VB Pilots website
This "management pilot" is a top bloke and doing this out of the kindness of his heart, as he did for us at VAI for a long time. His integrity is beyond question and he would NEVER compromise your identity as long as you play by the rules.
For the record I hope It does turn out to be a productive forum.
Last edited by virginexcess; 3rd Mar 2013 at 11:08.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Stralya
Posts: 198
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For the record I hope It does turn out to be a productive forum
I wont be contributing
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The domain is not owned by a management pilot anyway. It's owned by a 737 F/O who helped set up the original Virginetics when he was a CRFO on the 777.
Last edited by fmcinop; 3rd Mar 2013 at 20:02.
The general consensus of the people I've talked to is that most consider Virginetics may be 'dodgy', especially so close to an EBA vote. Just an observation. Maybe if whoever owns it, administers it, and moderates it would declare their interests, the pilot body could form an educated opinion.
I think that is the nub of the matter. As I understand it, when VB pilots was set up, everyone knew who was running it. With Virginetics it is not so clear.
Given the sensitive information being held, of whcih at least one management pilot appears to have access, disclosure would be the right thing to do.
Having a well supported forum is a huge positive for the pilot group, and that will only happen if contributors feel free from retribution.
That said, i also agree that anonymity should not be used to say things you dont have the courage to say in person, but unfortunately the world is full of people like that.
Given the sensitive information being held, of whcih at least one management pilot appears to have access, disclosure would be the right thing to do.
Having a well supported forum is a huge positive for the pilot group, and that will only happen if contributors feel free from retribution.
That said, i also agree that anonymity should not be used to say things you dont have the courage to say in person, but unfortunately the world is full of people like that.
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: deepest darkest recess of your mind
Posts: 1,017
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So, how do we come to that conclusion? Since all the same info is still available. Another kno b head
Last edited by porch monkey; 10th Mar 2013 at 05:24.
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: brisbane
Age: 58
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A new email came out during the weekend regarding the virgin pilot website. The email states that the virgin pilots website is not run by management.
Hmmmm... wonder why they had to include that statement...
Obviously, what everybody was saying was true and now they have no other alternative but to deny the fact that management pilots are hosting the webpage.
Take my advise fellow Virgin Crew and only use PPRuNe!!!
Hmmmm... wonder why they had to include that statement...
Obviously, what everybody was saying was true and now they have no other alternative but to deny the fact that management pilots are hosting the webpage.
Take my advise fellow Virgin Crew and only use PPRuNe!!!
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bolivia
Posts: 434
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am concerned that my details were passed onto a 3rd party without any request for permission. Clearly the new moderator (whoever it is) has access to all that information because i have received an email from them.
In my view it would be proper for the new owner/moderator to declare themselves so that there is an element of legitimacy to the site.
I notice that in the email i received the owners described themselves as "we".
My information that one of the "we" is likely to be a management pilot. That does not mean it is being run as management tool, it just creates uncertainty.
Given the likelihood of it being who i think it is, I would suggest 'clueless enthusiasm' being the motivator rather than anything sinister. However it would take a strongly principled individual with a good amount of integrity to ignore knowledge obtained via the website if it overlapped with Management objectives.
My experience is that Virgin Flight Ops does not have a culture of strong principles or integrity. In fact, i believe there is a court case running at present that reflects exactly that.
In my view it would be proper for the new owner/moderator to declare themselves so that there is an element of legitimacy to the site.
I notice that in the email i received the owners described themselves as "we".
My information that one of the "we" is likely to be a management pilot. That does not mean it is being run as management tool, it just creates uncertainty.
Given the likelihood of it being who i think it is, I would suggest 'clueless enthusiasm' being the motivator rather than anything sinister. However it would take a strongly principled individual with a good amount of integrity to ignore knowledge obtained via the website if it overlapped with Management objectives.
My experience is that Virgin Flight Ops does not have a culture of strong principles or integrity. In fact, i believe there is a court case running at present that reflects exactly that.
Last edited by Vorsicht; 17th Mar 2013 at 22:17.
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: In a burrow
Posts: 252
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Management knew the identities behind all the 'nicknames' on the vbpilots website anyway. A current management pilot was a former moderator.
I have not heard of anyone getting a phone call from management saying "we are not happy with what you are saying, shut the f@!ck up or else".
However they would not have been happy with the 'darker' side of the EBA being pointed out to all those who may not have read it closely, or understood it properly.
They attempted to rush the last one through before the Skywest buy-out and Tiger shareholding (and huge management bonuses) were announced. The full ramifications of this wont be known now until after this EBA goes through, as there are new clauses in there that facilitate "Major Changes" to the companies advantage.
By the end of the agreement an Ejet Line Capt (around 100 seats) will be on 185K base. I am not saying that is being overpaid, however a bean-counter or CEO with other (cheaper) crewing options (Skywest) will! Can someone enlighten us to what a Skywest F100 (ageing aircraft, around 100 seats) Line Captain earns??
Meanwhile in the agreement, there is nothing (ok, maybe minimal) in it for 737 pilots - who are the bulk of the existing crew who have not had a payrise since 2011. Not even CPI last year due to management bully-boy tactics, and not bargaining in good faith. A330 and Ejet are in line for good payrises, which is fair enough.
Sorry for the thread drift. I just realised all this should be on a different thread, but Iam not going to re-type it.
Back to the vbpilots website .............
I have not heard of anyone getting a phone call from management saying "we are not happy with what you are saying, shut the f@!ck up or else".
However they would not have been happy with the 'darker' side of the EBA being pointed out to all those who may not have read it closely, or understood it properly.
They attempted to rush the last one through before the Skywest buy-out and Tiger shareholding (and huge management bonuses) were announced. The full ramifications of this wont be known now until after this EBA goes through, as there are new clauses in there that facilitate "Major Changes" to the companies advantage.
By the end of the agreement an Ejet Line Capt (around 100 seats) will be on 185K base. I am not saying that is being overpaid, however a bean-counter or CEO with other (cheaper) crewing options (Skywest) will! Can someone enlighten us to what a Skywest F100 (ageing aircraft, around 100 seats) Line Captain earns??
Meanwhile in the agreement, there is nothing (ok, maybe minimal) in it for 737 pilots - who are the bulk of the existing crew who have not had a payrise since 2011. Not even CPI last year due to management bully-boy tactics, and not bargaining in good faith. A330 and Ejet are in line for good payrises, which is fair enough.
Sorry for the thread drift. I just realised all this should be on a different thread, but Iam not going to re-type it.
Back to the vbpilots website .............
It is interesting that information was given to a third party. Do they have the right to provide particulars to another web host?
When you sign up to a forum, do you sign away your rights to anonymity to the web host, if the information posted is not defamatory or libel?
If "any" moderator or the web host for example is not impartial and they then "leak" a persons identity, which is in anyway used against that person, would you have any recourse?
Blacklists, Court action, what's next nepostism, oh wait ........
When you sign up to a forum, do you sign away your rights to anonymity to the web host, if the information posted is not defamatory or libel?
If "any" moderator or the web host for example is not impartial and they then "leak" a persons identity, which is in anyway used against that person, would you have any recourse?
Blacklists, Court action, what's next nepostism, oh wait ........
Last edited by Servo; 18th Mar 2013 at 06:50.
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bolivia
Posts: 434
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That's exactly my point servo.
Obviously the original owners were known and trusted and you'd have to say must have conducted themselves well because there seems to be no complaints.
Now however we have no idea who is running it and we'll have to wait and see if there is any repercussions for negative posts.
Either way, I've relegated myself to observer rather than contributor.
Obviously the original owners were known and trusted and you'd have to say must have conducted themselves well because there seems to be no complaints.
Now however we have no idea who is running it and we'll have to wait and see if there is any repercussions for negative posts.
Either way, I've relegated myself to observer rather than contributor.
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: australia
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Storm in a tea cup , Fellow 737 F/O running the site .
Took up the VB Pilots site info when it was closed down and restarted
under different name, keeping the comms open between the pilot group.
A lot of good info was to be lost, glad we didn't.
Trust what you want I know the guy and don't have a problem
posting there.
Took up the VB Pilots site info when it was closed down and restarted
under different name, keeping the comms open between the pilot group.
A lot of good info was to be lost, glad we didn't.
Trust what you want I know the guy and don't have a problem
posting there.
