Same Job Same Pay legislation
Didnt QQ start “Bravo Airlines” on lower condition contracts that in turn screwed the QLD Fokker guys and girls by blocking them from moving onto the Ejet!
But the new S/O’s are working under the exact same EA as the existing S/O’s. You think the FWC going to take the new SO’s off LHEA10 and put them on what??
Even without the new pay scale, an existing 12 year A380 S/O is being paid about 85% more than year 1 380 S/O. It’s not illegal. When either of them take a promotion they will be on the same pay scale as each other for the rest of their Qantas career.
Even without the new pay scale, an existing 12 year A380 S/O is being paid about 85% more than year 1 380 S/O. It’s not illegal. When either of them take a promotion they will be on the same pay scale as each other for the rest of their Qantas career.
Amidst the musings on this, you might just ponder what the concept of same job, same pay will do to seniority scales.
What do employers say?
According to material supporting the ad campaign launched by the business groups:It means by law, employers will have to pay workers with little knowledge or experience exactly the same as workers with decades of knowledge and experience.
It means by law, you cannot earn better pay by working harder or longer, if your colleague does not share your ambition or work ethic
What basis is there for the claim?
The claim that workers with “little knowledge or experience” will be paid the same is extremely unlikely. Both workplace pay deals and awards contain different job classifications and grades so that more experienced workers or those exercising more skill are paid more.The policy is directed at ensuring that people employed by two different methods – labour hire or direct employment – are not paid differently, not that all other distinctions, such as experience, are ignored.
A business lobby/LNP talking point that’s been debunked:
It means by law, employers will have to pay workers with little knowledge or experience exactly the same as workers with decades of knowledge and experience.
It means by law, you cannot earn better pay by working harder or longer, if your colleague does not share your ambition or work ethic
The policy is directed at ensuring that people employed by two different methods – labour hire or direct employment – are not paid differently, not that all other distinctions, such as experience, are ignored.
What do employers say?
According to material supporting the ad campaign launched by the business groups:It means by law, employers will have to pay workers with little knowledge or experience exactly the same as workers with decades of knowledge and experience.
It means by law, you cannot earn better pay by working harder or longer, if your colleague does not share your ambition or work ethic
What basis is there for the claim?
The claim that workers with “little knowledge or experience” will be paid the same is extremely unlikely. Both workplace pay deals and awards contain different job classifications and grades so that more experienced workers or those exercising more skill are paid more.The policy is directed at ensuring that people employed by two different methods – labour hire or direct employment – are not paid differently, not that all other distinctions, such as experience, are ignored.
And I am not talking about the legislation, I am referring to the underpinning concept.
Frankly, addressing a piece of reasoning as a "talking point", and then claiming to debunk it with more "talking points" doesn't evidence much in the way of critical thinking.
Frankly, addressing a piece of reasoning as a "talking point", and then claiming to debunk it with more "talking points" doesn't evidence much in the way of critical thinking.
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I’d guess that there won’t be any change to the 350 or 787 SO pay scales, but it might make a difference to the 380 (possibly 330) SO pay scales and the new vs old rates. Who knows. Those fleets will be gone in 10 years at the most, so not a huge difference or a saving grace for SO salaries unfortunately.
I’d guess that there won’t be any change to the 350 or 787 SO pay scales, but it might make a difference to the 380 (possibly 330) SO pay scales and the new vs old rates. Who knows. Those fleets will be gone in 10 years at the most, so not a huge difference or a saving grace for SO salaries unfortunately.
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EAs which would be in line with legislation that doesn’t say you need to pay a 10 year pilot the same as a 1 year pilot. It says you can’t outsource to a labour hire company to pay a contracted 10 year pilot 50% of a legacy employed 10 year pilot.
What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. There is no doubt the opposition, the business lobby and the media want to kill these new laws, and they’re determined to do whatever it is to bring down the government that implemented them.
What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. There is no doubt the opposition, the business lobby and the media want to kill these new laws, and they’re determined to do whatever it is to bring down the government that implemented them.
And I was not asserting anything, rather I was inviting a bit of critical thinking to be applied (tall order for some, I now know).
That concept, "same job, same pay", coupled with the fact that the award does not contemplate seniority scales for fixed wing operations other than "aerial application operations", might be cause for concern for anyone who actually thinks beyond simply parroting government talking points.
Which part of "I am not talking about the legislation" do you seem to be having a problem with? As I stated, in what I thought was a fairly clear fashion, I was talking about the concept.
And I was not asserting anything, rather I was inviting a bit of critical thinking to be applied (tall order for some, I now know).
That concept, "same job, same pay", coupled with the fact that the award does not contemplate seniority scales for fixed wing operations other than "aerial application operations", might be cause for concern for anyone who actually thinks beyond simply parroting government talking points.
And I was not asserting anything, rather I was inviting a bit of critical thinking to be applied (tall order for some, I now know).
That concept, "same job, same pay", coupled with the fact that the award does not contemplate seniority scales for fixed wing operations other than "aerial application operations", might be cause for concern for anyone who actually thinks beyond simply parroting government talking points.
Originally Posted by neville_nobody
I guess the other question is how does this affect Alliance as they have a different EBA for every state and operation
Didnt QQ start “Bravo Airlines” on lower condition contracts that in turn screwed the QLD Fokker guys and girls by blocking them from moving onto the Ejet!
So how is the Alliance EBA negotiations proceeding?
I guess the other question is how does this affect Alliance as they have a different EBA for every state and operation
Didnt QQ start “Bravo Airlines” on lower condition contracts that in turn screwed the QLD Fokker guys and girls by blocking them from moving onto the Ejet!
So how is the Alliance EBA negotiations proceeding?
Originally Posted by neville_nobody
I guess the other question is how does this affect Alliance as they have a different EBA for every state and operation
Didnt QQ start “Bravo Airlines” on lower condition contracts that in turn screwed the QLD Fokker guys and girls by blocking them from moving onto the Ejet!
So how is the Alliance EBA negotiations proceeding?
I guess the other question is how does this affect Alliance as they have a different EBA for every state and operation
Didnt QQ start “Bravo Airlines” on lower condition contracts that in turn screwed the QLD Fokker guys and girls by blocking them from moving onto the Ejet!
So how is the Alliance EBA negotiations proceeding?
Originally Posted by neville_nobody
I guess the other question is how does this affect Alliance as they have a different EBA for every state and operation
Didnt QQ start “Bravo Airlines” on lower condition contracts that in turn screwed the QLD Fokker guys and girls by blocking them from moving onto the Ejet!
So how is the Alliance EBA negotiations proceeding?
I guess the other question is how does this affect Alliance as they have a different EBA for every state and operation
Didnt QQ start “Bravo Airlines” on lower condition contracts that in turn screwed the QLD Fokker guys and girls by blocking them from moving onto the Ejet!
So how is the Alliance EBA negotiations proceeding?
You f$$$ing muppet.
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Yeah how dare we take the only job available in 2021. We should have kept packing shelves until everyone was ok with us going back to work. How selfish of me to not take the kids out of private school, and throw them into the state sytem, sell both cars, remortgage the house....
You f$$$ing muppet.
You f$$$ing muppet.
If not, mate a word of advise to all the unfortunate Fokker crew that have done so much for QQ for so many years, Think about what type of entitled Di@kneads you will have to fly with on the 190, the above is just an example! Plenty of options out there.
But what would I know I’m just a product of the State school system😉
I’m assuming your taking the piss!!
If not, mate a word of advise to all the unfortunate Fokker crew that have done so much for QQ for so many years, Think about what type of entitled Di@kneads you will have to fly with on the 190, the above is just an example! Plenty of options out there.
But what would I know I’m just a product of the State school system😉
If not, mate a word of advise to all the unfortunate Fokker crew that have done so much for QQ for so many years, Think about what type of entitled Di@kneads you will have to fly with on the 190, the above is just an example! Plenty of options out there.
But what would I know I’m just a product of the State school system😉
One thing I seem to notice about whinging pilots, is they seem to think others with families should be packing shelves instead of flying for what may not be the best EBA going around. But as soon as the shoe is on the other foot, jesus, you’d see them doing the exact same thing…..
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Interesting to see some Qantas Group companies advertising to their outsourced cabin crew (Altara) to ‘bring them in’ to the Group. QF management aren’t the type to offer increased pay and improved conditions for no reason. Same job, Same pay has got them scared.
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