Another QF poor decision - where will it end??
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Another QF poor decision - where will it end??
Hi sportsfans.
Announced late last week, Qantas is from 1 November making any tickets sold by Australian Agents for travel origination outside Australia non commissionable. That will also no doubt mean zero flown revenue overrides as well.
On paper that sounds like a way to save money, albeit a paltry 5% but methinks they discount the ability of a professional leach on their backside's ability to get around that. Quite simple - sell another carrier.
Funnily enough EK moved to that policy a month or so ago. Could the eagle be tightening its grip on the roos genitals and forcing their policy? Kinda smells like that doesn't it.
This stands to do QF a good deal of damage, as it already has to EK. There are alternatives at equivalent or better prices that are more than acceptable.
United tried this years ago ex Australia and were ignored to a degree that they had to reneg and reinstate commissions. We aren't that thick, apart from the plastic crew operating with the plastic Captain outside.
Cases in point in the last week. Twin sisters, one from Oporto and one from Sao Paulo into Padang Indonesia. EK to Jakarta and GA to Padang worked just fine. Nil commission. The same was available on another quality carrier with near identical times and near identical price. Guess who got the guernsey? Not hard is it?
We do a good deal of traffic ex other countries and need to make a living so QF is going to be either ignored or surcharged with explanation to the client.
The rat network has been compromised by the restructure that takes the 1stop UK via Asia option away which does not please a lot of people. They don't want their break in the Middle East - period. Now they throw out another negative to their largest Australian selling group.
It is interesting to see the rat following the lead of the eagle, but I think we all knew who would be in the drivers seat from the start.
It will also be interesting to see what happens with what are known as SOTO (sold outside, ticketed outside) transactions on both carriers over the next 6 months or so.
I feel any Agent with a brain will be telling both EK and QF to go pound wet sand up their jacksies and default to the carriers that return for the loyalty and for doing their jobs for them.
For you QF guys and girls, this is what Fawlty Towers is doing. Losing you SLF.
Baaad rat - naughty rat
- silly rat.
Best all
EWL
Announced late last week, Qantas is from 1 November making any tickets sold by Australian Agents for travel origination outside Australia non commissionable. That will also no doubt mean zero flown revenue overrides as well.
On paper that sounds like a way to save money, albeit a paltry 5% but methinks they discount the ability of a professional leach on their backside's ability to get around that. Quite simple - sell another carrier.
Funnily enough EK moved to that policy a month or so ago. Could the eagle be tightening its grip on the roos genitals and forcing their policy? Kinda smells like that doesn't it.
This stands to do QF a good deal of damage, as it already has to EK. There are alternatives at equivalent or better prices that are more than acceptable.
United tried this years ago ex Australia and were ignored to a degree that they had to reneg and reinstate commissions. We aren't that thick, apart from the plastic crew operating with the plastic Captain outside.
Cases in point in the last week. Twin sisters, one from Oporto and one from Sao Paulo into Padang Indonesia. EK to Jakarta and GA to Padang worked just fine. Nil commission. The same was available on another quality carrier with near identical times and near identical price. Guess who got the guernsey? Not hard is it?
We do a good deal of traffic ex other countries and need to make a living so QF is going to be either ignored or surcharged with explanation to the client.
The rat network has been compromised by the restructure that takes the 1stop UK via Asia option away which does not please a lot of people. They don't want their break in the Middle East - period. Now they throw out another negative to their largest Australian selling group.
It is interesting to see the rat following the lead of the eagle, but I think we all knew who would be in the drivers seat from the start.
It will also be interesting to see what happens with what are known as SOTO (sold outside, ticketed outside) transactions on both carriers over the next 6 months or so.
I feel any Agent with a brain will be telling both EK and QF to go pound wet sand up their jacksies and default to the carriers that return for the loyalty and for doing their jobs for them.
For you QF guys and girls, this is what Fawlty Towers is doing. Losing you SLF.
Baaad rat - naughty rat
- silly rat.Best all
EWL
EWL, good points however those of us who are long-suffering operational employees of the 'rat' are quite unsurprised by these types of decisions. In fact, we have come to expect these things (normalisation of deviance anyone?). We are truly 'shrinking to profitablility'.
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No BSC
JQ don't actually pay any commission but via the Agents site $20 per return flight domestic or around $50 A330 return International is added to the displayed fare. All this with an "interesting" system of advising or not advising schedule changes.
At least VA has gone full GDS and are as likely as QF to actually load a schedule change so you can at least react for impact on a passengers oncarriage or ground arrangements.
It irritates me that bean counters think that they will make a fortune by canning overseas originating commissions. Totally wrong. Most of us have been around longer than the management trainees who think they have the new "larger hole in the tube of toothpaste" answer to increasing revenue.
The majority of us aren't spotty Blight Centre resellers who do what the company says.
If we can deliver the same product at around the same price on another carrier without surcharging the living suitcase out of it, we will.
No wonder we drink
Best all
EWL
JQ don't actually pay any commission but via the Agents site $20 per return flight domestic or around $50 A330 return International is added to the displayed fare. All this with an "interesting" system of advising or not advising schedule changes.
At least VA has gone full GDS and are as likely as QF to actually load a schedule change so you can at least react for impact on a passengers oncarriage or ground arrangements.
It irritates me that bean counters think that they will make a fortune by canning overseas originating commissions. Totally wrong. Most of us have been around longer than the management trainees who think they have the new "larger hole in the tube of toothpaste" answer to increasing revenue.
The majority of us aren't spotty Blight Centre resellers who do what the company says.
If we can deliver the same product at around the same price on another carrier without surcharging the living suitcase out of it, we will.
No wonder we drink
Best all
EWL
Join Date: Sep 2005
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EWL, you are spot on.
One of the biggest problems is that management (the visitors) change every 5 years or so. There is no corporate memory so the new guy thinks he/she has come up with a new and fantastic idea to make/save money. Problem is that it has been tried before and ditched because it stuffed up i.e. lost money/punters and so on. It will go back to the status quo eventually but we will then only have to wait another 5 years after this and history will repeat itself.
Rant over!
Beer glass looking for a refill
One of the biggest problems is that management (the visitors) change every 5 years or so. There is no corporate memory so the new guy thinks he/she has come up with a new and fantastic idea to make/save money. Problem is that it has been tried before and ditched because it stuffed up i.e. lost money/punters and so on. It will go back to the status quo eventually but we will then only have to wait another 5 years after this and history will repeat itself.
Rant over!
Beer glass looking for a refill
Last edited by indamiddle; 4th Sep 2013 at 10:54.
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From the airlines' POV (especially EK) I can see their rationale though. With SOTO tickets now IATA legal, they will be under pressure from local travel agents to protect "their" markets. I don't think it will save them money, but will earn them goodwill.
I.e. you were taking money from Brazilian/ Portuguese travel agents in your examples. If you found (say) Singapore travel agents selling significant volumes of SOTO tickets in OZ, taking revenue away from you, would you complain to airline rep? Same thing may be happening here, but with, say, agents in India complaining to EK that US travel agents were taking all "their" India-US sales.
So EK/QF banning SOTO commissions may, paradoxically, be because they are trying to pander to the travel agents
I.e. you were taking money from Brazilian/ Portuguese travel agents in your examples. If you found (say) Singapore travel agents selling significant volumes of SOTO tickets in OZ, taking revenue away from you, would you complain to airline rep? Same thing may be happening here, but with, say, agents in India complaining to EK that US travel agents were taking all "their" India-US sales.
So EK/QF banning SOTO commissions may, paradoxically, be because they are trying to pander to the travel agents
Last edited by Freehills; 5th Sep 2013 at 08:02.
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Freehills
SOTO tickets have always historically been commissionable and legal. In the days when 747-200s roamed the skies and were spanky new all S*T* transactions were at 9%.
Bean counters see it as a way of pulling back costs by cutting us out.
I do agree that there is a very minor market in selling tickets out of non commission markets such as the US by Australian Agents but unless you are doing that on a mass ticketing basis it is not nearly worth the small return on the commission share.
There will always be carriers that offer commissions out of overseas ports as a point of difference and if they are competitive guess who will be offered?
The cross country bleed is minimal and in the case of SQ we can sell them at cheapest price online and still stiff the local agent. Likewise the SIN based Agent can sell QF or VA domestic or international from or in Australia onlie and do the same to us. Fair playing field on the Agency level.
The Philippines did force all Airlines to block overseas Agents from selling the best value fares ex their market, possibly to force the spend to back ex the Philippines and that ran for at least 18 months.
Without rhyme or reason that has recently disappeared and we are now able to sell best value market fares for our inbound passengers ex there.
I can only surmise the problems of transferring money or the high cost of the market fares proved detrimental to accommodating those coming here on VFR travel or the many skilled people (we have moved a good few of them to skilled positions in outback Queensland to jobs Aussies are too lazy to take) on 457 Visas.
This is just a commission recall grab that will bite them Freehills.
We are not St Vincent de Qantas.
All the best
EWL
SOTO tickets have always historically been commissionable and legal. In the days when 747-200s roamed the skies and were spanky new all S*T* transactions were at 9%.
Bean counters see it as a way of pulling back costs by cutting us out.
I do agree that there is a very minor market in selling tickets out of non commission markets such as the US by Australian Agents but unless you are doing that on a mass ticketing basis it is not nearly worth the small return on the commission share.
There will always be carriers that offer commissions out of overseas ports as a point of difference and if they are competitive guess who will be offered?
The cross country bleed is minimal and in the case of SQ we can sell them at cheapest price online and still stiff the local agent. Likewise the SIN based Agent can sell QF or VA domestic or international from or in Australia onlie and do the same to us. Fair playing field on the Agency level.
The Philippines did force all Airlines to block overseas Agents from selling the best value fares ex their market, possibly to force the spend to back ex the Philippines and that ran for at least 18 months.
Without rhyme or reason that has recently disappeared and we are now able to sell best value market fares for our inbound passengers ex there.
I can only surmise the problems of transferring money or the high cost of the market fares proved detrimental to accommodating those coming here on VFR travel or the many skilled people (we have moved a good few of them to skilled positions in outback Queensland to jobs Aussies are too lazy to take) on 457 Visas.
This is just a commission recall grab that will bite them Freehills.
We are not St Vincent de Qantas.
All the best
EWL
