V Pacific?
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V Pacific?
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My guess is that this will be the new name for Pacific Blue
The V in the logo is very similar to the V australia V, but has the 4 'Five Point' stars from the NZ flag incorporated into it.
I can also see Virgin Blue becoming V australia
The V in the logo is very similar to the V australia V, but has the 4 'Five Point' stars from the NZ flag incorporated into it.
I can also see Virgin Blue becoming V australia
Last edited by Kanga1; 15th Apr 2010 at 13:43.
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This was mentioned earlier http://http://www.pprune.org/dg-p-reporting-points/401267-vbulletin-restructure.html?highlight=vb+restructure
I believe HR are in NZ at the moment looking at a restructure. I heard some will be made deputy to VB or VA equivalent. Some will probably go. No surprise really, how can they compete with J* domestically whilst trying to maintain a NZ AOC, a big flash office in NZCH, and all the admin staff and blackberry phones that go along with it.
Simple really, re-brand it, paint VH on the tail, cancel NZ AOC, then you wont need 80 or so management and admin to run it, now your in the competition with J*.
Ultimately Vpacific with a common livery to VA makes good economic sense. The PB name is only known in NZ, ask the average Australian about PB and they wouldn't know who or what your are talking about. I don't think the VA name would work domestically in NZ, unfortunately the average kiwi takes the rugby rivalry a little to seriously. Finally the new aircraft order just announced will no doubt be a good time to change the brand............... Overall I think this is a good move, I wouldn't mind betting that this will be JB first move aligning 4 Brands to one or two. Who knows VB may get a rename as well. I believe the 10 year lease on VB is over in a month or two.
I believe HR are in NZ at the moment looking at a restructure. I heard some will be made deputy to VB or VA equivalent. Some will probably go. No surprise really, how can they compete with J* domestically whilst trying to maintain a NZ AOC, a big flash office in NZCH, and all the admin staff and blackberry phones that go along with it.
Simple really, re-brand it, paint VH on the tail, cancel NZ AOC, then you wont need 80 or so management and admin to run it, now your in the competition with J*.
Ultimately Vpacific with a common livery to VA makes good economic sense. The PB name is only known in NZ, ask the average Australian about PB and they wouldn't know who or what your are talking about. I don't think the VA name would work domestically in NZ, unfortunately the average kiwi takes the rugby rivalry a little to seriously. Finally the new aircraft order just announced will no doubt be a good time to change the brand............... Overall I think this is a good move, I wouldn't mind betting that this will be JB first move aligning 4 Brands to one or two. Who knows VB may get a rename as well. I believe the 10 year lease on VB is over in a month or two.
Last edited by PBN; 16th Apr 2010 at 03:22.
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Interesting and thanks for sharing.
I have recently seen V Aust adverts on Wellington buses (very much branding type adverts rather than the normal PAc Blue route orientated adverts). Given the limited connections Wgn has to V Aust flights, this fits together very plausibly.
Within NZ I have heard many people refer to Pac Blue as Virgin and overall I get the impression the Pac Blue brand names isn't that strong even in NZ.
AirNZ charging $30 for the meals (ie premium for Works and yes I know it includes a movie) makes Pac Blues but on board menu look good value.
Interesting suggestion on the shift to an Aust AOC.
I have recently seen V Aust adverts on Wellington buses (very much branding type adverts rather than the normal PAc Blue route orientated adverts). Given the limited connections Wgn has to V Aust flights, this fits together very plausibly.
Within NZ I have heard many people refer to Pac Blue as Virgin and overall I get the impression the Pac Blue brand names isn't that strong even in NZ.
AirNZ charging $30 for the meals (ie premium for Works and yes I know it includes a movie) makes Pac Blues but on board menu look good value.
Interesting suggestion on the shift to an Aust AOC.
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Well, I'm sure they'd love to have oz AOC/OZ bases, cause then they can take over the DPS/HKT stuff from VB. Cause of course we're too expensive........ Where have I heard that before????
Well, I'm sure they'd love to have oz AOC/OZ bases
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PacBro have had an Aust AOC for some time, as that's how they're able to service all the Pacific Islands ex-Australia.
As per Nevilles' info above, that merges the two into one sphere of operation between NZ and Aust but is still req'd for the Sth-West Pacific & Asian Ops.
... That was all off the PB (Aust) AoC anyway, on wet-lease. VB also got an International Aoc, early in the piece, for the Malaysia/Indo/PNG areas, as opposed to their previous Charter licence they had back during the Indonesian Tsunami.
(Airwork and Jetcon both operate domestically through Aust with their freight ops too?). That's my understanding anyway
Rest assured though that a 'Bro Oz base is a long way off on their current terms & conditions, considering their poor exchange rate outbound!
As per Nevilles' info above, that merges the two into one sphere of operation between NZ and Aust but is still req'd for the Sth-West Pacific & Asian Ops.
...then they can take over the DPS/HKT stuff from VB.
(Airwork and Jetcon both operate domestically through Aust with their freight ops too?). That's my understanding anyway
Rest assured though that a 'Bro Oz base is a long way off on their current terms & conditions, considering their poor exchange rate outbound!
Last edited by Chocks Away; 20th Apr 2010 at 10:59.
So how do they operate ZK regos under a NZ Check and Training system on a Australian AOC? I didn't think that was possible?? Do CASA also audit them as well?? I was of the understanding that was the whole purpose of the agreement was to allow Airlines to operate domestically in each other countries without having to go and get a separate AOC.
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Yes, that's part of the purpose as I understand it too.
PB I guess have had no need (or enuf staff
) to operate domestically in Aust. There's a difference between domestic Aust ops and International Aust ops approvals, as stated on an AoC, apart from the Trans Tasman set up now. P-bro's (and Poly's) is International ex Aust.
Maybe someone there could elaborate further on the fragmented AOC's of the VB family?
PB I guess have had no need (or enuf staff
) to operate domestically in Aust. There's a difference between domestic Aust ops and International Aust ops approvals, as stated on an AoC, apart from the Trans Tasman set up now. P-bro's (and Poly's) is International ex Aust. Maybe someone there could elaborate further on the fragmented AOC's of the VB family?
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The ulterior motive may have been to set it up for a rainy day - who knows what goes on in the minds of senior management.
However, the the main objective was to allow PB to use a Virgin aircraft (on the Oz register) while one of theirs was in maintenance, without the hassles, time & expense of changing it to the NZ register.
I guess they could have wet leased the Oz aircraft, but I believe that VB were short of crews at the time this came about.
Jet Man, you are correct & the pilots hold both licences.
However, the the main objective was to allow PB to use a Virgin aircraft (on the Oz register) while one of theirs was in maintenance, without the hassles, time & expense of changing it to the NZ register.
I guess they could have wet leased the Oz aircraft, but I believe that VB were short of crews at the time this came about.
As I understand it PB has both NZ and Aus AOCs with both line pilots and C&T pilots qualified for both. The six monthly checks meet the requirements of both regimes.
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The ulterior motive may have been to set it up for a rainy day
If only I could tell you what I know
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...let's just say it's time the VB/PB/Poly/V flight crew all got together under ONE umbrella for the good of all crew & conditions. You can see it a mile away, just like QF have done for years with their "staff".
This is even more critical now, with the shortage of experience already evident in large sections of the globe as majors ramp up rapidly (just comb the crew-sourcing websites!) ...such experience & skills (management of a multi million $kit plus lives onboard) has a high value and needs to be finally reflected in T&C's.
This is even more critical now, with the shortage of experience already evident in large sections of the globe as majors ramp up rapidly (just comb the crew-sourcing websites!) ...such experience & skills (management of a multi million $kit plus lives onboard) has a high value and needs to be finally reflected in T&C's.
The problem there is that Australians will never be competitive with NZ wages. It is unrealistic to expect Pac Blue wages to go up to Australian levels. And there lies the issue. If VB crew are not willing to take pay cuts to compete with the Pac Blue operating cost they will just start setting up Pac Blue bases around Australia on NZ conditions. It already happens in many other industries, aviation is really dragging the chain in comparison.
I guess the other option is to dissolve Virgin Blue and make it VAustralia and rewrite the contracts but not to sure how legal all that is.
I guess the other option is to dissolve Virgin Blue and make it VAustralia and rewrite the contracts but not to sure how legal all that is.
t this
rescue 1 - needbiggerbollocks has posted lots of 'rumours on this site before - the problem is that they have all been utter tosh!
Ahhh yeah A380s arriving next month and ummm everything rebranded VirginPussy
Ahhh yeah A380s arriving next month and ummm everything rebranded VirginPussy
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Ok a few things.....
If VB management could set up a PB OZ base they would. Don't doubt it. They have canvased the idea plenty of times in the past. The BIG problem with PB in NZ and OZ, is the conditions. It has been from day one. While people do accept NZ PB conditions, as soon as the market picks up, there is a race for guys to leave to go to better paying jobs. (to VB including) That is why Vb has had 2 secondments in the last 6 years when PB didn't have enough drivers for Aircraft. That will always be the case as well. The other BIG problem VB would have setting up PB bases in Oz is the anger it would create amongst VB drivers. Some might say that is Irrelevant however with nearly 1000 pilots now, it really is not that simple, especially with regular EBA's. As for dissolving VB for a VA style contract situation, that s not legal under federal IR laws. I am sure they would do that also if allowed.
If VB management could set up a PB OZ base they would. Don't doubt it. They have canvased the idea plenty of times in the past. The BIG problem with PB in NZ and OZ, is the conditions. It has been from day one. While people do accept NZ PB conditions, as soon as the market picks up, there is a race for guys to leave to go to better paying jobs. (to VB including) That is why Vb has had 2 secondments in the last 6 years when PB didn't have enough drivers for Aircraft. That will always be the case as well. The other BIG problem VB would have setting up PB bases in Oz is the anger it would create amongst VB drivers. Some might say that is Irrelevant however with nearly 1000 pilots now, it really is not that simple, especially with regular EBA's. As for dissolving VB for a VA style contract situation, that s not legal under federal IR laws. I am sure they would do that also if allowed.