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Air Niugini's subsidiary - LINK PNG

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Air Niugini's subsidiary - LINK PNG

Old 3rd May 2019, 07:32
  #1381 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Cairns
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*************THE END************
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Old 4th May 2019, 07:13
  #1382 (permalink)  
 
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The end?

More like business as usual. Resignation havenít flooded in however applications keep coming in.
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Old 4th May 2019, 10:07
  #1383 (permalink)  
 
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The oldest game in town, join and get the rating log a few hundred hours on type then leave for something better. I doubt any of those applying are planning on a long term career at ANG.
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Old 4th May 2019, 11:39
  #1384 (permalink)  
 
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There is a lot more to ANGís long term survivability than Pilots being hired, leaving and all the rest of the propaganda flirted on this website.

Just remember that pilots are consumables globally - FACT! Hate to state this fact, however itís reality at the moment, regardless of some kind of alleged global shortage.

Experience and quality is totally another issue........

Last edited by Duck Pilot; 4th May 2019 at 12:16.
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Old 4th May 2019, 13:25
  #1385 (permalink)  
 
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Duck Pilot speak tru. I look at the number of pilots being churned out here in Fiji and those who go abroad to train and come back and I wonder where they all end up.
There was an unfortunate death of a trainee Fiji pilot in NZ last week who had a start date with FJ Link in about a month.
A lot of Fiji Nationals are ending up in PNG with what were previously unheard of mins. Like he said experience and quality are different...
There is a regional market for cheap, low houred, inexperienced pilots to fill seats....
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Old 4th May 2019, 22:47
  #1386 (permalink)  
 
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Note that I wasnít specifically referring to pilots from a certain region or background in my last post.

Sadly inexperienced and not well trained pilots may be getting into airlines such as ANG, these pilots could come from anywhere. Shutting down the pilot cadet scheme in which ANG had total control of the standard of pilots they where getting, when the pilots come back to the airline, provided an excellent foundation for ANG to get long term deducted pilots into their cockpits.

I just hope the safety and flight standards can be maintained in these challenging times.
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Old 5th May 2019, 00:05
  #1387 (permalink)  
NCD
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Chop,
Every airline in the world, even the “two bit ones” receive heaps of applications from aspiring jet pilots… ANG wouldn't be any different. But it’s about QUALITY not quantity.

You may be getting a lot of applications from expats current on twin otters and Y12’s, Islanders, singles, instructing etc for FO slots (so tell me, what did happen to the drive to only have 5% expat pilots by 2020?), I wonder what your application rate and take up rate is for Quality Direct Entry Captains.

Presently ANG offers a direct entry Captains PGK 450, 308 pa on Level A (never to progress to a higher level), and when you churn the numbers with the higher PNG Tax, .40 c exchange rate, no superannuation paid, that is equivalent to an Aussie salary of about $137, 000.

And combing that salary with just 4 weeks leave a year, 10 days off a month (minimum of 4 needed to be used for travel to and from Domicile for any time at home), working in a third world country, overtime that doesn’t kick in until 70 hours (and by then you will have probably done 80 jet sectors and so fatigued you don’t really care about O/T), continual disrupted and absolute crap rosters plus plus.

Easy to see that salary is not commensurate with what is expected, especially when you look around and see that you need to do a lot less for $137,000 than a narrow body ANG captain earns who is away from home for most of the year. (Yes, Tours does sweeten the pot a little, but you have to be given Tours, (Tours are not a given, it is not even in the Contract, just given at the managers discretion ) and if certain elements of management have their way it wont remain on 100% of the narrow body salary - just need to look at Link PNG for that as the ANG Subsidiary pay around 80% full salary for those on Tour.

But if ANG Management is serious about rebuilding the Airline, making it competitive and reliable airline, an important part of the process will be treating pilots with respect and also realizing the value of experience, a bit like what ANG did prior to 2015 did.

So, Chop ‘ol mate, again I say it is about the quality, not the quantity of applications, and not only in the pilot ranks, but middle and upper management as well. The PX73 B 737 crash at CHUUK goes a long way to give support for that proposition.

Last edited by NCD; 5th May 2019 at 11:50.
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Old 15th May 2019, 12:59
  #1388 (permalink)  
 
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Anyone hear anything about the Air Niugini 737 that nearly ran out of fuel returning from Singapore last week. I heard it continued to POM despite being told the airport was closed due fog - 6 attempted landings followed by a final illegal auto land. Other aircraft diverted to cairns. Anyone care to verify this.
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Old 15th May 2019, 21:25
  #1389 (permalink)  
 
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Ouch! Was a (fuel) Mayday declared? What was NZB wx like?
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Old 15th May 2019, 22:00
  #1390 (permalink)  
 
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Nadzab no lights, no tower (on duty) and only has 1 APR atm.

Probably impossible to make CNS after more than 1 APR in PY with full fuel X Sing, especially if there is INTER or TEMPO fuel required in CNS....
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Old 15th May 2019, 22:09
  #1391 (permalink)  
 
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PX393 on morning of 5th May looks to have done a bit of base training on arrival in POM.

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/f...px393#20640407

PX55 same morning diverted to CNS

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/f.../px55#2063fbb0

Last edited by Kiwiconehead; 15th May 2019 at 22:27.
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Old 16th May 2019, 00:06
  #1392 (permalink)  
 
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Heard it got to the gate with around 1.1 tonne fuel in tanks.

"Probably impossible to make CNS after more than 1 APR in PY with full fuel X Sing, especially if there is INTER or TEMPO fuel required in CNS...."

Should have diverted after the first approach then....and this mob passes IOSA audits. Makes a mockery of such things.
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Old 16th May 2019, 00:36
  #1393 (permalink)  
 
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If all the B737 Singapore - POM stuff is true; has the flight crew been stood down? The Fleet manager/Chief Pilot I would assume has checked the FMS for the flight, downloaded the historical data.
Is there any QAS staff taking an interest?

Troppo in the 4th May post mentioned pilots from Fiji coming to PNG, OK if qualified but lack of experience is an issue. I thought that at least two senior CASA PNG FOI's/Examiners were both ex Fiji aviation, and if 83 year old dude is still there then he is Fiji orientated. I'm not picking on Fiji, but you get what you pay for and although B737 pay in Kina may not be up to desirable western standard, in some countries when you take the money 'home' it is a kings fortune. There is no level paying field in ANG, or CASA PNG. No apparent updates on the Chuuk accident as yet.
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Old 16th May 2019, 05:23
  #1394 (permalink)  
 
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PX 393 B737 facts all confirmed

In addition LVO autoland on a non LVO runway by non qualified LVO crew in an airline not approved for LVO is not only tacitly approved by the fleet office at PX but actively encouraged. Thus makes up for the lack of in flight operational support, the lack of a viable alternate and a minimum fuel operation.

​​​​​IOSA is just a box ticking exercise. CASA PNG are in PX's pocket and the various aviation authorities in the region are fearful of imposing any type of sanction in case they anger the PNG government and lose access to resources or allow the Chinese more influence in PNG.

Another accident in the making.
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Old 16th May 2019, 21:20
  #1395 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Office Update View Post
If all the B737 Singapore - POM stuff is true; has the flight crew been stood down? The Fleet manager/Chief Pilot I would assume has checked the FMS for the flight, downloaded the historical data.
Is there any QAS staff taking an interest?

Troppo in the 4th May post mentioned pilots from Fiji coming to PNG, OK if qualified but lack of experience is an issue. I thought that at least two senior CASA PNG FOI's/Examiners were both ex Fiji aviation, and if 83 year old dude is still there then he is Fiji orientated. I'm not picking on Fiji, but you get what you pay for and although B737 pay in Kina may not be up to desirable western standard, in some countries when you take the money 'home' it is a kings fortune. There is no level paying field in ANG, or CASA PNG. No apparent updates on the Chuuk accident as yet.
Get what you pay for. How condescending is that? All operations in Fiji above the DHC are operated ETOPS, even the ATR.
You might be surprised at the experience and qualifications of some of the Fijians when it comes to managing an ETOPS flight. They do a lot of it and in modern aircraft.
Something about the attitude of your post and also the incidents of discussion tells me that perhaps you and your airline may just benefit from the skills that many of the Fijians are likely to bring.

Last edited by WINJA; 16th May 2019 at 23:56.
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Old 17th May 2019, 11:20
  #1396 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by WINJA View Post
Get what you pay for. How condescending is that? All operations in Fiji above the DHC are operated ETOPS, even the ATR.
You might be surprised at the experience and qualifications of some of the Fijians when it comes to managing an ETOPS flight. They do a lot of it and in modern aircraft.
Something about the attitude of your post and also the incidents of discussion tells me that perhaps you and your airline may just benefit from the skills that many of the Fijians are likely to bring.
yeah that may have gone right over your head. It wasn't condescending or about race. I was talking about the regional employment market and remuneration. Don't fall off your high horse though
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Old 17th May 2019, 12:28
  #1397 (permalink)  
 
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If youíre trying to convince us that NAN-LAX (ER in an A330) is a difficult mission, I disagree. Try Hagen in a 30 yr old antique (Fokker) any afternoon and youíll see what most are referring to here, funnily enough none of the ETOPS experts you speak of got close (and yes some tried, but were not enough)....


Originally Posted by WINJA View Post
Get what you pay for. How condescending is that? All operations in Fiji above the DHC are operated ETOPS, even the ATR.
You might be surprised at the experience and qualifications of some of the Fijians when it comes to managing an ETOPS flight. They do a lot of it and in modern aircraft.
Something about the attitude of your post and also the incidents of discussion tells me that perhaps you and your airline may just benefit from the skills that many of the Fijians are likely to bring.

Last edited by TBL Warrior; 17th May 2019 at 18:19.
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Old 18th May 2019, 03:02
  #1398 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TBL Warrior View Post
If youíre trying to convince us that NAN-LAX (ER in an A330) is a difficult mission, I disagree. Try Hagen in a 30 yr old antique (Fokker) any afternoon and youíll see what most are referring to here, funnily enough none of the ETOPS experts you speak of got close (and yes some tried, but were not enough)....
The incident being discussed has nothing to do with Hagen (Though I wondered how long before mention of those "ten feet tall and bullet proof" heroics would come out). Try Hagen in a Cessna 206, the Fokker boys must have it easy. Horses for courses... However a flight from SIN to POM sure does have a lot to do with ETOPS, similar to NAN Lax. Shooting 5 approaches and then making a dodgy autoland is something that I haven't heard FJ falling for.
​​​​But then again they also don't have all that valuable Hagen experience.
Maybe that's the difference?

Last edited by WINJA; 18th May 2019 at 11:04.
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Old 18th May 2019, 03:28
  #1399 (permalink)  
-41
 
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Originally Posted by saabsforever View Post
The horizon looks very empty right now. Only good news is a couple of good people in management (against all odds). If they have any Captains left in the New year Link may well fare better than the mothership which appears to be heading for the rocks at full speed!
WINJA. you might want to read the entire thread, the crash was long overdue post 2014.

With so many Latent failures in Organisation / Management / Culture, it only took a single active failure on the line to result in a 737 loss. thanks Rei
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Old 18th May 2019, 09:26
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Join Date: Nov 2014
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Winja,

best not get into a "pissing contest" as to who is better or not, ....leave that to arguing about the Rugby......

BUT, to bring balance to the PNG/FIJI argument, I'll bring up TRIPELAPIDGEON (POST 1401) post....

"In addition LVO autoland on a non LVO runway by non qualified LVO crew in an airline not approved for LVO is not only tacitly approved by the fleet office at PX but actively encouraged."

The Fleet office mentioned consists of two, a Technical Manager who is also the Senior Check Captain (a Fijian) and the Fleet Manager (non Flying position an expat who spent many many years years flying 737's in Fiji). They were the management group presiding for the accident and the incident being discussed...the fatal one at Chuck and the most recent "unapproved Auto land incident".

ANG was overseen by a series of CASA guys who were Fijian, some who have returned to Fiji. (BTW Fiji Airways has just hired two extremely capable PX 737 Captains, who cut there teeth on places like Hagan).

Winja, every nationality has their Aces, Great, Good, Average etc, and I never took it that "Office Update" was implying Fijians were any different to any one else...just that ANG was trying to put some some pretty green pilots onto it jet fleet.

Last edited by balusnomore; 18th May 2019 at 14:51.
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