbus crew managed it.
Interestingly, the very first A320s to go into service with French airlines were NOT equipped with GPWS. In fact, the GPWS was REMOVED because the French authorities had effectively banned it. This strange, politically motivated decision was soon reversed after the Air Inter A320 disaster.
Oh and Ferris : None of your business.
I saw the Chieftain turning from left base onto final, and as it got a bit closer I got that "What is wrong with this picture?" feeling.
Yep - no wheels!
Fearing that a gutsed Chieftain on the one and only runway might delay my departure somewhat, and out of a sense of civic duty (actually, mainly the former
) I was just about to press the transmit button to suggest that the Chieftain driver might like to consider his career options at this point (the Chieftain was at about 200 feet at this stage) when the Albury tower guy transmits, "[callsign] check wheels."By this stage the Chieftain was at about 100 feet. You think he went round? Nah! That would have been for sissies - apparently!!!
Wheels fell out from everywhere, and the Chieftain continued to land!!!!
As I backtracked the runway for departure, and the Chieftain taxied towards the parking area, I heard the Chieftain driver say "Thanks for that - that could have been embarrassing!".
So come on - who was it? Fess up! I bet he reads these pages!
Hugh Jarse, 404 Titan and Mr. Hat,
I am not an Airbus advocate nor aficionado, but I am reliably informed that the “ECAM” system in the Airbus has an aural and visual gear warning function. I am told that some ECAM software versions has the gear warning armed below 2,000 feet radio altitude, whilst on other software versions it’s armed below 800 feet radio altitude.
Besides the ECAM system, the vast majority of Airbus A320s are also equipped with GPWS, which has a mode 4A aural warning : ”Too low – gear.”
Again, I dunno how the Airbus crew managed it.
Interestingly, the very first A320s to go into service with French airlines were NOT equipped with GPWS. In fact, the GPWS was
REMOVED because the French authorities had effectively banned it. This strange, politically motivated decision was soon reversed after the Air Inter A320 disaster.Oh and Ferris : None of your business.
BIK_116.80
You are quite correct with your information regarding the Airbus ECAM system and GPWS or as we have with about half ours EGPWS. What I was alluding to was I would love to have been a fly on the wall to work out what they did wrong and or what was U/S in their tech log.
You are quite correct with your information regarding the Airbus ECAM system and GPWS or as we have with about half ours EGPWS. What I was alluding to was I would love to have been a fly on the wall to work out what they did wrong and or what was U/S in their tech log.
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BIK116.8
Are you sure you are not telling porkies? Maybe your chieftan story is the correct version?
The go-around (you claim to have witnessed) of the A320 would have generated an Occurrence Report. Colleagues can find no such report. A current A320 driver is extremely sceptical, for various reasons I won't bore you with now. If you want to embellish stories, that's fine. Just as long as others know where you're coming from
The go-around (you claim to have witnessed) of the A320 would have generated an Occurrence Report. Colleagues can find no such report. A current A320 driver is extremely sceptical, for various reasons I won't bore you with now. If you want to embellish stories, that's fine. Just as long as others know where you're coming from
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BIK116.8,
You are half right with the 2000, 800' warning for the gear on the 320. If you go above 2000' then the trigger is at 2000' on descent but if you, say, do a circuit at 1500' then the trigger is 800', which is when the LDG memo will come up on the ECAM.
There is NO WAY you are going to get into an accidental gear up situation on final.
You are half right with the 2000, 800' warning for the gear on the 320. If you go above 2000' then the trigger is at 2000' on descent but if you, say, do a circuit at 1500' then the trigger is 800', which is when the LDG memo will come up on the ECAM.
There is NO WAY you are going to get into an accidental gear up situation on final.
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404 Titan,
Yeah - I would have really loved to have been able to have a chat with the chaps after they had done their laundry to find out WTF went wrong.
The thought did cross my mind that the GPWS might have been U/S. It might have gone U/S on that flight, or it might have been MELed from a previous flight. I think most airline jets can go without GPWS for a couple of days under MEL authority.
But that leaves the ECAM thingie. I am told that the gear warning on the A320 is armed when the aircraft is below a certain radio altitude. It might be a factor that the terrain under the approach path is quite undulating or even hilly. The elevation of the terrain varies from well below the elevation of the touchdown zone to well above it.
But I am just guessing. Again, I’d love to know what happened – or what didn’t happen.
knackeredII,
Thanks for the info about A320 ECAM gear warnings.
“There is NO WAY you are going to get into an accidental gear up situation on final [in an A320].”
I know I wont – I don’t fly ’em! But at least one crew did.
I have spoken to a number of A320 drivers since that day to try to gain an understanding of what might have gone wrong. I can’t figure it out either. Any other Airbus A320 drivers got any ideas?
ferris,
“Are you sure you are not telling porkies?”
What a ridiculous question. Yeah mate – I just made it up to give you the ****s!
“Maybe your chieftan (SIC) story is the correct version?”
Yep – it is ALSO a correct version.
“The go-around (you claim to have witnessed) of the A320 would have generated an Occurrence Report. Colleagues can find no such report.”
Would it? Your mates are not very good researchers then are they!
“A current A320 driver is extremely sceptical…”
Yep – I don’t understand how they managed it either.
“If you want to embellish stories, that's fine. Just as long as others know where you're coming from”
If you want to be a tosser all your life then that’s fine. We all know where you’re coming from.
Yeah - I would have really loved to have been able to have a chat with the chaps after they had done their laundry
to find out WTF went wrong.The thought did cross my mind that the GPWS might have been U/S. It might have gone U/S on that flight, or it might have been MELed from a previous flight. I think most airline jets can go without GPWS for a couple of days under MEL authority.
But that leaves the ECAM thingie. I am told that the gear warning on the A320 is armed when the aircraft is below a certain radio altitude. It might be a factor that the terrain under the approach path is quite undulating or even hilly. The elevation of the terrain varies from well below the elevation of the touchdown zone to well above it.
But I am just guessing. Again, I’d love to know what happened – or what didn’t happen.
knackeredII,
Thanks for the info about A320 ECAM gear warnings.
“There is NO WAY you are going to get into an accidental gear up situation on final [in an A320].”
I know I wont – I don’t fly ’em! But at least one crew did.
I have spoken to a number of A320 drivers since that day to try to gain an understanding of what might have gone wrong. I can’t figure it out either. Any other Airbus A320 drivers got any ideas?
ferris,
“Are you sure you are not telling porkies?”
What a ridiculous question. Yeah mate – I just made it up to give you the ****s!
“Maybe your chieftan (SIC) story is the correct version?”
Yep – it is ALSO a correct version.
“The go-around (you claim to have witnessed) of the A320 would have generated an Occurrence Report. Colleagues can find no such report.”
Would it? Your mates are not very good researchers then are they!
“A current A320 driver is extremely sceptical…”
Yep – I don’t understand how they managed it either.
“If you want to embellish stories, that's fine. Just as long as others know where you're coming from”
If you want to be a tosser all your life then that’s fine. We all know where you’re coming from.