QF and JQ split
Joined: Nov 2014
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From: Dunnunda
I’d say Qantas Group would be looking at what success Scoot has offering east coast to Europe for $678 return (SYD/MEL to Berlin) if it’s successful, they might have no choice but to respond and compete or surrender Europe bound market share. The idea isn’t foreign to the JQ 787 pilots I’ve spoken with. Not sure about LAX, if there’s no other LCC’s on the route I don’t see why there would be the need for JQ to be involved.
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: Asia
Probably more like what Wesfarmers is doing with Coles, spin it off. Jetstar is really now at the scale and level of profitability where it should be demerged and managed as it’s own.
The only thing stopping that is Qantas is not and has never been in what should be the best interests of shareholders. Especially under the current regime, could not give two hoots about its shareholders. They seem to be more interested in incentivizing each other on how well the pissing contest with Virgin goes.
The only thing stopping that is Qantas is not and has never been in what should be the best interests of shareholders. Especially under the current regime, could not give two hoots about its shareholders. They seem to be more interested in incentivizing each other on how well the pissing contest with Virgin goes.
Joined: Sep 2017
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From: Europe
I hope they go it alone there is no reason JQ couldn't survive without "big brother", they would most likely be better off and so would the crew..
As a total split between the two and them starting to compete with each other? Not a chance. JQ would be toast within weeks without big brother's support.
- There has never been a tangible reported profit from any (offshore) associate AASB128 entity. All of these entities require substantial capital. 'Big brother' provide that. JQ Asia is consolidated under AASB127 into the JQ segment as Qantas claim control. What is very interesting is the structure of their lease obligations. Funding to cover the operating shortfall comes from Qantas NOT Mr Choo (The alleged majority owner) Without capital would these businesses actually survive is a good question.
- JQ is not broken into two operating segments under AASB 8. Management choose to report Qantas this way and despite JQ operating as many aircraft as big brother they refuse the same transparency. Wonder why?
- Any organisation undertaking due diligence on a 'purchase' would be extremely interested in 'materiality thresholds'. These thresholds are internally set by executive management. Such detail is not required to be presented in Consolidated Accounts under AASB 10. Any purchaser would investigate this relationship fully to see who pays for what.
Probably more like what Wesfarmers is doing with Coles, spin it off. Jetstar is really now at the scale and level of profitability where it should be demerged and managed as it’s own.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Apr 2005
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From: Melbourne
I'm guessing it's going to happen as I heard some very large figures being thrown about for the work required to split it. Who knows what will be happen.... it will be interesting to see the outcome.
Joined: Apr 1999
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From: Brisbane
There is NO chance this will happen.
The 2 brands will continue to act in concert as sword and shield. It makes it VERY difficult (especially domestically) for challengers in both the premium and low-cost market segments.
PG
The 2 brands will continue to act in concert as sword and shield. It makes it VERY difficult (especially domestically) for challengers in both the premium and low-cost market segments.
PG
Thread Starter
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From: Melbourne
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: Australia
I suspect what this thread is discussing and what has actually been discussed are two very different things. What Rated De has mentioned in conjunction with an incoming fleet replacement might lead to more accurate conclusions....and the costs involved....you don’t split a golden nugget unless you’re forced to.
Joined: Dec 2007
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From: Australia
I suspect what this thread is discussing and what has actually been discussed are two very different things. What Rated De has mentioned in conjunction with an incoming fleet replacement might lead to more accurate conclusions....and the costs involved....you don’t split a golden nugget unless you’re forced to.
AT
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 183
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From: Alaska
How about it QF START a new subsidiary called Qantas Domestic(TAA) , a brand new Airline with new staff at different pay rates , direct entry crews , would they need to sell JQ to do this , maybe !
would sure ease the training costs in Qantas as they gradually wind down the 737 ops !
would sure ease the training costs in Qantas as they gradually wind down the 737 ops !
Joined: Feb 2018
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From: Wellington
How about it QF START a new subsidiary called Qantas Domestic(TAA) , a brand new Airline with new staff at different pay rates , direct entry crews , would they need to sell JQ to do this , maybe !
would sure ease the training costs in Qantas as they gradually wind down the 737 ops !
would sure ease the training costs in Qantas as they gradually wind down the 737 ops !
Let me see..."different pay rates"..like, pay engineers and pilots less pay in a market where supply is rapidly dwindling?
Winding down 737 ops..oh, that's right, we just got 6 more to fly.
Since when did "creating" a new airline reduce training costs?
Direct entry..from where?? 457 Visas? Of course!!
This isn't Lucerne, the only thing you didn't say was non-unionised labour.
Pfffffttttt.
Joined: Sep 2017
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From: Europe
Could just as readily been planted from Coward street.
With superlatives exhausted, an engineered fight with Canberra airport and a month to run on the FY, a bit of 'froth' for the ASX might help!
Qantas had the opportunity to do just that with an embedded 734 operation, a gift from the Australian taxpayer. 734, crewed by the same already costed pilots, a fresh coat of paint and high density interiors, they had the Low Fare Airline almost ready to fly.
Instead what they preferred was an entire greenfield operation, all designed to lever downwards terms and conditions.
With superlatives exhausted, an engineered fight with Canberra airport and a month to run on the FY, a bit of 'froth' for the ASX might help!
How about it QF START a new subsidiary called Qantas Domestic(TAA) , a brand new Airline with new staff at different pay rates , direct entry crews , would they need to sell JQ to do this , maybe !
would sure ease the training costs in Qantas as they gradually wind down the 737 ops !
would sure ease the training costs in Qantas as they gradually wind down the 737 ops !
Instead what they preferred was an entire greenfield operation, all designed to lever downwards terms and conditions.
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 258
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From: Wellington
Could just as readily been planted from Coward street.
With superlatives exhausted, an engineered fight with Canberra airport and a month to run on the FY, a bit of 'froth' for the ASX might help!
Qantas had the opportunity to do just that with an embedded 734 operation, a gift from the Australian taxpayer. 734, crewed by the same already costed pilots, a fresh coat of paint and high density interiors, they had the Low Fare Airline almost ready to fly.
Instead what they preferred was an entire greenfield operation, all designed to lever downwards terms and conditions.
With superlatives exhausted, an engineered fight with Canberra airport and a month to run on the FY, a bit of 'froth' for the ASX might help!
Qantas had the opportunity to do just that with an embedded 734 operation, a gift from the Australian taxpayer. 734, crewed by the same already costed pilots, a fresh coat of paint and high density interiors, they had the Low Fare Airline almost ready to fly.
Instead what they preferred was an entire greenfield operation, all designed to lever downwards terms and conditions.
Yawn.
Joined: Sep 2017
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From: Europe
- Think 457 Visa
- Jetconnect in VH registered aircraft
- Network to operate A320
- Comfort letters from Unions (sarc is off)
Contract season anyone?
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 330
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From: Australia
Even if the company was trying to manufacture some leverage I'm not sure pilots in general would place any weight on it...in any company. Its simple, people will move to the position that gives that individual the best lifestyle proposition and in times of a pilot shortage, in Qantas at least, that means pilots will spend minimal time on a type they consider inferior. So manufactured crisis or not, it's going to take a genuine downturn for this structural predicament to return to equilibrium. Perhaps, there is a better way? At the moment I'm not sure many people care if the can is kicked down the road. More pay and/or more promotion. It's really simple and the industrial relation teams have their work cut out for themselves.
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 342
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From: Darwin
That would make sense to the arseclowns running this outfit. Expand something that has never made a dollar of profit. Bravo.
Joined: Sep 2017
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From: Europe
JQ isn't reported as two Operating Segments for a reason. Any guess why?
Qantas management chose to report QF Domestic and QF International as two operating segments as permitted in AASB 8. At the time the narrative of 'terminal decline' was their industrial play. Showing just how 'bad' Qantas International was suited their purpose. JQ International does not make any money and likely is nowhere close to the Quantitative threshold to ever be exposed. It was after all JQ CEO Mr Buchanan who tried to tell the board JQ International was a wreck. He was promptly shown the door.
Mr Joyce has a carefully constructed hero myth, with JQ the centre piece. His ego needs it. To actually expose JQ to further scrutiny adding aircraft is not something they will allow. For an airline flying 48% of the ASK of Qantas, yet only capable of delivering 22% of the revenue, more air frames makes complete sense from an industrial perspective, but is nuts from an economic perspective.
JQ International is luckily hidden in the JQ 'group' segment, quietly being supported from Coward Street. Of course not illegal, but the less scrutiny the better