Japan, Jestar and the 787
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Where I'm not alarmed
Posts: 454
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Japan, Jestar and the 787
The following appeared in the Australian today. It is all very interesting but what is the real message? Has JQ announced that they are flying A380's to Japan? If the parlous state of the yen is producing little or no profit, WTF is being planned?
Dollar hits Qantas on Japan route
* Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
* July 10, 2007
THE Qantas Group is losing money on its once lucrative Japanese services after the high dollar has forced tourists to abandon Australia as a destination.
The drop in Japanese tourists has prompted Jetstar to drop prices on outbound fares in an attempt to stimulate travel on its routes.
The Qantas offshoot has also consolidated some of its routes as Japanese tourists turn to destinations such as China and Vietnam, where their yen buys more.
Jetstar chief executive Alan Joyce said his airline was making money on the route but said profitability had been below expectations.
He said the yen was at a 16-year high and was hitting the airline through a combination of reduced demand and the fact that most of its sales were in yen.
"This year we'll still make money on Japan - it's just that we thought Japan would be extremely profitable," he said.
"I think the group as a whole is not making money on Japan."
In a recent forecast of the yen by 18 analysts, 50 per cent predicted it would drop to between 85-to-95 yen to the dollar, while the remainder said it would stay at about 110 yen to the dollar, Mr Joyce said.
"At 85, we make a lot of money and at 110 we're not going to make any money, " he said.
"But the analysts who are experts don't know which way it is going to go."
Despite the downturn, Mr Joyce said there were no plans to pull out of Japan. He added that it would be the first international destination for the airline's new Boeing 787 Dreamliner.
Jetstar will get the first 15 of 65 Dreamliners on order by Qantas. It plans to use the planes for flights to Korea, Taiwan and southern European destinations such as Rome and Athens.
It could also use the plane to fly a one-stop service to the US west coast ahead of the arrival of bigger 787-9s capable of the doing the trip non-stop.
Mr Joyce said Jetstar would get the first aircraft in August next year and was likely to fly it domestically for the first few weeks.
The new aircraft would then go to Japan to replace the A380s.
"And the reason for that is that we have both ANA and JAL getting their aircraft before us, so there will be a lot of support in Japan," he said.
The Jetstar boss said any move to transfer 787s to Qantas investment vehicles such as Jetstar Asia and Vietnam's Pacific Airlines, which would ultimately carry a Jetstar brand, were "a number of years away".
He said work to install a new reservation system would see the rebranding wait until at least April next year.
"What we would like to do with Pacific is get the operation up and established, go for high growth in short-haul markets and eventually getting them into (Airbus) 320s," he said.
Asked about the advantages of the 787, Mr Joyce said it would provide a 20 per cent reduction in fuel burn as well as lower maintenance costs.
"I won't give you a precise figure but what we figure is the 787 in a Jetstar configuration gives a cost base to compete against somebody like an Emirates with an 380 and it gives us a smaller vehicle that allows us to fly direct markets compared to full-service carriers with one of the big aircraft," he said.
"That gives you a lower-risk vehicle and gives you the ability to go on to the less dense markets and be very competitive against."
He was unfazed by the fact the 787 remained overweight, saying it was within the scope of guarantees contained in the airline's contract with Boeing.
* Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
* July 10, 2007
THE Qantas Group is losing money on its once lucrative Japanese services after the high dollar has forced tourists to abandon Australia as a destination.
The drop in Japanese tourists has prompted Jetstar to drop prices on outbound fares in an attempt to stimulate travel on its routes.
The Qantas offshoot has also consolidated some of its routes as Japanese tourists turn to destinations such as China and Vietnam, where their yen buys more.
Jetstar chief executive Alan Joyce said his airline was making money on the route but said profitability had been below expectations.
He said the yen was at a 16-year high and was hitting the airline through a combination of reduced demand and the fact that most of its sales were in yen.
"This year we'll still make money on Japan - it's just that we thought Japan would be extremely profitable," he said.
"I think the group as a whole is not making money on Japan."
In a recent forecast of the yen by 18 analysts, 50 per cent predicted it would drop to between 85-to-95 yen to the dollar, while the remainder said it would stay at about 110 yen to the dollar, Mr Joyce said.
"At 85, we make a lot of money and at 110 we're not going to make any money, " he said.
"But the analysts who are experts don't know which way it is going to go."
Despite the downturn, Mr Joyce said there were no plans to pull out of Japan. He added that it would be the first international destination for the airline's new Boeing 787 Dreamliner.
Jetstar will get the first 15 of 65 Dreamliners on order by Qantas. It plans to use the planes for flights to Korea, Taiwan and southern European destinations such as Rome and Athens.
It could also use the plane to fly a one-stop service to the US west coast ahead of the arrival of bigger 787-9s capable of the doing the trip non-stop.
Mr Joyce said Jetstar would get the first aircraft in August next year and was likely to fly it domestically for the first few weeks.
The new aircraft would then go to Japan to replace the A380s.
"And the reason for that is that we have both ANA and JAL getting their aircraft before us, so there will be a lot of support in Japan," he said.
The Jetstar boss said any move to transfer 787s to Qantas investment vehicles such as Jetstar Asia and Vietnam's Pacific Airlines, which would ultimately carry a Jetstar brand, were "a number of years away".
He said work to install a new reservation system would see the rebranding wait until at least April next year.
"What we would like to do with Pacific is get the operation up and established, go for high growth in short-haul markets and eventually getting them into (Airbus) 320s," he said.
Asked about the advantages of the 787, Mr Joyce said it would provide a 20 per cent reduction in fuel burn as well as lower maintenance costs.
"I won't give you a precise figure but what we figure is the 787 in a Jetstar configuration gives a cost base to compete against somebody like an Emirates with an 380 and it gives us a smaller vehicle that allows us to fly direct markets compared to full-service carriers with one of the big aircraft," he said.
"That gives you a lower-risk vehicle and gives you the ability to go on to the less dense markets and be very competitive against."
He was unfazed by the fact the 787 remained overweight, saying it was within the scope of guarantees contained in the airline's contract with Boeing.
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Top of Descent
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Geoffstars A380s
The new aircraft would then go to Japan to replace the A380s
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Top of Descent
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BennyStar
Wouldn't say that to loud Sholdhaul.... AIPA will have an astronomic fit
Rumour has it that the A380 double decker will have Geoffstar passengers on the upper deck and Qantas premium pax on the main deck with the aircraft painted in dual colours.
This idea gives me visions of an episode of an old Benny Hill Show where they were heading off on a flight to the continent and el cheapo pax had standing room at the rear of the aircraft with hay bales and chickens flying around and a hostie with a cigarette hanging out the corner of her mouth whilst throwing lunch boxes at the unfortunate pax whilst up the front beyond the curtain champagne lobster and caviar was being served by showgirls and a good time was being had by all. 
Main deck cue I Still Call Australia Home........Upper Deck cue the theme to The Benny Hill Show
Rumour has it that the A380 double decker will have Geoffstar passengers on the upper deck and Qantas premium pax on the main deck with the aircraft painted in dual colours.
You'd better throw that idea in the suggestion box - might be an innovation eXcel award in it for you
In all seriousness - why not have both on the same aircraft - seperate upper and lower deck airbridges could work.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Dununda
Posts: 476
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Neglected Market
For years Japan was a cashcow.
It was a market QF took for granted.
Third rate (743)equipment was sent to NRT KIX CTS and NGO.
It was rare for an Aircraft to take off on time.Sometimes not taking off at all
Little marketing and poor equipment develops no loyalty.
J/C these days is full of Europeans travelling to and from Australia.
When the domestics fly to NRT there is hardly ever a competent language speaker onboard.
Now we have the Jet*/Coles Cafeteria business model flying there.
JAL have been flying the tripplers to NRT for a number of years.
The Dreamliner operated by Qantas and some decent marketing is the only way to retrieve this market.
Recently a new manager(Tokyo Based) employed from another airline took over this route.
To meet his budget this genius cut travel agency commissions in half.
The predictable result
assenger loads plummeted.
This nincompoop was invited to Sydney.
From all accounts it was not to have tea and bickies with TVDD(The Viagra Driven Dwarf.
It was a market QF took for granted.
Third rate (743)equipment was sent to NRT KIX CTS and NGO.
It was rare for an Aircraft to take off on time.Sometimes not taking off at all
Little marketing and poor equipment develops no loyalty.
J/C these days is full of Europeans travelling to and from Australia.
When the domestics fly to NRT there is hardly ever a competent language speaker onboard.
Now we have the Jet*/Coles Cafeteria business model flying there.
JAL have been flying the tripplers to NRT for a number of years.
The Dreamliner operated by Qantas and some decent marketing is the only way to retrieve this market.
Recently a new manager(Tokyo Based) employed from another airline took over this route.
To meet his budget this genius cut travel agency commissions in half.
The predictable result
assenger loads plummeted.This nincompoop was invited to Sydney.
From all accounts it was not to have tea and bickies with TVDD(The Viagra Driven Dwarf.
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Asia
Posts: 381
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Surfside
Spot on. A totally neglected market and the boffins in Sydney wonder why!
Sure the exchange rate is a problem but it is not the reason why QF finds itself in the predicament it is in vis a vis the Japan market.
The reality is that Jetstar is probably a step up in product that is being delivered to this market.
Most people I know would rather travel over HKG,SIN, KUL or even BKK to avoid the QF product.
Spot on. A totally neglected market and the boffins in Sydney wonder why!
Sure the exchange rate is a problem but it is not the reason why QF finds itself in the predicament it is in vis a vis the Japan market.
The reality is that Jetstar is probably a step up in product that is being delivered to this market.
Most people I know would rather travel over HKG,SIN, KUL or even BKK to avoid the QF product.
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Top of Descent
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pay as you go
Rumour has it that the A380 double decker will have Geoffstar passengers on the upper deck and Qantas premium pax on the main deck with the aircraft painted in dual colours.
In all seriousness - why not have both on the same aircraft - seperate upper and lower deck airbridges could work.
In all seriousness - why not have both on the same aircraft - seperate upper and lower deck airbridges could work.
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Singapore
Posts: 85
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Japanese loads are dangerously low at the moment, but picking up due to European and American connections. With $700 return including taxes fares going in Japan the company must be losing alot of money!!
The NRT's are also back to Long Haul now, so that increases the loses.
Rumour is that they will drop the services and transfer them to the star after the Beijing Olympics. With KIX and NGO already closed up shop and transfered everything to the star.
The NRT's are also back to Long Haul now, so that increases the loses.
Rumour is that they will drop the services and transfer them to the star after the Beijing Olympics. With KIX and NGO already closed up shop and transfered everything to the star.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Heaven
Posts: 584
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Equation
Freight is the other side of the equation.
The bellies of most jets into and out of Japan are usually full of cargo.
This provides a great deal of revenue.
More in some cases than the SLF.
Low cost models will not work in Japan.
If the was a chance that they would JAL and ANA would already be in them
The bellies of most jets into and out of Japan are usually full of cargo.
This provides a great deal of revenue.
More in some cases than the SLF.
Low cost models will not work in Japan.
If the was a chance that they would JAL and ANA would already be in them
Registered User **
Join Date: May 2005
Location: The Ultimate Crew Rest....
Age: 69
Posts: 2,346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quote... "Jet*/Coles Cafeteria business model flying there".....This is probably because the cafeteria is Darths favourite dining out experience.I could hardly see him paying for a decent restaurant unless it was a freeby.
The other funny thing is Darths apprentice at Darkstar .....mini Darth.He is blaming the loss of revenue or lack of pax for want of a better phrase on the exchange rate.
Certainly it would not help however,the Japanese do not worry about the exchange rate when they flock to Hawaii....or maybe it is to see the result of their handiwork.
Perhaps we should do a Pearl Harbour thing and set up an advertising campaign based on the Japanese attack on Sydney Harbour.We could set up a memorial in the harbour and they would fly here in droves.
The other funny thing is Darths apprentice at Darkstar .....mini Darth.He is blaming the loss of revenue or lack of pax for want of a better phrase on the exchange rate.
Certainly it would not help however,the Japanese do not worry about the exchange rate when they flock to Hawaii....or maybe it is to see the result of their handiwork.
Perhaps we should do a Pearl Harbour thing and set up an advertising campaign based on the Japanese attack on Sydney Harbour.We could set up a memorial in the harbour and they would fly here in droves.
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: on the point
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Product
If the product is good enough the Japanese market will support...even if it is expensive...but it must be good
Jet*aint good
Most Japanese buy a package through a travel agent.
If they are not happy the travel agent will hear about it.
Too many unhappy travellers and the travel agent sends the business elsewhere.
That is the reason QF and Jet* are bleeding.
My Friends in Japan see Jet* as an unknown..but they have heard it is rubbish
Jet*aint good
Most Japanese buy a package through a travel agent.
If they are not happy the travel agent will hear about it.
Too many unhappy travellers and the travel agent sends the business elsewhere.
That is the reason QF and Jet* are bleeding.
My Friends in Japan see Jet* as an unknown..but they have heard it is rubbish
