Media *ucking MORONS!!!!!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Ozmate
Posts: 376
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Media *ucking MORONS!!!!!
I could not believe my ears listening to the Channel 7 News tonight regarding airport security!
(Edited because I thought it better not to repeat what these IDIOTS told millions of people tonight.)
In the current security environment this report was reprehensible!
Hope to get some good rating points did we?
Little wonder you morons enjoy the reputation you deserve!!
(Edited because I thought it better not to repeat what these IDIOTS told millions of people tonight.)
In the current security environment this report was reprehensible!
Hope to get some good rating points did we?
Little wonder you morons enjoy the reputation you deserve!!
Last edited by woftam; 24th Nov 2002 at 08:07.
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: The Emerald City of Oz
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hang on a bit woftam, I think, much as I have no cause to love the media, that you might be putting the boot in a bit too soon on this one.
The information was on more news services than just 7 and appears to have come from a media release. I would think that it has been released in the interests of sending a clear message that if you think that the domestic airlines are a soft target and you can get away with putting something nasty on an aircraft you will have to think again.
Think deterrent rather than leak.
The information was on more news services than just 7 and appears to have come from a media release. I would think that it has been released in the interests of sending a clear message that if you think that the domestic airlines are a soft target and you can get away with putting something nasty on an aircraft you will have to think again.
Think deterrent rather than leak.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Ozmate
Posts: 376
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
VictorBravo,
I think you may have watched a different news item to the one I watched.
The message given on the item I watched was exactlly the OPPOSITE!
Hence the concern.
For obvious reasons I won't go in to detail here.
A couple of million people is MORE than enough.
Cheers
I think you may have watched a different news item to the one I watched.
The message given on the item I watched was exactlly the OPPOSITE!
Hence the concern.
For obvious reasons I won't go in to detail here.
A couple of million people is MORE than enough.
Cheers
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Sydney
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As at 2320hrs Sunday Wolfram the report that concerns you is running in all the major daily newspapers to be circulated in Australia on Monday and has appeared on every major TV bulletin on the commercial networks.
Clearly you missed the Prime Minister's appearance on Sunday Sunrise on Sunday morning on which all of the material was made public. For some reason when the PM says something the media reports it.
You represent the major problem the media faces in this country today - people who don't want to know or think they know better than the people who do.
The media does its job, for better or worse, to the best of its ability and limitations. We don't know everything and do get stuff wrong but you'd hate the alternative.
And if you think the alternative might be better find a copy of Paul Lendavai's book Bureaucracy of Truth which details, in part, the Soviet media's cover-up of Aeroflot crashes in the 1970s.
Don't think you'd like it
Clearly you missed the Prime Minister's appearance on Sunday Sunrise on Sunday morning on which all of the material was made public. For some reason when the PM says something the media reports it.
You represent the major problem the media faces in this country today - people who don't want to know or think they know better than the people who do.
The media does its job, for better or worse, to the best of its ability and limitations. We don't know everything and do get stuff wrong but you'd hate the alternative.
And if you think the alternative might be better find a copy of Paul Lendavai's book Bureaucracy of Truth which details, in part, the Soviet media's cover-up of Aeroflot crashes in the 1970s.
Don't think you'd like it
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Ozmate
Posts: 376
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dear Trouser,
That's just bloody wonderfull.
Why don't the media just tell the terrorists everything they need to know?
A little common sense wouldn't go astray!
Have you been living on a different planet?
I don't want to know?
You're kidding right?
I FLY these bloody things you are giving people clues on how to circumvent security on.
WAKE UP MATE!!!!!!
Regards
Wolfram (sic) ...and yes you are!
And yes you are right,I missed the PM's appearance.
Working.
I am the first one to admit that security needs to be beefed up, but why does the media feel the need to expose this vulnerability at this sensitive time?
Maybe an instruction manual next issue?
That's just bloody wonderfull.
Why don't the media just tell the terrorists everything they need to know?
A little common sense wouldn't go astray!
Have you been living on a different planet?
I don't want to know?
You're kidding right?
I FLY these bloody things you are giving people clues on how to circumvent security on.
WAKE UP MATE!!!!!!
Regards
Wolfram (sic) ...and yes you are!
And yes you are right,I missed the PM's appearance.
Working.
I am the first one to admit that security needs to be beefed up, but why does the media feel the need to expose this vulnerability at this sensitive time?
Maybe an instruction manual next issue?
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
A bit like locks, Woftam........"made to keep HONEST people out."
Even as a modest airline pilot, I KNOW that if I REALLY wanted to hijack/do serious damage to an airliner, it would be dead EASY.
The people we have, acting as "security" are a JOKE.
Test: Put a 40cm ceramic knife inside your sports coat/blazer and walk through "security"..................NOTHING.
Now, put a pair of nail clippers in your x-rayed carry on.......and all HELL will break loose.
A JOKE!
There are numerous other examples - some of which I did identify, but have subsequently "scrubbed" - that PROFESSIONAL TERRORISTS are fully aware of..these guys are TRAINED for the position!
The airlines even provide terrorists with key ingredients on board, but the PUBLIC are oblivious.
And that's ALL that matters.
Printing it here, Woftam, will only give the half-wits who AREN'T trained, the chance to be made an example of.
Poor, dumb, f^ckers!
Even as a modest airline pilot, I KNOW that if I REALLY wanted to hijack/do serious damage to an airliner, it would be dead EASY.
The people we have, acting as "security" are a JOKE.
Test: Put a 40cm ceramic knife inside your sports coat/blazer and walk through "security"..................NOTHING.
Now, put a pair of nail clippers in your x-rayed carry on.......and all HELL will break loose.
A JOKE!
There are numerous other examples - some of which I did identify, but have subsequently "scrubbed" - that PROFESSIONAL TERRORISTS are fully aware of..these guys are TRAINED for the position!
The airlines even provide terrorists with key ingredients on board, but the PUBLIC are oblivious.
And that's ALL that matters.
Printing it here, Woftam, will only give the half-wits who AREN'T trained, the chance to be made an example of.
Poor, dumb, f^ckers!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Ozmate
Posts: 376
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For once I agree with you Kaptin.
I too am fully aware of the vulnerabilities in our domain.
The point I am making is WHY do we need to tell every Tom,Dick and Harry at this point in time about them just to sell a few newspapers or whatever.
ANY discussion regarding airport/airline security at this time is a very sensitive issue.
Let's get our house in order BEFORE telling the world where the holes are.
The report I referrred to might as well have been an issue of " terrorism for idiots".
All I am asking of the media is please use a bit of common sense.
It might make a great story,but it might get my a*se blown out of the sky too!
We are not talking censorship here,simply common sense.
Is that too much to ask?
I too am fully aware of the vulnerabilities in our domain.
The point I am making is WHY do we need to tell every Tom,Dick and Harry at this point in time about them just to sell a few newspapers or whatever.
ANY discussion regarding airport/airline security at this time is a very sensitive issue.
Let's get our house in order BEFORE telling the world where the holes are.
The report I referrred to might as well have been an issue of " terrorism for idiots".
All I am asking of the media is please use a bit of common sense.
It might make a great story,but it might get my a*se blown out of the sky too!
We are not talking censorship here,simply common sense.
Is that too much to ask?
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Townsville,Nth Queensland
Posts: 2,717
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mon "Melbourne Age" 25/11/02
Qantas confirms X-ray loophole
November 25 2002
By Andrew Heasley
Transport Reporter
Despite the threat of terrorism to aviation, all baggage on domestic flights is not X-rayed before being loaded on to passenger aircraft, Qantas confirmed yesterday.
The revelation came after Prime Minister John Howard announced on Channel Seven yesterday that the government would soon announce measures to remedy the situation.
Asked if that would mean X-raying all baggage stored in domestic aircraft holds, he said: "We are moving towards that. I can't say it's going to happen overnight because it's a massive operation."
Aviation is not the only sector to face new security measures. Tomorrow Mr Howard will unveil a device to screen shipping containers on the dockside.
A spokesman for federal Transport Minister John Anderson said cabinet was due to consider baggage screening, and the future of the Ansett ticket levy, before the end of the year.
Mr Anderson's spokesman, Paul Chamberlin said international flights would screen all baggage by 2005 in line with international security standards.
Qantas spokeswoman Alison Maxwell said some bags were checked randomly before being loaded on domestic flights, but she did not know if this was done technologically or manually.
But the airline met security regulations laid down by the Transport Department and the company was talking to the government about improving security, she said. "It's the government that regulates what is and isn't done in terms of passenger screening or baggage screening, and we comply fully with their regulations.
"We've been speaking to the government over the past couple of months about a range of enhanced security measures including the screening of checked baggage."
Virgin Blue said it would cooperate with Federal Government's security review.
A Melbourne Airport Corporation spokesman said he would not discuss security measures.
with AAP
Qantas confirms X-ray loophole
November 25 2002
By Andrew Heasley
Transport Reporter
Despite the threat of terrorism to aviation, all baggage on domestic flights is not X-rayed before being loaded on to passenger aircraft, Qantas confirmed yesterday.
The revelation came after Prime Minister John Howard announced on Channel Seven yesterday that the government would soon announce measures to remedy the situation.
Asked if that would mean X-raying all baggage stored in domestic aircraft holds, he said: "We are moving towards that. I can't say it's going to happen overnight because it's a massive operation."
Aviation is not the only sector to face new security measures. Tomorrow Mr Howard will unveil a device to screen shipping containers on the dockside.
A spokesman for federal Transport Minister John Anderson said cabinet was due to consider baggage screening, and the future of the Ansett ticket levy, before the end of the year.
Mr Anderson's spokesman, Paul Chamberlin said international flights would screen all baggage by 2005 in line with international security standards.
Qantas spokeswoman Alison Maxwell said some bags were checked randomly before being loaded on domestic flights, but she did not know if this was done technologically or manually.
But the airline met security regulations laid down by the Transport Department and the company was talking to the government about improving security, she said. "It's the government that regulates what is and isn't done in terms of passenger screening or baggage screening, and we comply fully with their regulations.
"We've been speaking to the government over the past couple of months about a range of enhanced security measures including the screening of checked baggage."
Virgin Blue said it would cooperate with Federal Government's security review.
A Melbourne Airport Corporation spokesman said he would not discuss security measures.
with AAP
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Well it's an IRS nowdays, but the AHRS were fun.
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
And I suppose we will have to stop scotsmen from wearing their kilts in public because they may be concealing an offensive weapon under it?
ABC radio this morning also ran an article about QANTAS not screening checked baggage - where was any mention of VB?
Don't tell me they do it, I doubt it. But not being included in the article, Joe public would probably think they do. Ha what a joke.
Once again the press beats up the tall poppy.
Who's going to pay for this - quoted at $30 a pax - well by the sound of the journo you'ld think he wants QF to cover the cost in the current ticket - dream on.
Mud
Don't tell me they do it, I doubt it. But not being included in the article, Joe public would probably think they do. Ha what a joke.
Once again the press beats up the tall poppy.
Who's going to pay for this - quoted at $30 a pax - well by the sound of the journo you'ld think he wants QF to cover the cost in the current ticket - dream on.
Mud
Join Date: Sep 1998
Location: South Pacific
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"...John Anderson said cabinet was due to consider baggage screening, and the future of the Ansett ticket levy...."
Consider, not revoke. Why cancel a good revenue earner?
I can feel a name change coming on. The Ansett ticket tax to be renamed as the "Torrorist Tax"?
Consider, not revoke. Why cancel a good revenue earner?
I can feel a name change coming on. The Ansett ticket tax to be renamed as the "Torrorist Tax"?
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oztraya
Posts: 354
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Consider, not revoke. Why cancel a good revenue earner?
Govt gave administrators ~$300m and has received ~$120m back from ticket levy, by my calculations that leaves the Govt still in the hole to the tune of about $180m dollars seeing as it has been stated the loan isn't likely to be repaid.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
The following is from The Australian (sorry Wirraway):
Urgent airline security upgrade
By Steve Lewis and Sophie Morris
November 25, 2002
PLANS to upgrade airline security across Australia, including X-raying passenger luggage, will be fast-tracked as part of the federal Government's response to the heightened terrorism alert.
Cabinet also will consider tough new laws allowing suspected terrorists to be deported, even if they hold a valid Australian passport or visa, as part of a crackdown following the Bali bombings.
Plans are under way to tighten screening procedures for baggage on domestic flights, but John Howard warned yesterday this was a massive operation that would not happen overnight.
Qantas and other airlines operating domestic services are known to be concerned over the massive costs of installing security equipment across the nation's airports.
Just days after the Government upgraded its security warnings, the Prime Minister rejected suggestions that Australia was on par with either the US or Israel. And Opposition Leader Simon Crean demanded to be briefed by Mr Howard on a multi-million-dollar advertising campaign aimed at educating the public about the terrorist threat.
The television and radio blitz is expected to be broadcast over the Christmas holidays, but the Prime Minister cautioned against overreaction to threats against Australia. "I really want people to go on living their own lives," he said.
In a sign of Labor's increasing unease about the Government's handling of the security threat, Mr Crean wrote yesterday to Mr Howard claiming it was important for the Opposition to be consulted on the advertising campaign.
While downplaying suggestions that the Coalition was engaged in "scaremongering", Mr Crean said it was important to ensure this was a "genuine effort" to inform the public, rather than a blatant misuse of taxpayers' dollars.
Reading between the lines, it would appear that as the Government is about to embark on an extensive advertising programme prior to the Christmas/New Year break, they are trying to put pressure on the airlines to "come to the party" by installing the x-ray equipment for check-in baggage and cargo.
My guess is the media are being used by the Government to try to lobby public support.
It IS something of a "joke" - but not a funny one - that MORE than 1 year after September 11, the Prime Minister comes out with the statement, "We are moving towards that (x-raying). I can't say it's going to happen overnight because it's a massive operation."
IMHO there is NO reason that it could not be instigated RIGHT NOW.
There are x-ray machines used at all the international airports in Australia, used to scan check-in baggage for some of the overseas carriers such as JAL.
All domestic airlines in Japan scan pax check-in bags (and then place a seal on them) as the pax line up for seat allocation.
I'm not sure how they calculate $30 per passenger - I'd be surprised if it ran out at any more than $1. (It will be the security companies hired by the airlines, who will be responsible for the outlay of the machine.)
Certainly a cheap INVESTMENT, if it stops a suitcase full of explosives being checked in!
Urgent airline security upgrade
By Steve Lewis and Sophie Morris
November 25, 2002
PLANS to upgrade airline security across Australia, including X-raying passenger luggage, will be fast-tracked as part of the federal Government's response to the heightened terrorism alert.
Cabinet also will consider tough new laws allowing suspected terrorists to be deported, even if they hold a valid Australian passport or visa, as part of a crackdown following the Bali bombings.
Plans are under way to tighten screening procedures for baggage on domestic flights, but John Howard warned yesterday this was a massive operation that would not happen overnight.
Qantas and other airlines operating domestic services are known to be concerned over the massive costs of installing security equipment across the nation's airports.
Just days after the Government upgraded its security warnings, the Prime Minister rejected suggestions that Australia was on par with either the US or Israel. And Opposition Leader Simon Crean demanded to be briefed by Mr Howard on a multi-million-dollar advertising campaign aimed at educating the public about the terrorist threat.
The television and radio blitz is expected to be broadcast over the Christmas holidays, but the Prime Minister cautioned against overreaction to threats against Australia. "I really want people to go on living their own lives," he said.
In a sign of Labor's increasing unease about the Government's handling of the security threat, Mr Crean wrote yesterday to Mr Howard claiming it was important for the Opposition to be consulted on the advertising campaign.
While downplaying suggestions that the Coalition was engaged in "scaremongering", Mr Crean said it was important to ensure this was a "genuine effort" to inform the public, rather than a blatant misuse of taxpayers' dollars.
Reading between the lines, it would appear that as the Government is about to embark on an extensive advertising programme prior to the Christmas/New Year break, they are trying to put pressure on the airlines to "come to the party" by installing the x-ray equipment for check-in baggage and cargo.
My guess is the media are being used by the Government to try to lobby public support.
It IS something of a "joke" - but not a funny one - that MORE than 1 year after September 11, the Prime Minister comes out with the statement, "We are moving towards that (x-raying). I can't say it's going to happen overnight because it's a massive operation."
IMHO there is NO reason that it could not be instigated RIGHT NOW.
There are x-ray machines used at all the international airports in Australia, used to scan check-in baggage for some of the overseas carriers such as JAL.
All domestic airlines in Japan scan pax check-in bags (and then place a seal on them) as the pax line up for seat allocation.
I'm not sure how they calculate $30 per passenger - I'd be surprised if it ran out at any more than $1. (It will be the security companies hired by the airlines, who will be responsible for the outlay of the machine.)
Certainly a cheap INVESTMENT, if it stops a suitcase full of explosives being checked in!
Join Date: May 2000
Location: GAFA
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Airlines can x-ray all they like, but a very high percentage of airlines will provide a weapon to any passenger if they ask. When the drinks trolley comes around just ask for a "wine" and you will be given a nice "glass" bottle of wine which in one quick movement can become a weapon.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Ozmate
Posts: 376
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Kaptin,you may well be right that the "media are being used by the Government to try to lobby public support." i.e. who pays?
The big problem I have with what is going on in the media at the moment is that the general public should NOT be told about what security measures are or are not in place at airports under ANY circumstances!
This issue is FAR too important to become a political stunt aided by the media about who pays?
Sort it out in the back rooms boys!!
In the meantime stop telling potential terrorists how best to go about their work you FOOLS!
The big problem I have with what is going on in the media at the moment is that the general public should NOT be told about what security measures are or are not in place at airports under ANY circumstances!
This issue is FAR too important to become a political stunt aided by the media about who pays?
Sort it out in the back rooms boys!!
In the meantime stop telling potential terrorists how best to go about their work you FOOLS!
Last edited by woftam; 25th Nov 2002 at 07:39.
The risk, and now stated by the media, is from suicide bombers.
Suicide bombers are counterable, to an extent, at airports with the heightened security mentioned. With this there is a good risk that a suicide bomber will fail to bring about the level of destruction hoped for in their murderous objective.
A suicide bomber will pick the easy, undefendable and unfoilable civilian targets we see on the news from Israel all to frequently.
Airports are at risk from a number of threats. They are confined spaces with large numbers of people. Not just bombers, look at Rome in the eighties or even the confessions of Martin Bryant.
As unsavoury as it may well be to Australia, police armed with submachine guns may be neccessary additions to airport security, not Chubb guards.
Suicide bombers are counterable, to an extent, at airports with the heightened security mentioned. With this there is a good risk that a suicide bomber will fail to bring about the level of destruction hoped for in their murderous objective.
A suicide bomber will pick the easy, undefendable and unfoilable civilian targets we see on the news from Israel all to frequently.
Airports are at risk from a number of threats. They are confined spaces with large numbers of people. Not just bombers, look at Rome in the eighties or even the confessions of Martin Bryant.
As unsavoury as it may well be to Australia, police armed with submachine guns may be neccessary additions to airport security, not Chubb guards.
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: The Emerald City of Oz
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The problem is that they will always have certain sectors of the community yelping about their "need to know". And I don't mean the media either. You will always have some interest group jumping up and down because the gvt hasn't done x or won't tell them y.
So you tell people nothing and they start to choose not to fly because they are worried about security, and you will have some anti government group yelping because "the Government doesn't care about the security of ordinary Australians", then the conspiracy theorists jump out of the woodwork about "Government cover up because they won't say anything" (and if you think conspiracy theorists are just loonies who would believe anything and aren't worth responding to, have a look at today's articles regarding the use of one of the world's most powerful telescopes just to prove that the Yanks really DID go to the moon).
The sensible mean is that they tell people the most obvious security measures and keep their mouths firmly shut about the ones that they don't want to make public.
Don't you think that the people in the industry who publicly state that there are loopholes to be exploited is more of a worry? Just a thought...
So you tell people nothing and they start to choose not to fly because they are worried about security, and you will have some anti government group yelping because "the Government doesn't care about the security of ordinary Australians", then the conspiracy theorists jump out of the woodwork about "Government cover up because they won't say anything" (and if you think conspiracy theorists are just loonies who would believe anything and aren't worth responding to, have a look at today's articles regarding the use of one of the world's most powerful telescopes just to prove that the Yanks really DID go to the moon).
The sensible mean is that they tell people the most obvious security measures and keep their mouths firmly shut about the ones that they don't want to make public.
Don't you think that the people in the industry who publicly state that there are loopholes to be exploited is more of a worry? Just a thought...
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Ozmate
Posts: 376
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes, your last statement is very much on the mark VictorBravo.
People in the industry should NOT be telling anyone who will listen where the weaknesses may or may not be. And the media should not be broadcasting this.
It's a bit like putting a note on your front door telling everyone the key is under the mat.
STUPIDITY!
All a bit too late now though,everyone who watches TV or buys a paper knows all they wanted to know about airport security but were afraid to ask.
Thanks very much.
While they are at it,why not publish bank vault combinations or a guide to breaking in to cars?
People in the industry should NOT be telling anyone who will listen where the weaknesses may or may not be. And the media should not be broadcasting this.
It's a bit like putting a note on your front door telling everyone the key is under the mat.
STUPIDITY!
All a bit too late now though,everyone who watches TV or buys a paper knows all they wanted to know about airport security but were afraid to ask.
Thanks very much.
While they are at it,why not publish bank vault combinations or a guide to breaking in to cars?
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Guess what??!!
It's not restricted to Australia only!
Watching CNN (the television network for homesick Yanks), I saw a 5 minute programme on the new US laws that will allow pilots to carry guns in the cockpit - except on freighters.
They then went on to film how almost all cargo, except those that had a consignment note stating "General", was NOT x-rayed.
Probably the biggest "joke" was the shot of one of these "inspectors", with a tiny hand held detector that he ran over the outside of the big cargo pallets, trying to determine if any held radioactive materials.
DOH....these terrorists are TRAINED for this sort of stuff (the Yanks admitted, following the war in Afghanistan, that they SERIOUSLY underestimated Al Qaeda's resources), and even I am dumb enough to realise that radioactive material, properly encased, would be easy to conceal from the amateurs employed in the name of "security", by the airlines.
Well, with all this sort of cr@p going to air, it's almost like an invitation to the terrorists to try something over the XMAS/New Year season.
And perhaps a message to travellers to stay at home.
Airlines might see a DROP in pax numbers over December/January, thanks to the clever press!!
It's not restricted to Australia only!
Watching CNN (the television network for homesick Yanks), I saw a 5 minute programme on the new US laws that will allow pilots to carry guns in the cockpit - except on freighters.
They then went on to film how almost all cargo, except those that had a consignment note stating "General", was NOT x-rayed.
Probably the biggest "joke" was the shot of one of these "inspectors", with a tiny hand held detector that he ran over the outside of the big cargo pallets, trying to determine if any held radioactive materials.
DOH....these terrorists are TRAINED for this sort of stuff (the Yanks admitted, following the war in Afghanistan, that they SERIOUSLY underestimated Al Qaeda's resources), and even I am dumb enough to realise that radioactive material, properly encased, would be easy to conceal from the amateurs employed in the name of "security", by the airlines.
Well, with all this sort of cr@p going to air, it's almost like an invitation to the terrorists to try something over the XMAS/New Year season.
And perhaps a message to travellers to stay at home.
Airlines might see a DROP in pax numbers over December/January, thanks to the clever press!!