Jetstar NZ flights cancelled due to one pilot calling in sick?
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A classic case of multiple delays ex NZ was heard on 123.45 flying across the Tasman about a year ago.
One aircraft delayed due crew mis reading their roster & the other aircraft delayed till departure after first light due Captain no night takeoff recency.
Seems things haven't improved.
MC
One aircraft delayed due crew mis reading their roster & the other aircraft delayed till departure after first light due Captain no night takeoff recency.
Seems things haven't improved.
MC
I thought that if you held an ATPL you were always night current. that may have just been under a different part, not 121. That way, for the regionals who are mainly on the ground during darkness over the summer months with daylight savings etc, they don't have to go and do circuits to get current every March/April.
Anyone know?
Anyone know?
When you live....
Framer - Nup
Every year Rex has to chuck it's captains in the sim for night recency at the end of daylight savings. Last I heard (stand to be corrected) they didn't do the FOs - so I don't know if they just never got the night takeoffs/landings or if they could do them under the captains supervision to get 'current'
Every year Rex has to chuck it's captains in the sim for night recency at the end of daylight savings. Last I heard (stand to be corrected) they didn't do the FOs - so I don't know if they just never got the night takeoffs/landings or if they could do them under the captains supervision to get 'current'
Framer
So far as I know you are correct. Don't see or hear of the any regionals getting night current and at least one of them would have to do it in the aircraft as there is no sim.
I thought that if you held an ATPL you were always night current. that may have just been under a different part, not 121. That way, for the regionals who are mainly on the ground during darkness over the summer months with daylight savings etc, they don't have to go and do circuits to get current every March/April.
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God bless em alright. Last time I was doing a trip to YSSY I thought I'd visit the Airservices Australia website and familiarise myself with ICAO differences........ geeez there are a lot, I got bored after an hour of reading all the differences like "Australia doesn't recognise a 'destination alternate, it calls it a blah blah blah ". There was so much pointless stuff there that I never got to any good stuff....I wonder if here is any? I'm sure there are some rules that are better than the rest of the world, I just didn't find them.
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Off the CASA website -
CAO 40.1.5
11.4 The holder of an air transport pilot licence shall not act as pilot in command of an aeroplane in regular public transport operations at night or relieve the pilot in command at night in pursuance of Civil Aviation Orders Part 48 unless he or she has complied with the provision of paragraphs 11.2 and 11.3 and has:
(a) within the preceding 15 months satisfactorily completed the night flight section of the Flight Proficiency Test specified at paragraph 5 of Appendix II; and
(b) within the preceding 90 days completed 1 take-off and landing at night.
Then there is this -
CIVIL AVIATION REGULATIONS 1988 - REG 5.170
Air transport (aeroplane) pilot: recent experience requirements
(1) An air transport (aeroplane) pilot must not fly an aeroplane as pilot in command if the aeroplane is carrying any other person, and the pilot has not satisfied whichever of the following requirements is applicable:
(a) if the proposed flight is to be undertaken in daylight -- the pilot has, within the period of 90 days immediately before the day of the proposed flight:
(i) carried out at least 3 take-offs and 3 landings while flying an aeroplane as pilot in command or as pilot acting in command under supervision, or in dual flying; or
(ii) satisfactorily completed an aeroplane proficiency check; or
(iii) passed a flight test conducted for the purpose of the issue, or renewal, of an aeroplane pilot rating;
(b) if the proposed flight is to be undertaken at night -- the pilot has, within the period of 90 days immediately before the day of the proposed flight:
(i) carried out at least 3 take-offs and 3 landings at night while flying an aeroplane as pilot in command or as pilot acting in command under supervision or in dual flying; or
(ii) satisfactorily completed an aeroplane proficiency check that was conducted at night; or
(iii) passed a flight test conducted at night for the purpose of the issue, or renewal, of an aeroplane pilot rating.
Penalty: 25 penalty units.
(2) An offence against subregulation (1) is an offence of strict liability.
Note For strict liability , see section 6.1 of the Criminal Code .
However, some have exemptions -
CASA EX89/11
CAO 40.1.5
11.4 The holder of an air transport pilot licence shall not act as pilot in command of an aeroplane in regular public transport operations at night or relieve the pilot in command at night in pursuance of Civil Aviation Orders Part 48 unless he or she has complied with the provision of paragraphs 11.2 and 11.3 and has:
(a) within the preceding 15 months satisfactorily completed the night flight section of the Flight Proficiency Test specified at paragraph 5 of Appendix II; and
(b) within the preceding 90 days completed 1 take-off and landing at night.
Then there is this -
CIVIL AVIATION REGULATIONS 1988 - REG 5.170
Air transport (aeroplane) pilot: recent experience requirements
(1) An air transport (aeroplane) pilot must not fly an aeroplane as pilot in command if the aeroplane is carrying any other person, and the pilot has not satisfied whichever of the following requirements is applicable:
(a) if the proposed flight is to be undertaken in daylight -- the pilot has, within the period of 90 days immediately before the day of the proposed flight:
(i) carried out at least 3 take-offs and 3 landings while flying an aeroplane as pilot in command or as pilot acting in command under supervision, or in dual flying; or
(ii) satisfactorily completed an aeroplane proficiency check; or
(iii) passed a flight test conducted for the purpose of the issue, or renewal, of an aeroplane pilot rating;
(b) if the proposed flight is to be undertaken at night -- the pilot has, within the period of 90 days immediately before the day of the proposed flight:
(i) carried out at least 3 take-offs and 3 landings at night while flying an aeroplane as pilot in command or as pilot acting in command under supervision or in dual flying; or
(ii) satisfactorily completed an aeroplane proficiency check that was conducted at night; or
(iii) passed a flight test conducted at night for the purpose of the issue, or renewal, of an aeroplane pilot rating.
Penalty: 25 penalty units.
(2) An offence against subregulation (1) is an offence of strict liability.
Note For strict liability , see section 6.1 of the Criminal Code .
However, some have exemptions -
CASA EX89/11
Thank you Oakape.
is correct ONLY if you want to night-fly (which is pretty obvious). One can fly ATPL stuff without being night current. So what was Oxidant's point?
Originally Posted by Oxidant
It is a requirement of the Australian ATPL to be "night current"
Is there any other country in the world that has a similar ATPL recency requirement for night flying for experienced pilots after initial conversion training is complete?
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My point Capn Bloggs, is that Casa , as far as I know the only mob that require you to have an ATPL, then add this night recency clause.
The rest (Unless you know otherwise) after training & checking, issue an ATPL + IR & think you are competent to take off day or night.......
As for the comment you can fly day only, well sure, however if you flying RPT it is going to curtail your operation just a little..........
(Thanks to Oakape for posting the text of the "order")
The rest (Unless you know otherwise) after training & checking, issue an ATPL + IR & think you are competent to take off day or night.......
As for the comment you can fly day only, well sure, however if you flying RPT it is going to curtail your operation just a little..........
(Thanks to Oakape for posting the text of the "order")
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is correct ONLY if you want to night-fly (which is pretty obvious). One can fly ATPL stuff without being night current. So what was Oxidant's point?
However as Oxidant mentioned, this may limit you a little. One example would be a duty expected to finish before end of daylight, however a delay means there is potential to not be on the ground in time.
This reminds me of a private pilot scenario who is not night rated, gets delayed and struggles to be on the ground prior to end of daylight.
What a joke.....so the guy is responsible for 180 pax. He operates out of Auckland in LVO. Across to Goldcoast just gets visual off a non precision approach. Now it's across to Queenstown, RNP, snow showers, turbulence, 30m runway, crosswind etc.. Now the easy bit, back to Auckland for an ILS. Oh wait a minute....it's bloody dark. No one told ne this was part of the deal. What the hell am I going to do. This is so bloody demanding, I don't think I am capable. I mean I could autoland? I'm qualified. Nah, the plane might not handle it. Better stay on the ground and try again tomorrow when it's daylight.
Welcome to GA disguised as RPT jet ops. Nice one CASA.
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This caught me out last year, as someone who held two ATPL's before getting my CASA one I thought that someone was just taking the piss when I was informed you had to maintain night currency on top of everything else. We had a couple of Captains last year who had to be flown to Melbourne for 20 minutes in the simulator just to do a night take off and landing at the end of summer?? WTF 
Best way I can describe RPT operations in Australia is that it is like your local flying club with A320's instead of 152's. There does not seem to be a dividing line between recreational flying and professional flying.
Best way I can describe RPT operations in Australia is that it is like your local flying club with A320's instead of 152's. There does not seem to be a dividing line between recreational flying and professional flying.
