Jetstar SYD Debacle
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Jetstar SYD Debacle
Jetstar are copping a pounding in the media this morning about some cock-up in Sydney las night that left 125 passengers on the footpath outside the terminal last night.
Anybody got any factual info on why the Jetstar aircraft involved couldn't get out of SYD last night when clearly other aircraft could?
Anybody got any factual info on why the Jetstar aircraft involved couldn't get out of SYD last night when clearly other aircraft could?
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It wasn't there
My understanding is that it the arrival (JST620 AV-SY) diverted in Canberra around 7pm after delays for Sydney were too high due to storms; then they didn't get on the ground at Sydney (JST7620) again until close to 11pm; not enough time before the curfew to affect a turnaround before the curfew applied.
No big deal, but probably not well handled or communicated by the sounds of it.
No big deal, but probably not well handled or communicated by the sounds of it.
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Bad Press for Jetstar, however I'm not sure it was their fault. The problem really stems from the fact that the passengers we're kicked out of the terminal and were "forced to sleep on the footpath". SACL own the terminal, not Jetstar.
From what Simon Westaway said it sounds like a scheduling issue. They didn't want to send out aircraft that then couldn't return due to the curfew. As a result they sent their staff home leaving the pax in the terminal who were departing at 0600 the following morning. The Airport then kicked the pax out.
Jetstar claim that accomodation isn't provided for weather related delays. You get what you pay for I suppose.
Jetstar claim that accomodation isn't provided for weather related delays. You get what you pay for I suppose.
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Sydney Airport is an international and national disgrace. Arrivals hall at morning peaktime at the country's number one gateway is an insult. Ridiculous, inflexible curfews. And now this. Another example of "it's not my fault, it's somebody else's fault." Article below. The Jetstar spinmeister's comment "...not compelled to find accommodation."... good grief. This is the sort of service you see in South American airports. What a disgrace. What an embarrassment of a country Australia is becoming.
From the Sydney Morning Herald 1 Feb 08 http://www.smh.com.au/news/travel/je...800980737.html
Jetstar passengers kicked out of airport
Hundreds of airline passengers were left stranded on the footpath outside Sydney Airport overnight after officials enforced a curfew in the wake of a severe electrical storm.
Four domestic Jetstar flights were cancelled and passengers booked on evening services to Melbourne, the Gold Coast and Launceston were caught up in a bureaucratic tangle involving the airline and airport authorities.
The storm that lashed Sydney's west and south-west around the evening peak hours had forced the cancellation of a number of flights until early this morning.
As a result, more than 300 marooned Jetstar passengers were turned out of Terminal Two when the airport closed its doors at the curfew time of 11pm.
A Jetstar spokesman said some passengers in need of a hotel room were accommodated but stressed that the airline's policy did not require it to assist passengers inconvenienced by adverse weather.
"As a condition of carriage for weather-related delays, we're not compelled to find accommodation," Jetstar spokesman Simon Westaway told AAP.
Mr Westaway said Jetstar would today confront airport representatives.
"We want to know the reasons as to why the terminal was shut - to leave people on the footpath rather than inside the terminal, even if they were in a secure area," he said.
"Unfortunately it was out of our hands."
A Sydney Airport spokeswoman said she was not aware of the incident but confirmed the terminal's 11pm curfew.
"Generally, every evening, we do close the doors," she said.
Mr Westaway said the stranded passengers resumed their journeys on flights as early as 6am today and he expected all 300 would be on their way by noon.
AAP
From the Sydney Morning Herald 1 Feb 08 http://www.smh.com.au/news/travel/je...800980737.html
Jetstar passengers kicked out of airport
Hundreds of airline passengers were left stranded on the footpath outside Sydney Airport overnight after officials enforced a curfew in the wake of a severe electrical storm.
Four domestic Jetstar flights were cancelled and passengers booked on evening services to Melbourne, the Gold Coast and Launceston were caught up in a bureaucratic tangle involving the airline and airport authorities.
The storm that lashed Sydney's west and south-west around the evening peak hours had forced the cancellation of a number of flights until early this morning.
As a result, more than 300 marooned Jetstar passengers were turned out of Terminal Two when the airport closed its doors at the curfew time of 11pm.
A Jetstar spokesman said some passengers in need of a hotel room were accommodated but stressed that the airline's policy did not require it to assist passengers inconvenienced by adverse weather.
"As a condition of carriage for weather-related delays, we're not compelled to find accommodation," Jetstar spokesman Simon Westaway told AAP.
Mr Westaway said Jetstar would today confront airport representatives.
"We want to know the reasons as to why the terminal was shut - to leave people on the footpath rather than inside the terminal, even if they were in a secure area," he said.
"Unfortunately it was out of our hands."
A Sydney Airport spokeswoman said she was not aware of the incident but confirmed the terminal's 11pm curfew.
"Generally, every evening, we do close the doors," she said.
Mr Westaway said the stranded passengers resumed their journeys on flights as early as 6am today and he expected all 300 would be on their way by noon.
AAP
Evertonian
One day, people will realise what a $40 fare actually entitles them to. (The same as a $200 fare actually...sod all!)
As long as it doesn't happen to them, the average punter just doesn't care...so long as they get a cheap seat. Once they get it through their heads that those seats come without Customer Service, then all will be well in the world.
As long as it doesn't happen to them, the average punter just doesn't care...so long as they get a cheap seat. Once they get it through their heads that those seats come without Customer Service, then all will be well in the world.
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yep CBR had six diversions due syd WX, a320 763 73hx2 734x2. With only one refueller getting around meant a JQ a320 a 734 and a dash only just made curfew.
A lot of carriers wont provide acommodation or other espenses if due to wx
A lot of carriers wont provide acommodation or other espenses if due to wx
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I think some of you may be a little bit hard on Jetstar here. In regard to the return flight from launceston back to Sydney all the Pax that were not from the Launceston Area were put up in Hotels for the night but any pax who were from Launnie were not, as you would expect. So I think that you might find that the pax locked out of the Terminal were actually Sydneysiders.
So I think the problem here is that people did not want to travel back home & then turn around & come back to the Airport for an early flight. Due to the fact that travelling any where in Sydney is a hassle. But I dont see where that becomes Jetstars fault. They looked after the Pax who were stranded because they were not in the home town.
Just about any City or Town in Australia it would not have been a problem, but of course Sydney is another thing as it becomes more & more difficult to function in Sydney
So I think the problem here is that people did not want to travel back home & then turn around & come back to the Airport for an early flight. Due to the fact that travelling any where in Sydney is a hassle. But I dont see where that becomes Jetstars fault. They looked after the Pax who were stranded because they were not in the home town.
Just about any City or Town in Australia it would not have been a problem, but of course Sydney is another thing as it becomes more & more difficult to function in Sydney
curfew,schmerfuw
Bring it on, I wish they had curfews in all major ports then I couldn't work beyong 23:00 or before 06:00. Lets hope Bn's new runway brings in a curfew to appease all our wonderful minority groups.
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Lots of reasons for the debacle at SY yesterday evening:
Ramp staff stood down for approx 2.5hours as TS with extensive lightning slowly passed over the field - purple/blue strobes on terminal buildings indicate storms within 5 miles.
At the same time a naval ship off Nowra had an emergency which necessitated activation of restricted airspace closing the WOL route out of SY. Apparently had a live round stuck in its barrel.
There's not a great deal of real estate for parking planes at SY so when things got going again it was gridlock on the taxiways
(5 virgins called for pushback on D3 at the same time
Jetstar wasn't the only one with angry pax: Emirates diverted to ML then attempted to make it to SY prior to curfew only to be sent round 3nm final at 2303. Probably still trying for a dispensation.
Ramp staff stood down for approx 2.5hours as TS with extensive lightning slowly passed over the field - purple/blue strobes on terminal buildings indicate storms within 5 miles.
At the same time a naval ship off Nowra had an emergency which necessitated activation of restricted airspace closing the WOL route out of SY. Apparently had a live round stuck in its barrel.
There's not a great deal of real estate for parking planes at SY so when things got going again it was gridlock on the taxiways
(5 virgins called for pushback on D3 at the same time
Jetstar wasn't the only one with angry pax: Emirates diverted to ML then attempted to make it to SY prior to curfew only to be sent round 3nm final at 2303. Probably still trying for a dispensation.
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Also spot on prado
I've been involved in similar curfew/weather disruptions at a certain "full service" carrier. They also DO NOT provide accommodation for locals. Out of towners get a hotel and locals get sent home.
The media is very selective who it picks on and Jetstar has always been a popular target.
Storms caused similar disruptions at SYD two weeks ago. The media failed to get onto a balls up with a QF plane in MEL bound for SYD and pushing curfew, that taxiied out, then got sent back to the terminal when it was decided it wouldn't make curfew, only for the ground staff to deal with very limited accommodation in MEL during the tennis.
Unfortunately this happens to ALL airlines when dealing with an airport with a curfew. The media is out for a buck, and if giving Jetstar a spray sells papers they'll do it.
As a side note you could just take a note out of Gulf Air's book and ignore the rules and land and depart anyway
I've been involved in similar curfew/weather disruptions at a certain "full service" carrier. They also DO NOT provide accommodation for locals. Out of towners get a hotel and locals get sent home.
The media is very selective who it picks on and Jetstar has always been a popular target.
Storms caused similar disruptions at SYD two weeks ago. The media failed to get onto a balls up with a QF plane in MEL bound for SYD and pushing curfew, that taxiied out, then got sent back to the terminal when it was decided it wouldn't make curfew, only for the ground staff to deal with very limited accommodation in MEL during the tennis.
Unfortunately this happens to ALL airlines when dealing with an airport with a curfew. The media is out for a buck, and if giving Jetstar a spray sells papers they'll do it.
As a side note you could just take a note out of Gulf Air's book and ignore the rules and land and depart anyway
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Maybe not so spot on guys,
Pax reporting On 3aw this morning of having to pay 250 bucks plus taxis etc to accomodate himself overnight before returning to his HOME in Melbourne.
Said pax was pretty philisophical about it dismissing it as a peril of flying low cost. He did feel sorry for a family from Geelong who were having a hell of a time trying to find suitable accomodation for the night.
SAC has also come out swinging at Jetstar. They say they would have been happy to keep T2 open , but received no request from Jetstar to do so.
Poor communication evidently - but let's face it Westaway couldn't give a F@#k anyway.
Pax reporting On 3aw this morning of having to pay 250 bucks plus taxis etc to accomodate himself overnight before returning to his HOME in Melbourne.
Said pax was pretty philisophical about it dismissing it as a peril of flying low cost. He did feel sorry for a family from Geelong who were having a hell of a time trying to find suitable accomodation for the night.
SAC has also come out swinging at Jetstar. They say they would have been happy to keep T2 open , but received no request from Jetstar to do so.
Poor communication evidently - but let's face it Westaway couldn't give a F@#k anyway.
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SACL own the terminal, but Jetstar operate it (their part, at least). The problem was that Jet* sent their staff home at 23:00, so SACL had little choice but to lock the terminal up. Obviously can't have pax wandering around an unmanned/unsecured terminal...
All Jetstar had to do was to provide some staff (security) to monitor the terminal and the pax would have been OK. Obviously not prepared to organise or pay for it tho. The joys of flying LCC......
PS. Not defending SACL, however. Above comments about what a disgrace SYD airport is in general are spot on!!
All Jetstar had to do was to provide some staff (security) to monitor the terminal and the pax would have been OK. Obviously not prepared to organise or pay for it tho. The joys of flying LCC......
PS. Not defending SACL, however. Above comments about what a disgrace SYD airport is in general are spot on!!
Northern summer two years ago, Heathrow was closed from 5pm to 7pm due thunderstorms.
Our scheduled time out was 2215L, but due to serious congestion on the ramp our new departure time was 2350L.
Most operators were affected and it was complete cluster &*ck but they got everyone in and out after curfew had started.
It seems they have a provision in their regulations that allows for unforseen delays that are not the fault of the BAA.
Saves dollars for everyone concerned, but you should have read the next days papers...
halas
Our scheduled time out was 2215L, but due to serious congestion on the ramp our new departure time was 2350L.
Most operators were affected and it was complete cluster &*ck but they got everyone in and out after curfew had started.
It seems they have a provision in their regulations that allows for unforseen delays that are not the fault of the BAA.
Saves dollars for everyone concerned, but you should have read the next days papers...
halas
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Your right priapism.
ABC talkback (774) had quite a few callers who were all clearly from Melbourne, wishing to return home and stranded at the airport. The only accomodation they appear to have been offered was the bus shelter outside the terminal.
Hopefully both Jetstar and SAC will learn from all the negative publicity they've gained from this experience
ABC talkback (774) had quite a few callers who were all clearly from Melbourne, wishing to return home and stranded at the airport. The only accomodation they appear to have been offered was the bus shelter outside the terminal.
Hopefully both Jetstar and SAC will learn from all the negative publicity they've gained from this experience
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tell it like it 'tiz
priapism
correct in that JetSAR doesn't care ...and although West*way as a media spokesperson is an inarticulate waste of airtime, the reality is that if you are paying next to nothing for the seat, that's exactly what you will get.
The WX was less than brilliant but JQ COULD have put a/c into SYD last night - but CHOSE not to. (QF had a 738 ex Melb @ 2100 and was in at 2206 - well before curfew) - 45 JQ pax who wanted to get home to MEL last night finally ended up on a red tail mid morning today. (at the reduced codeshare rate - AJ pls thank Geoff for the extra revenue)
Notwithstanding above; JQ has been in the habbit of treating its customers poorly and expecting QF crews and groundstaff to bail them out. When JQ is a little short in the a/c dept they cancell flts with light loads and offload pax to QF.
For example, recently 30 or so JQ pax were off loaded onto the late night QF to MEL. - JQ staff at SYD T2 told the pax that the onboard QF crew would advise how they would get to the transport from Tulla to get them by road to Avalon, but as you would imagine:
1. No tpt arranged
2. No details provided to QF by JQ
3. Not an orange uniform in the terminal on arrival - they've all gone home
Yet again angry JQ pax only this time the poor QF cabin crew had to cop the abuse.
Baseline if you want to be a LCC then truthfully be one and make sure you are upfront about what you don't get.
Therefore if AJ & Simon stopped trying to gloss up the JQ package and truthfully sold it like it really is then the punters' expectations might be a little different when delays happen.
(Marketing 101: Inverse equation applies to Dixon & Co who are wrongly advised by their underlings that a generic LCC and your premium brand are totally interchangable and those paying more for the premium QF/QClub etc won't mind).
If JQ is copping it today then it's really a bit self inflicted.
correct in that JetSAR doesn't care ...and although West*way as a media spokesperson is an inarticulate waste of airtime, the reality is that if you are paying next to nothing for the seat, that's exactly what you will get.
The WX was less than brilliant but JQ COULD have put a/c into SYD last night - but CHOSE not to. (QF had a 738 ex Melb @ 2100 and was in at 2206 - well before curfew) - 45 JQ pax who wanted to get home to MEL last night finally ended up on a red tail mid morning today. (at the reduced codeshare rate - AJ pls thank Geoff for the extra revenue)
Notwithstanding above; JQ has been in the habbit of treating its customers poorly and expecting QF crews and groundstaff to bail them out. When JQ is a little short in the a/c dept they cancell flts with light loads and offload pax to QF.
For example, recently 30 or so JQ pax were off loaded onto the late night QF to MEL. - JQ staff at SYD T2 told the pax that the onboard QF crew would advise how they would get to the transport from Tulla to get them by road to Avalon, but as you would imagine:
1. No tpt arranged
2. No details provided to QF by JQ
3. Not an orange uniform in the terminal on arrival - they've all gone home
Yet again angry JQ pax only this time the poor QF cabin crew had to cop the abuse.
Baseline if you want to be a LCC then truthfully be one and make sure you are upfront about what you don't get.
Therefore if AJ & Simon stopped trying to gloss up the JQ package and truthfully sold it like it really is then the punters' expectations might be a little different when delays happen.
(Marketing 101: Inverse equation applies to Dixon & Co who are wrongly advised by their underlings that a generic LCC and your premium brand are totally interchangable and those paying more for the premium QF/QClub etc won't mind).
If JQ is copping it today then it's really a bit self inflicted.
Last edited by airtags; 1st Feb 2008 at 06:42. Reason: typo -
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Well said directnospeed
Why JQ is copping the flack this time is beyond me. Hey passengers - terms and conditions = READ THEM. Either the passengers are stupid or ignorant. The aircraft can't fly due to weather, not JQ's fault. SACL's closing of the terminal, not JQ's fault. Unfortunately JQ is copping all the bad press for no reason.
SACL are money grabbing and thier airport is a joke (curfew is just to please residents).
The passengers were given options - most went to the INTL terminal. Others decided to stay, trying to make a point and get a story (hey, there was even a picture - they got a story, that is what they wanted).
Then complaining about the hotel - there are 6 hotels near YSSY, most with a shuttle. Just because the cheap Formula 1 was sold out and they don't want to fork out money for other accomodation.
In this case, the passengers are just whinging and blaming others. They could have made other arrangements but many decided not to.
Why JQ is copping the flack this time is beyond me. Hey passengers - terms and conditions = READ THEM. Either the passengers are stupid or ignorant. The aircraft can't fly due to weather, not JQ's fault. SACL's closing of the terminal, not JQ's fault. Unfortunately JQ is copping all the bad press for no reason.
SACL are money grabbing and thier airport is a joke (curfew is just to please residents).
The passengers were given options - most went to the INTL terminal. Others decided to stay, trying to make a point and get a story (hey, there was even a picture - they got a story, that is what they wanted).
Then complaining about the hotel - there are 6 hotels near YSSY, most with a shuttle. Just because the cheap Formula 1 was sold out and they don't want to fork out money for other accomodation.
In this case, the passengers are just whinging and blaming others. They could have made other arrangements but many decided not to.
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SAC tonight is saying that the International terminal was open and available for pax who could/would not find alternate accomodation.
What happened to VB pax and why are there no complaints from them about VB?
It seems to me that jokestar keeps forgetting that they are in the business of carrying human beings.
Perception means a lot in this game....
What happened to VB pax and why are there no complaints from them about VB?
It seems to me that jokestar keeps forgetting that they are in the business of carrying human beings.
Perception means a lot in this game....
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Quote: SAC tonight is saying that the International terminal was open and available for pax who could/would not find alternate accomodation.
So when most of them take up that offer and a few stubborn ones can't be bothered or want to make a point, why aren't the passengers being blamed?
So when most of them take up that offer and a few stubborn ones can't be bothered or want to make a point, why aren't the passengers being blamed?