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An important MSG to my fellow JETCONNECT pilots.

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An important MSG to my fellow JETCONNECT pilots.

Old 24th Jan 2018, 06:22
  #101 (permalink)  
 
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Last edited by help me jebus; 26th Jun 2019 at 00:32.
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 06:40
  #102 (permalink)  
 
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What pilots get paid in Aussie has SFA to do with what the pilots at Jetconnect get paid.

How their pay and conditions compare to pilots doing similar jobs (Virgin, Air NZ Jetstar etc), in New Zealand is what matters.

You need to be comparing apple with apples. They are New Zealand pilots employed in New Zealand on a New Zealand contract.

I think Aussie pilots need to realise that by and large they get paid better than in most other parts of the world. Good on you for being able to achieve that, but just because you get paid well it doesn't translate that your conditions will automatically flow into other jurisdictions.

One of Ansett New Zealand's downfalls was the generous salary packages they brought with them to New Zealand from Australia.
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 07:00
  #103 (permalink)  
 
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Comparing Apples with Apples

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Last edited by help me jebus; 26th Jun 2019 at 00:30.
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 07:39
  #104 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
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Thatís utter crap 27/09.
How many hours do you fly is what should be asked. Productivity? Hours at work? Duty? Qf short haul is probably double the duty or more for equivalent flight time than Jetconnect. Flying at the moment is woefully inefficient. 4 sector days 6 hours pay 12 hours duty for example is not uncommon. Total Package for some very hard working Captains on the 737 is north of $400k. For that 1000 (Flight) hours/yr and duty in the order of at least on average 180hrs/28 days. In other words 18-20 days at work per 28 day roster. Most will earn around 280-300k/yr. Of course at least 35% goes to the government unless you can write it off!
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 07:57
  #105 (permalink)  
 
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Consumer Prices in Sydney are 4.91% higher than in Auckland
Consumer Prices Including Rent in Sydney are 19.14% higher than in Auckland
Rent Prices in Sydney are 47.80% higher than in Auckland
Restaurant Prices in Sydney are 7.09% higher than in Auckland
Groceries Prices in Sydney are 8.04% higher than in Auckland
I agree with 27/09
Apples with Oranges.
A valid comparison is with Air NZ A320, Virgin NZ, and Jetstar NZ
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 08:08
  #106 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Jetconnect: The Aussie Apple in NZ

Jetconnect doesnít operate anywhere else ex NZ but Australia on routes that used to be operated solely from Australia with flights that still technically originate from Australia as per the schedule and branded as being Australian.

So if you want to compare the Jetconnect Apple with Apples of a similar type then you need to compare it to all the other contracts that QF pays to do its bidding no matter how rotten they may be (You see what I did there).
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 08:52
  #107 (permalink)  
 
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How many hours in the seat for the money? Itís not that hard.
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 20:07
  #108 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Popgun View Post
I don't have a dog in the fight but I think 'exploitation' is a bit of a stretch.

But when suitable staff can be found for the conditions on offer in a free, democratised country then that is a definition of a market rate.

PG
'Suitable' is a relative term. I would suggest that 90% of 'suitable' pilots join Air NZ/Qantas and stay until retirement. At Jetconnect it would be lucky to be 5%. The high level of churn is not good for maintaining experience levels and quite frankly I think Qantas customers want experience. Look after your staff and your staff will look after your customers.
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Old 24th Jan 2018, 21:58
  #109 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Popgun View Post
I don't have a dog in the fight but I think 'exploitation' is a bit of a stretch.

Are the remuneration and associated conditions below par? Absolutely, no question. But when suitable staff can be found for the conditions on offer in a free, democratised country then that is a definition of a market rate.

PG
Hi PG, I think your definition of ďmarket rateĒ is too simplistic. The market itself is rigged! Itís not a free market and democracy has very little to say about it.

QF can set a substandard offer because there has been a systematic attack over the last decade or so both in NZ and Aust on the legal options for workers to organise and withhold their labour. NZ and Aust are both in contravention of International Labour Organisation Convention no.87 which permit industry wide sympathy industrial action. Also, both countries have made it illegal to withhold labour outside a small legally defined window, again in contravention of the ILO.

You have to ask yourself why wage growth is at a historical low while executive renumeration is at an all time high... I think workers in general are being exploited by this manipulation of the ďmarket rateĒ.
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 04:04
  #110 (permalink)  
 
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Well whatever they end up with will be the market rate but the market in question is certainly a long way away from the concept of a free market. People who espouse the benefits of a free market normally don’t acknowledge that they rarely if ever exist.
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Old 24th Apr 2019, 18:38
  #111 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
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Can anyone give any insight to how things are going with the new CEA? I am looking at shortly applying to both Jetconnect and Virgin and just wnt to make the best educated decision if I was fortunate enough to be offered something by both parties (coming from a regional turboprop background with what will be a very long wait for any jet progression with current company)....
is JC inevitably going to be absorbed into mainline? And is job/career security an issue within the forseeable future with these changes?
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Old 25th Apr 2019, 11:12
  #112 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
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JC exists purely and simply as an instrument of industrial convenience designed to reduce labour cost.

Until recently the AOC was held as it was believed to be necessary to keep the party going. As soon as the winds of opinion swung the other way it was gone.

Why would you think the labour hire shell that now exists would be any different?

Not saying donít work there, just be realistic about the situation. You are a mercenary, extract appropriate benefit.
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Old 25th Apr 2019, 13:44
  #113 (permalink)  
 
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So in future, any Australian pilot looking to join direct entry on jets with Qantas or Virgin, will need to move overseas?
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Old 25th Apr 2019, 14:48
  #114 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Gligg View Post
So in future, any Australian pilot looking to join direct entry on jets with Qantas or Virgin, will need to move overseas?
Err, no?
This thread is about Jetconnect in NZ, not Qantas or Virgin in Australia.
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Old 25th Apr 2019, 22:36
  #115 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
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Originally Posted by Arthur D View Post
JC exists purely and simply as an instrument of industrial convenience designed to reduce labour cost.

Until recently the AOC was held as it was believed to be necessary to keep the party going. As soon as the winds of opinion swung the other way it was gone.

Why would you think the labour hire shell that now exists would be any different?

Not saying donít work there, just be realistic about the situation. You are a mercenary, extract appropriate benefit.
so basically your saying take the job for what it is.. A jet job within NZ with potentially quicker commands than other places and earning a good enough wage to support a modest lifestyle?
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Old 26th Apr 2019, 11:17
  #116 (permalink)  
 
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Err, no?
This thread is about Jetconnect in NZ, not Qantas or Virgin in Australia.

Aren't they intertwined? I was referring to the fact that a direct entry jet job at virgin oz these days goes through nz, and that if JC merge seniority with Qantas mainline, the same would likely be the case for joining Qantas.
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Old 26th Apr 2019, 11:25
  #117 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
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Yep - get in, get what you want / need, get out.

I would be careful about holding delusions of a career, however if you do hang around, be prepared.
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Old 26th Apr 2019, 14:38
  #118 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Arthur D View Post
Yep - get in, get what you want / need, get out.

I would be careful about holding delusions of a career, however if you do hang around, be prepared.
Some have been holding these delusions for 16 years, any day now......
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Old 26th Apr 2019, 18:20
  #119 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Gligg View Post
Err, no?
This thread is about Jetconnect in NZ, not Qantas or Virgin in Australia.

Aren't they intertwined? I was referring to the fact that a direct entry jet job at virgin oz these days goes through nz, and that if JC merge seniority with Qantas mainline, the same would likely be the case for joining Qantas.
Except they arenít.
Virgin is Virgin, Qantas is Qantas and Jetconnect is Jetconnect (in Qantas colours)
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Old 27th Apr 2019, 10:45
  #120 (permalink)  
 
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Tank, I hope you're right.
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