Build second airport in Hunter: Iemma

[Gundog01]

This from the Australian website;

NEWCASTLE was "perfectly located" for Sydney's second airport, a facility that would be necessary within the next two decades, according to NSW Premier Morris Iemma.
The second airport would mean improved road and rail infrastructure for the Hunter.

“It's part of our plan to grow our regional centres, to grow their economy and their tourism industry and Newcastle is growing, it's growing rapidly,” Mr Iemma said.

“Its economy is now well and truly diversified away from steel and heavy manufacturing and there's huge potential for Newcastle to be a second airport for Sydney ... it's perfectly located close to the north coast and to tourism destinations to the north of Newcastle.”

The NSW Government has supported Newcastle as a preferred airport location in a submission to the commonwealth.

“Obviously if the commonwealth made the decision that that is the location then infrastructure, road and rail would be one of the things that would have to be addressed,” he said.

Mr Iemma said the airport would mean thousands of new jobs as well as bringing major benefits to the region's tourism industry.

“(The airport) would be an overflow for (Sydney's) Mascot (airport),” he said.

“Mascot's reaching capacity. In about 20 years' time Sydney will need a second airport as an overflow airport to take pressure off Mascot and we believe the best location would be Newcastle given the regional location. The Hunter is home to 600,000 people but it's (also) very handy to the north coast.”

I think we all know where this is going to lead if it goes ahead. What are the chances of the Krudd Labor govt approving something like this.

[Like This - Do That]

In a credit crunch, and with a history of PFI infrastructure debacles in this country, does anyone think any private firm will come up with the $$$$BILLIONS to build high speed rail, additional motorways (extra crossings of the Hawkesbury? digging through and building over hills and gullies? all the compulsory property acquisitions in Sydney's most expensive real estate?), etc etc?

The State government won't stump up a brass razoo for something like this.

Doubt the Feds would want to touch it either.

[Trojan1981]

I think there is a good chance of it happening in the L-O-N-G term. The hunter is very important politically and with an increasing population, requires much better rail and air services (the road commute to Sydney from there is horible).
Canberra may be the only other option. Development there has been restricted to prevent the future introduction of a curfew.

[qantel]

Yer I agree Trojan... Willy has alot of potential to support Mascot especially during curfew hours. Or a freight hub perhaps?

[KRUSTY 34]

I love the way that Albeneisi (pardon the spelling) said on the news tonight that they weren't going to rush into anything without a proper evaluation process! How many millions have been spent over the years on EIS's and other studies, and what have they resulted in? ZIP!!!

F#rking politicions.

[Keg]

...Albeneisi (pardon the spelling) said on the news tonight that they weren't going to rush into anything without a proper evaluation process!

It didn't stop them with the desal plant at Kurnell!

[newsensation]

Sydney does not need a second Airport, NSW DOES, not every visitor to Australia needs to arrive in Sydney!
I remember a suggestion for a high speed ferry service between Newcastle and Sydney, what happened to that idea..

[Howard Hughes]

If Morris had the balls to give approval for a second airport, it would be the one thing he would be remembered for! Think about it Morris!

[Lodown]

I'm in part agreement with newsensation. I think Sydney is beyond fixing. Take all the international flights out of Sydney for Brisbane and Melbourne and leave Sydney (and NSW for that matter) as purely domestic. 1-2 hours to Sydney from the Hunter by train or car. It takes less time to jump a connection from Brissy or Melbourne and the infrastructure is already there, or getting there. The myopic Sydney and Federal politicians screwed Sydney 15-20 years ago and now the current crop is trying to dig themselves out of the mire by throwing the predictable bucketfuls of taxpayer money about. The money wouldn't be going to influential Labor supporters would it?

Just another 19th century state rail gauge fiasco coming up with modern equipment.

Good luck!

[Hugh Jarse]

Sydney does not need a second Airport, NSW DOES, not every visitor to Australia needs to arrive in Sydney!
I remember a suggestion for a high speed ferry service between Newcastle and Sydney, what happened to that idea..

Back in the Hydrofoil days of Sydney ferries, the "Sydney" did Newcastle to Circular Quay in 1hr 25. That was in the 70's, and still faster than the XPT train.

Being a Northern Beaches boy NS, you'd remember that

[Bendo]

Willy as 2nd airport

Willy won't happen any time soon - the RAAF consider it too important to effectively turn it over to the civilian operators.

There is a major push in the Hunter to develop Kooragang Island as a greenfields site.

The problem then will be the squillions spent by Newcastle airport corp developing their side of Willy

[Trojan1981]

I think politics will dictate wether or not this occurs, regardless of the RAAFs opinion. That said, is there any reason why Willytown couldn't be a 'joint' facility? Perhaps with a second runway.

[Gundog01]

is there any reason why Willytown couldn't be a 'joint' facility? Perhaps with a second runway.

Flying military jets in the same airspace as RPT does not work well, especially at the rate which occurs at Willy. Throw in circuit training, instrument training, Saltash nearby, (Dick Smith cranky about not being allowed to fly through restricted airspace) and it will quickly become a sh*t fight. At other bases where it occurs (townsville and darwin), there are relatively few military movements and generally the aircraft flying at these bases are transport types.

As for a second RWY, both sides of the current flight strip are already heavily developed and ther would have to be many compulsory land acquisitions made to obtain enough land.

[ules]

I hope this all goes through, there is alot of free space in william town for an expansion, you could fit 2 runways and a huge new terminal there, could even accomodate for the a380, as for transporting between newcastle and sydney, why drive or take a train, why not get a connecting flight

[Bendo]

As for a second RWY, both sides of the current flight strip are already heavily developed and ther would have to be many compulsory land acquisitions made to obtain enough land.

Yeah but that's the case wherever they put it... and at least the neighbours are used to (although not accepting of) aircraft noise.

I did the same as Ules and looked at G/Earth - parallel RWY to the SW side and a crossing 16/34 to the west - all would feed into the existing terminal area nicely

[mmmbop]

Exactly what is the strategic advantage of the RAAF base in Willy?? Why can't it be relocated to Tindal/Darwin/Townsville (closer to the potential threat anyway) and then Willy be built into purely a civvie airport?

M

[UPPERLOBE]

Yep, Willy is far too busy.

On the other hand Ramstein and Hickam must be sleepy little hollows?

[Cap'n Arrr]

Newcastle a defence base, not commercial

Steve Creedy | June 27, 2008

NEWCASTLE Airport is rapidly approaching the point where it will be incapable of absorbing additional commercial operations, the RAAF's incoming deputy chief has warned.
Air Commodore Geoff Brown, who is due to take over as Deputy Chief of Air Force from Air Vice-Marshal John Blackburn, warned at this week's Waypoint conference that commercial interests needed to temper the expectations for the facility.
The comments are another nail in the coffin of a briefly floated NSW proposal to develop Newcastle as a second Sydney airport.
Commercial flights at Newcastle Airport use the the Williamtown RAAF base runway and the air force is becoming increasingly sensitive to additional demands for commercial access. It has seen an escalating number of requests from airlines to expand the operational window allowing civil movements between 6am and 10pm.
Air Commodore Brown said the facility was effectively home to four fighter squadrons, including Hawk lead-in fighter squadron, and these would be joined by No2 squadron operating airborne early warning and control.
It also supported the Forward Air Control Development Unit operating PC9s.
Significant money had been spent recently on expanding Williamtown to support the AEW&C and Hawk facilities.
"As I stated previously, Williamtown is a defence base, established for defence operations," Air Commodore Brown said. "In its present state, like any other air field, it has finite capacity and I believe that we are rapidly approaching the point where the airfield will be incapable of absorbing additional commercial operations."
The NSW report, commissioned by Premier Morris Iemma and compiled by the chairman of Events NSW, John O'Neill, recommended building a fast train service linking Sydney and Newcastle to service an expanded international airport and said the needs of the RAAF would have to be managed appropriately.
Air Commodore Brown said he had no doubt that Williamtown could handle additional traffic if a proposed second runway and necessary terminal infrastructure were developed.
But he said this was an issue for government and warned that any such decision would need a thorough examination of the potential impact of any such development on RAAF operations on the ground and in the air.
"As an example, if Williamtown was to become a major international airport, what expectations would this generate with respect to the development of inbound and outbound air routes, which would necessarily be through areas where we would conduct most of our training.
"I'm of the opinion such an outcome would debilitate our capacity to train and, by extension, have unacceptable and deleterious affect on our operational capacity as an air force."
Air Commodore Brown also warned there was no magic bullet to solve airspace problems involving the need to strike the right balance between commercial interest and the ability of the RAAF to do its job.
He predicted pressures on airspace would increase as new aircraft such as multi-role tanker transport, the AEW&Cs, the Super Hornet and the Joint Strike Fighter came into service.
He warned against the belief that concepts such as flexible use of airspace (FUA) were waiting to be plucked off the shelf.
"Unfortunately, while concepts like FUA could well be achievable in future, there will be a requirement for significant advances in associated technologies, as well as the regulations, standards and procedures needed to underpin any such concept," he said.

So he's happy for it to happen if it doesn't affect the RAAF, but the point is that it almost certainly will. Back to the drawing board I guess.

ules, I don't believe that the issue is with the airport itself, that can be added on to support additional movements so long as there is space there. But all those red boxes on the VTC are used by the RAAF for military training, and any civil operation must work around RAAF requirements rather than doing as they wish.

[neville_nobody]

Why can't it be relocated to Tindal/Darwin/Townsville (closer to the potential threat anyway) and then Willy be built into purely a civvie airport?

Probably because there is a whole bunch of brass who quite like living in Newcastle and don't want to go back to living in one horse army towns.

[mmmbop]

Neville,

Exactly.

There is no strategic reason for it to be located where it is, other than historic. Same goes for Fleet Base East with the Navy.

Time for a rethink of these bases.

M