Can someone explain this to me?
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Join Date: Jun 2004
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Can someone explain this to me?
Plodding down to MEL recently, fat dumb and happy on an Ozot track (did I spell that right?) when the old CPDLC goes Bing Bong.
Contained in this message was a something a little puzzling and actually a bit annoying.
"filthy Oz raping ME airline (I'm using poetic licence and humour) you have not yet recieved STAR clearance, do NOT proceed beyond point xxxx, this is your clearance limit, you will recieve STAR instructions via voice"
Leaning over to discuss this with the skipper, we indulged in our usual tirade about the level of anal retentiveness and generally unhelpful service we recieve these days from air services (actually we get a pretty good service, but as always one or two muppets tar the rest with the same brush).
Anyway, back to my story, at the stage of getting this messsage we were somewhere near Darwin, a good 3 hrs or more from our TOD, so I got to wondering...what the F%%k are some of you guys on or thinking when sending us a message like that? Just because the planned STAR is in our FMC, it doesn't mean we are going to proceed beyond a clearance limit, nor does it mean we won't accept another STAR....its there for planning purposes with both ETA's and fuel, moreover it actually helps you guys out as it can give you an indication of timings etc...and better yet we can adjust our arrival time to suit a required ETA.
So anyway, can someone explain this message to me? I'm genuinley baffled at the lack of logic/common sense.
Contained in this message was a something a little puzzling and actually a bit annoying.
"filthy Oz raping ME airline (I'm using poetic licence and humour) you have not yet recieved STAR clearance, do NOT proceed beyond point xxxx, this is your clearance limit, you will recieve STAR instructions via voice"
Leaning over to discuss this with the skipper, we indulged in our usual tirade about the level of anal retentiveness and generally unhelpful service we recieve these days from air services (actually we get a pretty good service, but as always one or two muppets tar the rest with the same brush).
Anyway, back to my story, at the stage of getting this messsage we were somewhere near Darwin, a good 3 hrs or more from our TOD, so I got to wondering...what the F%%k are some of you guys on or thinking when sending us a message like that? Just because the planned STAR is in our FMC, it doesn't mean we are going to proceed beyond a clearance limit, nor does it mean we won't accept another STAR....its there for planning purposes with both ETA's and fuel, moreover it actually helps you guys out as it can give you an indication of timings etc...and better yet we can adjust our arrival time to suit a required ETA.
So anyway, can someone explain this message to me? I'm genuinley baffled at the lack of logic/common sense.
Join Date: May 2009
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CPDLC - Catching Pilots Discussing Lateral Choices.
Personally when the situation arises, I enter an early arrival track consisting of the waypoints - runnin glate forlas tcomm uterf light reque sttra cksho rtening.
And it works.
Personally when the situation arises, I enter an early arrival track consisting of the waypoints - runnin glate forlas tcomm uterf light reque sttra cksho rtening.
And it works.
Join Date: Sep 2009
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ADS-C would report all waypoints that are loaded in the FMC. That someone would put an active route in the FMC that does not reflect the actual ATC clearance is a travesty of airmanship and completely out of synch with any reasonable TEM strategy. Sure, lots of people do it....
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Must be a controller on loan from KZAK (Oakland / SanFransisco) 
It may well have been that in putting in the STAR you deleted a final flight plan waypoint.
Using the above example from KZAK - if your final oceanic waypoint is ELKEY (for a Northern Arrival) but you believe you are going to arrive via a Southern arrival, and you delete ELKEY and put a point before it from which to peel off to make everything look nice (because you know you will have Voice clearance by that time) then KZAK will send a similar message. This became an issue a couple of years ago for LAX arrivals, but there has been some common sense introduced recently - but you still have to have the final waypoint from the submitted flight plan there.
Not saying that was definitely the reason in your case, but ......
N
It may well have been that in putting in the STAR you deleted a final flight plan waypoint.Using the above example from KZAK - if your final oceanic waypoint is ELKEY (for a Northern Arrival) but you believe you are going to arrive via a Southern arrival, and you delete ELKEY and put a point before it from which to peel off to make everything look nice (because you know you will have Voice clearance by that time) then KZAK will send a similar message. This became an issue a couple of years ago for LAX arrivals, but there has been some common sense introduced recently - but you still have to have the final waypoint from the submitted flight plan there.
Not saying that was definitely the reason in your case, but ......
N
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If you put the STAR in before receiving the clearance there is always a possibility of getting that type of message. But at the end of the day who cares? Its not really an issue either way. The controller might have had time on their hands as you did obviously loading the STAR so early, so who knows...
