Workplace Bullying On Sim Checks
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Workplace Bullying On Sim Checks
Although I have been out of commercial aviation for some years I still keep in touch with and am contacted by the many wonderfully talented human beings with whom I flew. I frequently get calls from distressed airline pilots who have been traumatised by (in my opinion) unreasonable demands made of them during SIM and Line Checks (or whatever they are called these days.
There are a number of RPT operations in Australia who have Check Captains who suffer from the same common inept human factor. Line pilots are absolutely terrified of them. Some of these characters are control freaks and fail to have them empathy for the candidate. Some are used by Flight Operations Management and the HR department to use the the Check to diminish the spirit of the candidate with the end result of a broken spirit. This is especially those candidates who have dared to question a potential flaw in the standard operating procedures, deficiencies of a safety nature or the culture of the airline.
Some Check Captains get appointed because of Seniority or nepetism with management. Some are great operators and respected by the line crew. Others have a malicious streak and actually get a false sense of power out of the control and power they are allowed to exercise over the candidate.
ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. THESE SORT OF CHARACTERS ARE DISEMPOWERING TALENTED HUMAN BEINGS IN ORDER TO SATISFY THEIR DEFICIENT EGOIC NEEDS.
IF FLIGHT OPERATIONS MANAGEMENT DO NOT SEE THE TREND OF CARNAGE THESE PR"CKS ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR PLUS ACTUALLY COSTING THE COMPANY A SH"TLOAD IN RETRAINING AND DOWNTIME THEN I PRESENT YOU A METHOD OF BRINGING THEM DOWN.
THE Legal Eagles are not going to like this.
CHECK LIST FOR SIM CHECKS AND LINE CHECKS.
1. TAKE A MEANS OF COVERTLY RECORDING THE EVENT WITH YOU.
2. DO NOT EVEN TELL THE SUPPORTING CREW MEMBER WHAT YOU ARE DOING. DONT TELL ANYONE.
3. DO NOT ARGUE THE POINT WITH THE CHECK CAPTAIN JUST ACCEPT THE CRITIQUE AND RECORD THAT TOO.
4.IF YOU FEEL VERY STRONGLY THAT YOU HAVE BEEN BULLIED THEN ENGAGE AN AVIATION SAVY BARRISTER.
5.DO NOT WARN ANYBODY IN THE COMPANY OF YOUR INTENT.
6.TAKE OUT A CIVIL ACTION OF WORKPLACE BULLYING AGAINST THE OFFENDING CHECK CAPTAIN. HAVE IT PRESENTED TO HIM AT HIS PLACE OF RESIDENCE (even better if it his birthday or wedding anniversary).
7. HAVE OTHER CREW WHO HAVE EXPERIENCED THE SAME TRAUMA ORDERD TO ATTEND AS WITNESSES. DO NOT GIVE THEM ANY PRIOR NOTICE OF YOUR INTENT.
8. IF YOU CAN GET VOLUNTARY SUPPORT FROM OTHER CREW FOR ITEM 7 THEN EVEN BETTER. BUT MOST PILOTS ARE TERRIFIED OF RETRIBUTION SO THE METHOD IN ITEM 7 MAY BE A WAY OF PROTECTING THEM FROM BEING ACCUSED OF BEING PARTY TO YOUR INTENT.
I expect a number of you will give me legal reasons why this may not be viable and I welcome your feedback.
Would it not wonderful to create a legal precedent if such an action was successful. Management might then be forced to review the vetting process for Training and Check & Training positions within the organisation.
There are a number of RPT operations in Australia who have Check Captains who suffer from the same common inept human factor. Line pilots are absolutely terrified of them. Some of these characters are control freaks and fail to have them empathy for the candidate. Some are used by Flight Operations Management and the HR department to use the the Check to diminish the spirit of the candidate with the end result of a broken spirit. This is especially those candidates who have dared to question a potential flaw in the standard operating procedures, deficiencies of a safety nature or the culture of the airline.
Some Check Captains get appointed because of Seniority or nepetism with management. Some are great operators and respected by the line crew. Others have a malicious streak and actually get a false sense of power out of the control and power they are allowed to exercise over the candidate.
ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. THESE SORT OF CHARACTERS ARE DISEMPOWERING TALENTED HUMAN BEINGS IN ORDER TO SATISFY THEIR DEFICIENT EGOIC NEEDS.
IF FLIGHT OPERATIONS MANAGEMENT DO NOT SEE THE TREND OF CARNAGE THESE PR"CKS ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR PLUS ACTUALLY COSTING THE COMPANY A SH"TLOAD IN RETRAINING AND DOWNTIME THEN I PRESENT YOU A METHOD OF BRINGING THEM DOWN.
THE Legal Eagles are not going to like this.
CHECK LIST FOR SIM CHECKS AND LINE CHECKS.
1. TAKE A MEANS OF COVERTLY RECORDING THE EVENT WITH YOU.
2. DO NOT EVEN TELL THE SUPPORTING CREW MEMBER WHAT YOU ARE DOING. DONT TELL ANYONE.
3. DO NOT ARGUE THE POINT WITH THE CHECK CAPTAIN JUST ACCEPT THE CRITIQUE AND RECORD THAT TOO.
4.IF YOU FEEL VERY STRONGLY THAT YOU HAVE BEEN BULLIED THEN ENGAGE AN AVIATION SAVY BARRISTER.
5.DO NOT WARN ANYBODY IN THE COMPANY OF YOUR INTENT.
6.TAKE OUT A CIVIL ACTION OF WORKPLACE BULLYING AGAINST THE OFFENDING CHECK CAPTAIN. HAVE IT PRESENTED TO HIM AT HIS PLACE OF RESIDENCE (even better if it his birthday or wedding anniversary).
7. HAVE OTHER CREW WHO HAVE EXPERIENCED THE SAME TRAUMA ORDERD TO ATTEND AS WITNESSES. DO NOT GIVE THEM ANY PRIOR NOTICE OF YOUR INTENT.
8. IF YOU CAN GET VOLUNTARY SUPPORT FROM OTHER CREW FOR ITEM 7 THEN EVEN BETTER. BUT MOST PILOTS ARE TERRIFIED OF RETRIBUTION SO THE METHOD IN ITEM 7 MAY BE A WAY OF PROTECTING THEM FROM BEING ACCUSED OF BEING PARTY TO YOUR INTENT.
I expect a number of you will give me legal reasons why this may not be viable and I welcome your feedback.
Would it not wonderful to create a legal precedent if such an action was successful. Management might then be forced to review the vetting process for Training and Check & Training positions within the organisation.
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boaccomet4,
This site is worth a read. Sadly there seems to be too many cases in Australia that suggest many don't know the difference between management, leadership and bullying.
Bully OnLine: Tim Field shares his unique insight into workplace bullying, a cause of stress and ill health and the basis of harassment, discrimination, prejudice, abuse and violence
Sunfish has posted some concerns on the senate inquiry.
This site is worth a read. Sadly there seems to be too many cases in Australia that suggest many don't know the difference between management, leadership and bullying.
Bully OnLine: Tim Field shares his unique insight into workplace bullying, a cause of stress and ill health and the basis of harassment, discrimination, prejudice, abuse and violence
Sunfish has posted some concerns on the senate inquiry.
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One way round this is for the respective unions to press for every sim/line check to be video recorded for images and sound. It could be argued that it is a valid training tool to be used for feedback and ongoing assessment?
Gees. I must be lucky, gotta say - apart from a couple back in the day when i started ive had a decade of pretty good folks in the sim. Just the odd prick on the line 
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As an alternative to points 1 -8 noted above:
1. turn up on time
2. actually know something about the job you are paid to do
3. assuming you have items 1 and 2 under control don't get worked up (you do not get paid a bonus to care what a checker thinks).
Some time ago I was in a sim ride that the other individual was being looked at closely. The checker briefed me not to assist or lead him and just see how things developed. He was incompetent and (amongst other issues) got lost in a circling approach. That was the fact but he probably told all his mates that he was being victimized.
I have no doubt there are problems out there but remember that there are always two sides to the story.
1. turn up on time
2. actually know something about the job you are paid to do
3. assuming you have items 1 and 2 under control don't get worked up (you do not get paid a bonus to care what a checker thinks).
Some time ago I was in a sim ride that the other individual was being looked at closely. The checker briefed me not to assist or lead him and just see how things developed. He was incompetent and (amongst other issues) got lost in a circling approach. That was the fact but he probably told all his mates that he was being victimized.
I have no doubt there are problems out there but remember that there are always two sides to the story.
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boaccomet4 - what a suggestion, NOT. Very confrontationalist and puts everyone in the same basket for the attitude of a few. I don't suggest for a moment that such characters exist, however they are not the rule, but the exception - at least in Australia, in my experience.
How about refusing to sign the check form (most companies complete them at the end of a sim session and require the checkees to acknowledge them), advising the check captain that you don't agree and you intend speaking to your particular flight ops department.
This immediatley elevates the matter in an appropriate manner AND brings about accountability on the part of the check captain. It is this accountability you suggest is missing.
A decent flight ops department would investigate the matter, giving all a chance to put their position.
Your post potentially paints everyone involved in checking and trianing as villians - and that is simply not the case.
How about refusing to sign the check form (most companies complete them at the end of a sim session and require the checkees to acknowledge them), advising the check captain that you don't agree and you intend speaking to your particular flight ops department.
This immediatley elevates the matter in an appropriate manner AND brings about accountability on the part of the check captain. It is this accountability you suggest is missing.
A decent flight ops department would investigate the matter, giving all a chance to put their position.
Your post potentially paints everyone involved in checking and trianing as villians - and that is simply not the case.
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Yeah, it's a funny thing about being a pilot. You actually have to know what you are doing to satisfy most checkies. The 51% approach favoured by most of our educational institutions doesn't really cut it in the harsh reality of aviation. So whilst there is probably a small minority of what could arguably be called bullying, as there is in most workplaces from timt to time, i bet the vast majority of cases are a difference of opinion between a CASA approved check Captain and Line pilot as to what constitutes competent.
But by all means go ahead with your covertly recorded evidence. That's just what we need, more incompetent pilots in our jets because the PC brigade doesn't want to hurt anyones feelings.
Wonder where that will sit on the corporate risk register?
But by all means go ahead with your covertly recorded evidence. That's just what we need, more incompetent pilots in our jets because the PC brigade doesn't want to hurt anyones feelings.
Wonder where that will sit on the corporate risk register?
Last edited by Vorsicht; 19th Apr 2013 at 00:21.
There is one simple difference between good checkers and dickheads.
Ego.
Have a think about it......the good ones are not motivated by their own ego, the dickheads are all about their own power and looking experienced/ knowledgeable .
This personality trait should be part of the recruitment assessment for check Captains in my view.
Ego.
Have a think about it......the good ones are not motivated by their own ego, the dickheads are all about their own power and looking experienced/ knowledgeable .
This personality trait should be part of the recruitment assessment for check Captains in my view.
boaccomet4
Firstly can you STOP SCREAMING!
Next I must admit in 36 years of flying I have yet to experience anything like what Mr Comet is suggesting.
I too like the idea of turning up early, know your **** and get on with the job.
It's not that hard.
To turn up with plans to covertly record a session because you think the world is against you to me indictes that you should not realy be turning up at all.
More importantly don't drag me as the support pilot into your sim session that you have spent more time trying to defend than to excel at!
Perhaps we are now seeing the results of the 'next generation' who have only known the policy of getting an award for being last as well as first!
Firstly can you STOP SCREAMING!
Next I must admit in 36 years of flying I have yet to experience anything like what Mr Comet is suggesting.
I too like the idea of turning up early, know your **** and get on with the job.
It's not that hard.
To turn up with plans to covertly record a session because you think the world is against you to me indictes that you should not realy be turning up at all.
More importantly don't drag me as the support pilot into your sim session that you have spent more time trying to defend than to excel at!
Perhaps we are now seeing the results of the 'next generation' who have only known the policy of getting an award for being last as well as first!
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pjac
There is only one problem with the discussion in place-in this forum, at the moment. Anyone who has NEVER experienced bullying-who have expressed disbelief of its existence, are IMHO. unable to recognize it, when it occurs.
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Bullying is real in this industry - it does happen. It's happened to me in the sim.
I won't divulge what happened here, because it will probably disclose my identity...
But be advised, there are sim checkers here in this country that are egotistic bullies, and CASA (or some legal body) need a way of regulating it more closely.
I won't divulge what happened here, because it will probably disclose my identity...
But be advised, there are sim checkers here in this country that are egotistic bullies, and CASA (or some legal body) need a way of regulating it more closely.
On checking the checkers: A British airline once conducted an experiment. Some of the best minds in the organization put together a LOFT scenario, then covertly got some of the best stick and rudder people to practice it to perfection in the simulator.
Then they handed the exercise to those checkies who had a bit of a reputation for being screamers or overly anal to run on the guys who were already skilled at it.
The de-briefs were recorded, and of course there were criticisms levelled at the 'candidates'. The outcome was to put a flea in the ear of the check pilots and sell the idea to them to stop nit-picking just for the sake of filling in de-brief time, and to stop trying to flog their particular hobby-horses. As far as the airline was concerned the check division's (note it is a division within the wider organization and not some ego-tripping individual) job was to assess whether a safe and compliant standard had been reached and whether company SOP and policy was met.
The TRAINING department's job is to bring pilots to the above-described standard. If the check department has 'stuff' it wants tidied up, the two organizations need to consult.
If line pilots can't meet reasonable standards after proper initial training and on-going recurrency, either the training itself is deficient or ridiculously demanding, or HR needs to be overhauled (keel-haul 'em, I say) because they are employing half-wits.
Flying ain't that hard. Plenty of people do it.
Then they handed the exercise to those checkies who had a bit of a reputation for being screamers or overly anal to run on the guys who were already skilled at it.
The de-briefs were recorded, and of course there were criticisms levelled at the 'candidates'. The outcome was to put a flea in the ear of the check pilots and sell the idea to them to stop nit-picking just for the sake of filling in de-brief time, and to stop trying to flog their particular hobby-horses. As far as the airline was concerned the check division's (note it is a division within the wider organization and not some ego-tripping individual) job was to assess whether a safe and compliant standard had been reached and whether company SOP and policy was met.
The TRAINING department's job is to bring pilots to the above-described standard. If the check department has 'stuff' it wants tidied up, the two organizations need to consult.
If line pilots can't meet reasonable standards after proper initial training and on-going recurrency, either the training itself is deficient or ridiculously demanding, or HR needs to be overhauled (keel-haul 'em, I say) because they are employing half-wits.
Flying ain't that hard. Plenty of people do it.
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You need to differentiate between bullying, and simply trying to get a person to either do their job or meet the required standard.
Whilst I have seen some absolute arseh0le check & trainers over the years, once the session & debrief was over everyone moved on. I cannot say have I ever seen anything that could be considered bullying.
The only examples I have seen of people who have made complaints about bullying were from people who were not achieving the required standard and had been given far more chances than they deserved. I had one manager dragged through hell on a charge of bullying, when really he should have sacked the individual for repeatedly failing to meet the standard long before instead of giving that person multiple second chances.
So before you start your own covert intelligence gathering consider if you put the extra effort into your own performance would the problem go away??
As for arseh0les, just accept they are a fact of life and move on.
Whilst I have seen some absolute arseh0le check & trainers over the years, once the session & debrief was over everyone moved on. I cannot say have I ever seen anything that could be considered bullying.
The only examples I have seen of people who have made complaints about bullying were from people who were not achieving the required standard and had been given far more chances than they deserved. I had one manager dragged through hell on a charge of bullying, when really he should have sacked the individual for repeatedly failing to meet the standard long before instead of giving that person multiple second chances.
So before you start your own covert intelligence gathering consider if you put the extra effort into your own performance would the problem go away??
As for arseh0les, just accept they are a fact of life and move on.
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It's funny reading some of the post on here.....
the "turn up on time and know your sh1t" contrasts with the "they then gave it to their training dept who proceeded to nit pick.."
The reality is there are 3 types of individual who inhabit training departments, the egoist about 15-25%, the lifestyler 15-25%, and the genuine individual who wants to impart genuine knowledge to improve the overall picture.
Of course there is the occasional individual who has such an inflated opinion of their training ability that they fall into the first and third category, and there is also the 1-2% who are indeed the true industrial psychopaths, who appear all sweetness and light when under the spotlight, but the spots return back in the normal environment.
Taking on the training dept is a no win situation..the only way to deal with the occasional a hole is a quiet "chat" in the carpark....worked for me
the "turn up on time and know your sh1t" contrasts with the "they then gave it to their training dept who proceeded to nit pick.."
The reality is there are 3 types of individual who inhabit training departments, the egoist about 15-25%, the lifestyler 15-25%, and the genuine individual who wants to impart genuine knowledge to improve the overall picture.
Of course there is the occasional individual who has such an inflated opinion of their training ability that they fall into the first and third category, and there is also the 1-2% who are indeed the true industrial psychopaths, who appear all sweetness and light when under the spotlight, but the spots return back in the normal environment.
Taking on the training dept is a no win situation..the only way to deal with the occasional a hole is a quiet "chat" in the carpark....worked for me
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BC4,
You forgot about point number 9.
9. Enrol at your local TAFE for vocational training.
You will have to pay the bills somehow and by the time you get through points 1-8 you wont be doing it from a cockpit anymore.
You forgot about point number 9.
9. Enrol at your local TAFE for vocational training.
You will have to pay the bills somehow and by the time you get through points 1-8 you wont be doing it from a cockpit anymore.
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Gees. I must be lucky, gotta say - apart from a couple back in the day when i started ive had a decade of pretty good folks in the sim. Just the odd prick on the line
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Having flown now close to 20 years, I've had one experience in the sim that would qualify as certainly extremely unpleasant but not quite harassment. Having the misfortune to previously flown a bigger aircraft the the said instructor and that fact having come up, the atmosphere created by the instructor from there on was downright nasty. Without going to the details the ex Ansett -89 scab made the two days feel so bad that still after close to six years I remember it vividly. Still one must bear in mind that everyone has bad days but not that bad two days in a row.
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Have to agree with the general consensus here - if you don't know your 
, belt up and listen to what the checkie has to say. I've seen heaps of crews come into a sim session with fists already flying before the checkie has even said g'day! 
What I don't agree with and I think perhaps is the pretence behind this topic is when checkies preach preference over policy.
No one cares what you think might be better, if it goes against or muddles the SOPs...that's toxic training.
Fuel-Off
, belt up and listen to what the checkie has to say. I've seen heaps of crews come into a sim session with fists already flying before the checkie has even said g'day! What I don't agree with and I think perhaps is the pretence behind this topic is when checkies preach preference over policy.
No one cares what you think might be better, if it goes against or muddles the SOPs...that's toxic training.Fuel-Off