Qantas looks at B777-8 for NYC nonstops
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Qantas looks at B777-8 for NYC nonstops
Qantas looks into Boeing 777-8 | Aviation Gazette
Qantas has its eye on non-stop Sydney to New York flights using the advanced Boeing 777-8X jetliner, which the airline has touted as a potential replacement for its flagship Airbus A380 superjumbo.
The direct route would swap the long-standing Los Angeles stopover for a 19 hour ‘Harbour Bridge to Hudson’ trek, which would not only be Qantas’ longest flight but the world’s longest.
But it will require the next-generation of aircraft due in the early part of the next decade, when Qantas will look to refresh its long-range international fleet.
Speaking at a media lunch in Sydney last week, Qantas Airways CEO Alan Joyce revealed that the airline “puts 300 people a day to New York anyway, so the market’s growing – it’s just that we can’t do (non-stop) with the technology (we have today).
“Once the technology happens we would go there straight away” Joyce told Australian Business Traveller.
“We’re looking at the new 777-8X that would potentially have the range to do it, but that doesn’t come until (the early) 2020s.”
Qantas already plans to begin flying the smaller Boeing 787-9 from late 2017 but the Boeing 777-8X is very much under consideration.
“We’ve got people that work with Boeing and Airbus – we have worked (together) on the A380, we did a lot of work with the 787 (and) we’re doing work with them on the 777(-8X),” Joyce said.
When asked if there was really a market for passengers willing to take such a long flight, Qantas International CEO Gareth Evans gave an unequivocal “yes”.
“It might not be for everybody,” Evans continues. “If you don’t want to do that then there are plenty of opportunities to connect over Dallas or LA, but there will be a market of people who want to get on the plane and get off where their ultimate destination is.”
Evans also highlights that on a route this long, the aircraft needs to be “configured appropriately”, with a “premium configuration” currently under assessment, paired with “the right amount of galley space” to store and prepare what could become three inflight meals for each passenger.
“It’s going to have to have the ability to look after customers for long amounts of time… (and) the technology that’s coming with the 777-X can facilitate that, absolutely; we’d want to fly it.”
Ultra-long flights: the new norm
Joyce takes a page out of history when looking to the future of flying, noting that Qantas’ flights from Sydney to Vancouver in 1954 detoured via Fiji, Hawaii and San Francisco, which meant a total of 31 hours spent flying in between, but with the stops helping to break up the time.
“Back then, people were saying ‘imagine flying direct – that would be too long on an aircraft for 14 hours’”, Joyce continues, “yet now people would never do those kinds of (routings) with today’s aircraft.”
Would passengers really want to fly non-stop?
Passengers on today’s Qantas Sydney-New York flights break the journey at LAX with 1hr 55m between touchdown and take-off, during which they can stretch their legs and squeeze in a quick shower in the lounge before completing their 21hr journey.
Eliminating that stop would bring the trip closer to 19 hours, but that’s still 3.5 hours longer than today’s Sydney-Dallas/Fort Worth run.
Singapore Airlines is also eying non-stop flights to New York from its home hub in 2018 using a special long-range version of the Airbus A350.
Those long-legged A350s will also carry fewer passengers than the conventional A350 which SQ will begin flying in January 2015, but they’ll enjoy more comfort thanks to all-new business and first class seating.
The direct route would swap the long-standing Los Angeles stopover for a 19 hour ‘Harbour Bridge to Hudson’ trek, which would not only be Qantas’ longest flight but the world’s longest.
But it will require the next-generation of aircraft due in the early part of the next decade, when Qantas will look to refresh its long-range international fleet.
Speaking at a media lunch in Sydney last week, Qantas Airways CEO Alan Joyce revealed that the airline “puts 300 people a day to New York anyway, so the market’s growing – it’s just that we can’t do (non-stop) with the technology (we have today).
“Once the technology happens we would go there straight away” Joyce told Australian Business Traveller.
“We’re looking at the new 777-8X that would potentially have the range to do it, but that doesn’t come until (the early) 2020s.”
Qantas already plans to begin flying the smaller Boeing 787-9 from late 2017 but the Boeing 777-8X is very much under consideration.
“We’ve got people that work with Boeing and Airbus – we have worked (together) on the A380, we did a lot of work with the 787 (and) we’re doing work with them on the 777(-8X),” Joyce said.
When asked if there was really a market for passengers willing to take such a long flight, Qantas International CEO Gareth Evans gave an unequivocal “yes”.
“It might not be for everybody,” Evans continues. “If you don’t want to do that then there are plenty of opportunities to connect over Dallas or LA, but there will be a market of people who want to get on the plane and get off where their ultimate destination is.”
Evans also highlights that on a route this long, the aircraft needs to be “configured appropriately”, with a “premium configuration” currently under assessment, paired with “the right amount of galley space” to store and prepare what could become three inflight meals for each passenger.
“It’s going to have to have the ability to look after customers for long amounts of time… (and) the technology that’s coming with the 777-X can facilitate that, absolutely; we’d want to fly it.”
Ultra-long flights: the new norm
Joyce takes a page out of history when looking to the future of flying, noting that Qantas’ flights from Sydney to Vancouver in 1954 detoured via Fiji, Hawaii and San Francisco, which meant a total of 31 hours spent flying in between, but with the stops helping to break up the time.
“Back then, people were saying ‘imagine flying direct – that would be too long on an aircraft for 14 hours’”, Joyce continues, “yet now people would never do those kinds of (routings) with today’s aircraft.”
Would passengers really want to fly non-stop?
Passengers on today’s Qantas Sydney-New York flights break the journey at LAX with 1hr 55m between touchdown and take-off, during which they can stretch their legs and squeeze in a quick shower in the lounge before completing their 21hr journey.
Eliminating that stop would bring the trip closer to 19 hours, but that’s still 3.5 hours longer than today’s Sydney-Dallas/Fort Worth run.
Singapore Airlines is also eying non-stop flights to New York from its home hub in 2018 using a special long-range version of the Airbus A350.
Those long-legged A350s will also carry fewer passengers than the conventional A350 which SQ will begin flying in January 2015, but they’ll enjoy more comfort thanks to all-new business and first class seating.
Nunc est bibendum
They probably asked the same question about SIN- LHR, SYD- LAX, and DFW- SYD once upon a time too. This will be a regular occurrence within a decade I reckon.
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New planes and new routes, wouldn't that be great.
But in my honest opinion I reckon they will find an airline that already has the planes, and flies the route, and codeshare with them.
But in my honest opinion I reckon they will find an airline that already has the planes, and flies the route, and codeshare with them.
But in my honest opinion I reckon they will find an airline that already has the planes, and flies the route, and codeshare with them.
the little mathematician who runs Qantas has asked Boeing if they can increase the range of that model to operate that route.
I bet they're thinking, '20yrs of 777 operations, and you Pr&%#s haven't bought any of them, and now you want us to spend another few million tweaking a model thats not even flying yet so you might consider buying some?'
Theres something Dixon-esque about that rumour! (remember the 'give me the 787-10 or I'll go elsewhere…'?!)
Similar considerations to the Perth - London non stop with the B787 which was put forward a few months ago. Misery in economy if they use a 10 across configuration. Expensive to operate with the increased fuel burn compared to an enroute top up and increased crewing requirements.
Emirates can do Sydney - New York one stop via Dubai with lower costs involved and can pass the savings on with lower fares.
However Sydney and New York have much higher potential traffic than PER - LON including more of the lucrative business travel market. A flight with First, Business and Premium Economy rather than regular Economy, at a reasonable cost over a connecting flight could be an attractive proposition.
Emirates can do Sydney - New York one stop via Dubai with lower costs involved and can pass the savings on with lower fares.
However Sydney and New York have much higher potential traffic than PER - LON including more of the lucrative business travel market. A flight with First, Business and Premium Economy rather than regular Economy, at a reasonable cost over a connecting flight could be an attractive proposition.
SYD-DXB-JFK vs SYD-LAX-JFK flight times?
The cheap ones are probably via Milan etc. Long trip to nyc
The cheap ones are probably via Milan etc. Long trip to nyc
soon to return with an a350 i hear?
They say they're looking at it again alright, maybe a big twin will make it more successful, although the current fuel prices are pretty much what the A340 was designed for!
Back when the A380s were ordered the first ten were 47% of the list price and 10 A330s were thrown in for free! Obviously QF are waiting for Boeing to offer something similar. Unlikely!
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Nothing quite like talking up your book about things that might happen in ten years time to direct the shareholders' gaze away from the holes in the Swiss cheese. Joyce cannot keep the current schedules operating with the 380's and 400's taking more than normal sick leave.
Suggest Joyce picks up some second hand A345's and get cracking immediately. I think Thai have some on the market as their BKK-NYC non-stop was a money loser. Save on crew training as you can CCQ with the 330.
Also there are the 100X 320 neos coming down the pike.....where are they going?
Suggest Joyce picks up some second hand A345's and get cracking immediately. I think Thai have some on the market as their BKK-NYC non-stop was a money loser. Save on crew training as you can CCQ with the 330.
Also there are the 100X 320 neos coming down the pike.....where are they going?
Suggest Joyce picks up some second hand A345's and get cracking immediately. I think Thai have some on the market as their BKK-NYC non-stop was a money loser.
I hear there is some talk about a B777-8 and B737 MAX combo meal deal? Are Boeing a bit concerned the QF domestic fleet might go A320/321 NEO in the years to come and would like to lock in Boeing as the premium product for the QF group?
Perhaps we might even see the JQ 787's coming to mainline to replace domestic A330's and then JQ go A350's? QF all Boeing. JQ all Airbus?
Perhaps we might even see the JQ 787's coming to mainline to replace domestic A330's and then JQ go A350's? QF all Boeing. JQ all Airbus?
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Evans also highlights that on a route this long, the aircraft needs to be “configured appropriately”, with a “premium configuration” currently under assessment, paired with “the right amount of galley space” to store and prepare what could become three inflight meals for each passenger.
Bu99er the food! How many crew-members and shifts would you need?????