Australia, New Zealand & the Pacific Airline and RPT Rumours & News in Australia, enZed and the Pacific

Perth to London

Old 14th Apr 2018, 06:26
  #281 (permalink)  
 
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In the day, Qantas had more presence at Changi than any other foreign operator. I often wonder where it went wrong. Did the genii in the "Public Service" in Canberra cede too much to the ME3? I suggest that the benefits they bring to Australia are illusory.
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Old 14th Apr 2018, 07:48
  #282 (permalink)  
 
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In the day, Qantas had more presence at Changi than any other foreign operator. I often wonder where it went wrong. Did the genii in the "Public Service" in Canberra cede too much to the ME3? I suggest that the benefits they bring to Australia are illusory.
An astute observation.
Government data (on passenger numbers ex Australia) shows a very abrupt decline when Qantas exited Singapore. To understand what the airlines flying through Hong Kong, Thailand and Singapore thought of Qantas' "advance to the rear" abandoning Asia, have a look at the additional services they put only following April 1.

Is it likely that due real hard crew limits, the Perth London is beyond the reach to be a sustainable reliable service?

In that event, should a London winter kill the schedule integrity, expect the Melbourne, Perth to London service to quietly go through Singapore and the service be scaled back to non-existent.

Staggering the loss of patronage, Operating Revenue and footprint Qantas surrendered for little Napoleon's five year random walk through Dubai.
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Old 14th Apr 2018, 08:19
  #283 (permalink)  
 
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I wouldn’t say loss of patronage. Having looked at loads out of Singapore most flights are pretty full as are those out of Perth. Chatting to several different customers on way up to London and most were upset they couldn’t get on the 9/10 out of/to Perth. They see the one stop on the West Coast as a great advance, which to be honest surprised me but they are the paying public not the PPRuNe experts.
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Old 14th Apr 2018, 08:27
  #284 (permalink)  
 
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They see the one stop on the West Coast as a great advance, which to be honest surprised me but they are the paying public not the PPRuNe experts.

For Qantas the service is a welcome change from the continued advance to the rear. Just so you are to clear to what we are referring to, the (Australian Government) BITRE data set shows the passengers ex Australia for all carriers. You can count them up yourself, suffice to say what Qantas surrendered, the others enjoyed carrying, particularly Emirates.

A daily service of a 787 needs to operate successfully on this route given the limitations specified, 1,652 times to make up the loss of passengers Qantas dealt itself in the first year of the Emirates 'Alliance'.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 03:34
  #285 (permalink)  
 
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Qantas confirmed it is in “discussion with Perth Airport about a seasonal service to South Africa” and is “keen to expand” its “western hub concept with new destinations” (The West, 24-Apr-2018). Qantas and Perth Airport are reportedly at an impasse over a planned Perth-Johannesburg service, with the carrier wanting to use its international T3 operation and the airport wanting the airline to use the existing T1 international terminal. Qantas reportedly intends to operate a four times weekly service from 07-Dec-2018 to Apr-2019, using A330-200 equipment. Qantas stated the integration of its domestic and international operations at Perth Airport’s T3 has been “very successful so far” for its service to London Heathrow.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 04:32
  #286 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by topend3 View Post
Qantas confirmed it is in “discussion with Perth Airport about a seasonal service to South Africa” and is “keen to expand” its “western hub concept with new destinations” (The West, 24-Apr-2018). Qantas and Perth Airport are reportedly at an impasse over a planned Perth-Johannesburg service, with the carrier wanting to use its international T3 operation and the airport wanting the airline to use the existing T1 international terminal. Qantas reportedly intends to operate a four times weekly service from 07-Dec-2018 to Apr-2019, using A330-200 equipment. Qantas stated the integration of its domestic and international operations at Perth Airport’s T3 has been “very successful so far” for its service to London Heathrow.

What!? Perth Airport Management can’t be serious?

The whole idea behind the integrated QF facility is to offer seamless transfers for QF pax between international and domestic, until PAPL pull their fingers out and build an adequate facility for Qantas to move into.(circa 2025... and this is Oz, so we can safely say they’re already about two years behind schedule and they haven’t even started)

Airport management are willing to have Qantas abandon a bit of extra growth for what? And what of potential services elsewhere, (Paris/Frankfurt/etc) is the same idiocy going to occur again?

Utterly astonishing.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 08:56
  #287 (permalink)  
 
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Perhaps Perth would rather put their money into common user facilities that all carriers can use, thus maximising their ROI, rather than facilities that only one carrier can use, and will lie idle if said carrier changes it's mind in the future.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 10:07
  #288 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ruprecht View Post
It’s a fuel efficient 767.
you mustn't be well advised to say a B787 is anywhere related to a B767, a lot has changed since the 767 friend🤖
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 11:38
  #289 (permalink)  
 
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Major Australian airports have long standardised on separate International and Domestic terminals, as far apart as they can be, on opposite sides of the runways, with journeys of maybe several miles between them, and with no efficient means of getting between the two. It's like airport master planners have never been told by the airlines about transfer passengers.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 12:01
  #290 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by WHBM View Post
Major Australian airports have long standardised on separate International and Domestic terminals, as far apart as they can be, on opposite sides of the runways, with journeys of maybe several miles between them, and with no efficient means of getting between the two. It's like airport master planners have never been told by the airlines about transfer passengers.
True, except ADL, MEL, BNE, DRW, and in the future, Perth. So I guess you are only referring to SYD.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 12:08
  #291 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Capn Bloggs View Post
True, except ADL, MEL, BNE, DRW, and in the future, Perth. So I guess you are only referring to SYD.
BNE has separate International and Domestic terminals with several miles between them.

Interestingly on my last trip through Sydney, I was pleased to see that Sydney has finally joined the rest of the world in providing a means of free transfers between the international and domestic terminals, instead of that rip off bus service they used to charge for.

morno
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 12:17
  #292 (permalink)  
 
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Garbage Morno! It's 2.2km and there's a free bus every 10 minutes during the day! FFS...
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 12:53
  #293 (permalink)  
 
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Well then I guess Sydney is just as good then!
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 13:13
  #294 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Traffic_Is_Er_Was View Post
Perhaps Perth would rather put their money into common user facilities that all carriers can use, thus maximising their ROI, rather than facilities that only one carrier can use, and will lie idle if said carrier changes it's mind in the future.
Perhaps they should do so then, and once said facilities exist, Qantas can move. Until then, Qantas has dropped millions ($20/30 million?), along with the WA taxpayer($14 million) on their facility on the Western side of the Airport. Let them maximise the ROI on that, while the potential and the desire exists, so they’re far less likely to change their mind in the future once the move across to T1 needs to be made.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 17:15
  #295 (permalink)  
 
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But Qantas don't want to move. That's the problem Perth is having. QF want it all under their roof, with their branding etc. Fine. Trouble is, the more they spend on setting that up, the harder it is to get them out later. I would also imagine that Perth do not want a "Qantas Airport" being established on their airport. There's no money in that for them.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 17:37
  #296 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by WHBM View Post
Major Australian airports have long standardised on separate International and Domestic terminals, as far apart as they can be, on opposite sides of the runways, with journeys of maybe several miles between them, and with no efficient means of getting between the two. It's like airport master planners have never been told by the airlines about transfer passengers.
Probably because when just about all of the major ports were being designed, there were hardly any international pax into and out of anywhere but SYD. There were also only two domestic airlines flying, neither of which had an international arm, and who usually had a dedicated end each of a common domestic terminal, or their own terminal. There were also very strict regs on what types of operations could occur on aprons and in buildings gazetted for international operations. It was probably easier just to separate them.
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Old 27th Apr 2018, 22:46
  #297 (permalink)  
 
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Perth originally was supposed to have one common user U shaped terminal with another runway however they never got around to building any of that despite forecasting ever increasing passenger and movements.. Now they are creating a rod for own back as QF take matters into their own hands. Airports in Australia have zero right to complain about anything they have had forever to build adequate infrastructure but there's always an excuse why it can't happen. It's the same story all over the country.
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Old 28th Apr 2018, 00:30
  #298 (permalink)  
 
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But Qantas don't want to move. That's the problem Perth is having
.
I don’t think this is the case at all. Qantas can’t move at the moment. There is nothing under construction for them to move into, and as I said it’s years away at this stage, even if the planning started tomorrow.

Qantas is trying to avoid the inconvenience of transiting customers having to take a bus across the airport. They have taken matters into their own hands because the inept Perth Arport management have failed on their part, yet Qantas are ready to grow their international business out of Perth again. Eventually they will outgrow the facility on the western side of the airport and need to move, but probably not if Perth Airport carry on hindering the introduction of new services. The Airport Management are shooting themselves in the foot here.
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Old 28th Apr 2018, 08:22
  #299 (permalink)  
 
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The "inept Perth Airport Managment" haven't failed at anything. When negotiations began, QF had not committed to the PER-LHR service, let alone any others. QF were trying to sell a sh*t sandwich (5hrs to PER before your 17hr flight to LHR) to the rest of the country as A GOOD THING, so the illusion that it was all one seamless flight was a major deal. PER has an International Terminal, and QF were happy to use it before. When PER stuck to their guns about the expense of modifying the Domestic for 1 potential QF service (and no firm commitments to any others), QF played the "Ohh, think of the lost jobs and tourism" card which the WA Govt fell for hook, line and sinker. So QF get what they want, they've moved their other International services out of the existing International terminal across to their own, so now they are completely self contained. All this just for a promise to move over to the International in 2025. Of course PER aren't building another Terminal yet. Why would they? QF are sitting tight for another 7 years. And do you think they will move even then, especially if they have began other destinations? They will be too entrenched. QF9 is mainly Domestic pax MEL-PER, and that could have been accommodated at the international (like QF do at all the other airports). QF had a few transits, which the existing International could have dealt with easily. QF's issue is that most join in PER (ie locals, so the transfers are irrelevant), or have to go to PER on other QF services and transfer, and that's what they are trying to pretend isn't happening. QF could have had much the same outcome, and saved themselves and the WA tax payers millions. But it was the "Gamechanger" after all.
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Old 28th Apr 2018, 08:36
  #300 (permalink)  
 
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It's not called the "State of Wait Awhile" for nothing!
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