VB 737-900s
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VB 737-900s
Apparently DJ are about to sign an order for upto 11 737-900s for delivery next year. Apparently a number of slots have become available with the worldwide downturn.
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with Sydney slots being at a premium, and as a number of the earlier -700's are coming off the lease - it makes a lot of sense to get -900ER's. More pax - same endorsement. Just don't smack that tail!!
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with Sydney slots being at a premium, and as a number of the earlier -700's are coming off the lease - it makes a lot of sense to get -900ER's. More pax - same endorsement. Just don't smack that tail!!
Plus the conversion between AUD / US is taking a huge hit
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A good deal?
Maybe it's a combination of 700s out of lease, and some very good terms from Boeing for the late 777 deliveries? Think back to the great deal QF got on 737s in the last downturn..
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DJ doesnt look like its getting compensation from the 777 delays as its been covered before, its industrial action which is written into the contract.
QF got a good deal of american for the 738's as production were too far down the line and american were going to lose their deposit.
QF got a good deal of american for the 738's as production were too far down the line and american were going to lose their deposit.
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Have heard this 900's rumour a couple of times before, the last time quite a number of months ago and many things have since changed, but it was apparently a definate thing, with a number of the 700's going and the 900's coming.
Do all the 900's have the extra door behind the wings? This would mean extra crew then required...?
Do all the 900's have the extra door behind the wings? This would mean extra crew then required...?
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DJCC
737-900ERs have floor level emergency exits aft of the wing in addition to the 4 overwing hatches and 4 doors of the -800. These doors and the redesigned concave aft pressure bulkhead allow the 900ER to carry a greater load than the original 900 was certified (max 189) and thus attractive to LCCs.
In A VB configuration they are likely to carry over 200 pax so a 5th crew member would be necessary.
737-900ERs have floor level emergency exits aft of the wing in addition to the 4 overwing hatches and 4 doors of the -800. These doors and the redesigned concave aft pressure bulkhead allow the 900ER to carry a greater load than the original 900 was certified (max 189) and thus attractive to LCCs.
In A VB configuration they are likely to carry over 200 pax so a 5th crew member would be necessary.
Total crap.
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A Low Share price does not mean that an airline can't finance aircraft. Especially if these are the Lion air planes that Boeing are looking at moving. I would expect that they would be quite cheap relatively speaking. As long as the Airline is making a profit it won't go broke even if the share price is at 1 cent. It would be interesting to know if they are flying full or empty that would be more important.
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Where will they fly them
In and out of SYD. The lack of gates in SYD at times has aircraft sitting on taxiways and 07/25 for 20- 30 mins, and it's going to get worse as more E-jets come on line. DJ need a larger aircraft and the -900ER suits them.
There will be no increase in B737 numbers, as the older -700's will be handed back which will be a great relief for crews and ops who have to deal with the payload problems on these 20k aircraft.
In a 1 class config the -900ER can carry 215 pax.
There will be no increase in B737 numbers, as the older -700's will be handed back which will be a great relief for crews and ops who have to deal with the payload problems on these 20k aircraft.
In a 1 class config the -900ER can carry 215 pax.
Also remember reading in an ASX statement that there were a handful of 737-800's due for delivery next year (which are to replace the 700's on lease). Maybe with the slots freeing up, VB will convert those 800's into 900's and as there are still quite a number of airlines wanting the 800...those slots won't be too hard to fill.
VB do need the capacity on the SY-ML, SY-BN sectors during peak periods. As it stands there are flights leaving every 15 minutes for those sectors around 8am/9am and with increasing delays in/out of Sydney it does makes sense.
VB do need the capacity on the SY-ML, SY-BN sectors during peak periods. As it stands there are flights leaving every 15 minutes for those sectors around 8am/9am and with increasing delays in/out of Sydney it does makes sense.
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VB do not need a capacity increase in the already crowded Australian skies.
Good rumour - think not! (I hope).
On the other hand I have heard that the -700 are to be extended, with potentially a couple more?
Good rumour - think not! (I hope).
On the other hand I have heard that the -700 are to be extended, with potentially a couple more?
rescue 1,
These are the facts:
VB are taking delivery of some 800's in 2009 (can't remember exact number)...remember these have already been signed up/paid for.
Some 700's are going back after lease expiry in 2009 (again no numbers)
Sydney slots are at a premium and as it stands flights to ML/BN run at every 15 mins during peak periods.
The rumour is:
900's offered in place of the 800's due next year as slots have freed up.
As you can see, there won't be an increase (or very little anyway) of 737 airframes in the sky but rather increased capacity coming from the 900's which is desperately needed.
These are the facts:
VB are taking delivery of some 800's in 2009 (can't remember exact number)...remember these have already been signed up/paid for.
Some 700's are going back after lease expiry in 2009 (again no numbers)
Sydney slots are at a premium and as it stands flights to ML/BN run at every 15 mins during peak periods.
The rumour is:
900's offered in place of the 800's due next year as slots have freed up.
As you can see, there won't be an increase (or very little anyway) of 737 airframes in the sky but rather increased capacity coming from the 900's which is desperately needed.
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Linking this discussion to VB flying to Bali, 737-900ERs have very good range (on paper). Range is shown on Boeing sites, as about 3200 miles.
These aircraft would be very good for Transcons, and range would be good for SYD/MEL to DPS as well.
Over in America, Continental are using these planes with 20 Business Class seats, 153 Economy Seats, so these aircraft could let DJ offer quite a good Y+ service on big time business markets.
These aircraft would be very good for Transcons, and range would be good for SYD/MEL to DPS as well.
Over in America, Continental are using these planes with 20 Business Class seats, 153 Economy Seats, so these aircraft could let DJ offer quite a good Y+ service on big time business markets.
B737-900's will work well for a low cost carrier who uses both forward and aft doors for embarkation and disembarkation, thus keeping the transit times reasonable. Airlines offering premium service require the pax to use only the forward door so that caterers can access the rear galley to resupply the aircraft in a reasonable timeframe. The extra time taken if only the forward door is used adds 10-15mins to each transit which results in one less sector being flown by the aircraft each day and thus makes the economics of the B737-900 not suitable for a premium airline. Qantas' research found that 180 seats is the max single aisle configuration that allows a reasonable transit time - if a larger capacity is required then the B767 becomes more efficient and, some time in the future, the B787-8's (which will be used domestically after Jetstar re-equips with B787-9's) will be significantly cheaper.
The big decision for Virgin Blue to make is, are they going to stay a LCC or are they going to morph into a premium airline. If their future is as a premium airline, then I believe that the B737-900ER is the wrong way to go.
The big decision for Virgin Blue to make is, are they going to stay a LCC or are they going to morph into a premium airline. If their future is as a premium airline, then I believe that the B737-900ER is the wrong way to go.
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My Theory,
VB currently wants F/O's to take commands at PB on PB T & C's as they believe the company has too many pilots. They are going to ramp up this operation and base pilots in Australia on PB T and C's to operate to Bali, Port Morsby and the like, maybe even domestic in Australia. If these 900's are painted in PB colours its all over for the VB pilots, as PB will crew them on International routes via Domestic ports (Virgin name cannot be used on International Ops). These pilots will operate these 900's under a new business based in Australia operating for PB, ala a wet lease type of set up. VB boys, your in for a blue, look at VAus contracts. HR manager has stated that this is the way VB wants to proceed in the future, private contracts.
PB will become Virgins Jetstar. Its already been a sleeping giant for awhile now. Time to wake to ogar!
VB currently wants F/O's to take commands at PB on PB T & C's as they believe the company has too many pilots. They are going to ramp up this operation and base pilots in Australia on PB T and C's to operate to Bali, Port Morsby and the like, maybe even domestic in Australia. If these 900's are painted in PB colours its all over for the VB pilots, as PB will crew them on International routes via Domestic ports (Virgin name cannot be used on International Ops). These pilots will operate these 900's under a new business based in Australia operating for PB, ala a wet lease type of set up. VB boys, your in for a blue, look at VAus contracts. HR manager has stated that this is the way VB wants to proceed in the future, private contracts.
PB will become Virgins Jetstar. Its already been a sleeping giant for awhile now. Time to wake to ogar!
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Just read the annual report to the ASX, there are 19 more 737's on order, seems reasonable that they convert them to -900's if possible... And VB is doing quite well, with reasonable loads. Even JP Morgan senario required oil to sustain US$150/ barrel before VB would struggle if they didn't raise fairs. Vb has raised fairs and oil is around US$76/ barrel today....i.e. half...Sounds like VB might be in a strong position.