Alliance, Bonza or REX
Whichever one offers you the job in the first place of course, then the basing you want, then balancing progression opportunities against eba provisions/pay that suits you.
You won't get all of that anywhere so weigh up whats important to you.
You don't necessarily need a jet job to get those either.
People will split hairs over the differences or cherry pick scenarios to make one operator or another seem better, but aide from basings and progression just about every mainstream jet operator in oz is as good/bad as the next in the big scheme of things.
You won't get all of that anywhere so weigh up whats important to you.
You don't necessarily need a jet job to get those either.
People will split hairs over the differences or cherry pick scenarios to make one operator or another seem better, but aide from basings and progression just about every mainstream jet operator in oz is as good/bad as the next in the big scheme of things.
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Whichever one offers you the job in the first place of course, then the basing you want, then balancing progression opportunities against eba provisions/pay that suits you.
You won't get all of that anywhere so weigh up whats important to you.
You don't necessarily need a jet job to get those either.
People will split hairs over the differences or cherry pick scenarios to make one operator or another seem better, but aide from basings and progression just about every mainstream jet operator in oz is as good/bad as the next in the big scheme of things.
You won't get all of that anywhere so weigh up whats important to you.
You don't necessarily need a jet job to get those either.
People will split hairs over the differences or cherry pick scenarios to make one operator or another seem better, but aide from basings and progression just about every mainstream jet operator in oz is as good/bad as the next in the big scheme of things.
I’d be going for Alliance. More stable, more certainty.
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I thought Alliance were doing DECs?
Agreed tho, I'd probably go Alliance for the reasons mentioned over a new start up all things otherwise being equal. Not to mention you will be living/based where you actually want to be by the sounds of it.
Agreed tho, I'd probably go Alliance for the reasons mentioned over a new start up all things otherwise being equal. Not to mention you will be living/based where you actually want to be by the sounds of it.
Small low cost carriers, startup or not, are prone to strategy, network, base, employee changes at very short notice. It could be as simple as the local council cutting off subsidies or raising fees at a said base, it’s then closed and families are once again pushed to the wall, been there done that. Fuel jumps, generally people are laid off, fleets cut, aircraft re-leased to other parts of the world. You only need to look at how many employees Tiger pissed off over the years by chopping and changing every 5 mins.
Alliance going anywhere. Rex isn’t likely going anywhere, however likely a bit of a circus in the medium term. Unknown what that place will look like in 5 years.
Virgin’s 737 bases are likely the most ‘safe’ however another circus also.
Alliance going anywhere. Rex isn’t likely going anywhere, however likely a bit of a circus in the medium term. Unknown what that place will look like in 5 years.
Virgin’s 737 bases are likely the most ‘safe’ however another circus also.
Last edited by PoppaJo; 24th Sep 2023 at 23:38.
There’s a good chance your choice won’t work out going by the attrition at Alliance. Can you afford to repay a large bond? How much is the bond at Rex and is it pro-rata? I’d go either of the 737 jobs. If Bonza falls over you won’t have to pay back the bond. You’ll get a job at Rex or Virgin.
These jobs aren’t going away so think of them as stepping stones and if you’re lucky maybe one will actually suit longer term.
These jobs aren’t going away so think of them as stepping stones and if you’re lucky maybe one will actually suit longer term.
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I agree with morno. If the accc won’t allow QF to simply coordinate schedules with China eastern as it’s deemed “an excuse to raise prices” I’d say the Alliance thing is well and truly over. I doubt it will ever be mentioned again.
for me, I’d go to alliance.
for me, I’d go to alliance.
The comment around startups being short lived could raise an interesting possibility. If you're doing a type rating with them, maybe there is a bit of a gamble that if they were to go under, you could end up on the jobs market but with a valuable skillset behind you, one that is much more portable compared to doing a Fokker endorsement.
But yes, there is no objective answer there - you need to consider the factors that are important to you. Do you need/want the security of knowing that you'll have a long-term job with one employer, even if it means not progressing onto bigger and better things for a while? Or do you want to take what may seem a more risky path in the name of progressing quicker? Are you willing to relocate to pursue the opportunity? What is the culture like and how important is that to you? Those are the questions to ask yourself and then use that to get more specific and talk with people who are already flying with those airlines to see which one/s line up.
But yes, there is no objective answer there - you need to consider the factors that are important to you. Do you need/want the security of knowing that you'll have a long-term job with one employer, even if it means not progressing onto bigger and better things for a while? Or do you want to take what may seem a more risky path in the name of progressing quicker? Are you willing to relocate to pursue the opportunity? What is the culture like and how important is that to you? Those are the questions to ask yourself and then use that to get more specific and talk with people who are already flying with those airlines to see which one/s line up.
There's a big difference with the current startups/new owners in the Australian market compared to the budding airlines of past. They are backed by some serious money, Bonza has 777, Rex has PAG, plus it's original investors, Virgin has Bain. Whilst these may be savvy corporate entities that could shut down and break up each airline at a moments notice, they also have the staying power and foresight to keep pumping in capital if they see weakness in any of the competitors for a long haul profit. They would be betting on someone else failing so they can gain serious market share in the Australian domestic market. Any one of those 3 could disappear over night or keep fighting till the cows come home. Alliance is on it's own and was seeking to sell out to QF, what does that say, who knows, are they safe and stable, well, that's a guess at best for any long term bets. In the short term they are doing fine.
I'd take the conditions that offer the best outcome for you and your family, in the long run. Jumping between airlines can cost you seniority and income starting from the bottom each time. Being in a base you don't want to be just for a few extra dollars or a type endorsement can be heavy on the soul and the family. Worrying about whether your airline will be around in 5 years is not worth thinking about, even QF mainline will boot you out in the cold if you are bottom of the seniority list when down times come around, so it's not just about who will go bust.
I'd take the conditions that offer the best outcome for you and your family, in the long run. Jumping between airlines can cost you seniority and income starting from the bottom each time. Being in a base you don't want to be just for a few extra dollars or a type endorsement can be heavy on the soul and the family. Worrying about whether your airline will be around in 5 years is not worth thinking about, even QF mainline will boot you out in the cold if you are bottom of the seniority list when down times come around, so it's not just about who will go bust.
OK so bond costs don’t seem to be significant to you so what about the writing on the wall? So do any of these three outfits have pilots leaving? If so what makes you different and a stayer? I know guys who’ve left all three and for widely different reasons.
Alliance, Bonza or REX
Alliance - look at the rate they’re losing E190 crew. They can’t keep any staff, pilots or otherwise. You have to ask yourself why. Also, as a QF subsidiary, you’re putting the final nail in the coffin of any aspirations to mainline. There’s subsidiary pilots who have been on the hold file for 6+ years with no end in sight. You’re ending your mainline career chances by joining any subsidiary.
Bonza - If you like zero job security, go for it. They’re mixing up their routes already trying to find something profitable. I’m not familiar, do you pay for the endorsement and then they pay it back to you by a return of service? What happens to your out of pocket costs when they go tits up?
Rex - They just made a $45m loss in a period of unprecedented travel demand on the back of bargain basement leasing costs. A third of their turboprops are parked up due to lack of parts and crew. You do the math! You’ll work your guts out only to receive communique from the owner than you’re ”spitting in my face”, and “if it’s too hot in the kitchen, then get out!” You know they make their cadet pilots mow lawns, weed the gardens and write “solemn vows” right?
My opinion - wait for mainline to open again next month. They have huge hiring requirements next few years. You can walk straight into a short haul FO slot if you desire, and you’ll earn significantly more as a shorthaul FO than you will with a command at any of the three airlines above.
Play the long, smart game and ignore your shiny jet syndrome.
In my view the chances of QF being allowed to subsume Alliance any time soon have plunged markedly under the new ACCC chair who seems to mean business with corporations seeking to grow their already large monopolies.
