crunch time
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: australia
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crunch time
After reading the Issues that concern you all ,
Pilots accepting lower pay to "get a good job" , the divide and conquor policy from managment.
I can only see one answer.
You need a stronger union , say the TWU , play a bit dirty and get a bit angry.
Otherwise you will be irrelervant.
I've worked in industries with strong unions and the General Aviation Industry and I'm dismayed that I can't even get the award pay without being sacked. Too many pilots who "Just love too fly" (Haven't got a family to support) or "Just want to get their hours up" (work for nothing) continually underming me.
I thought that this sort of behavior would stop in "the Airlines".
Good Luck.
MC.
Pilots accepting lower pay to "get a good job" , the divide and conquor policy from managment.
I can only see one answer.
You need a stronger union , say the TWU , play a bit dirty and get a bit angry.
Otherwise you will be irrelervant.
I've worked in industries with strong unions and the General Aviation Industry and I'm dismayed that I can't even get the award pay without being sacked. Too many pilots who "Just love too fly" (Haven't got a family to support) or "Just want to get their hours up" (work for nothing) continually underming me.
I thought that this sort of behavior would stop in "the Airlines".
Good Luck.
MC.
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: lapbandland
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Hang in there Crunchy!
The supply/demand situation for pilots is at last showing signs of change.
Emirates payrise, Brazilians being recruited around asia/middle east, job
ads worldwide increasing, furloughed pilots returning to american carriers.
The heroic managers who have cynically used pilot surpluses to screw
down conditions/salaries have created a problem.
The PROBLEM is all levels of aviation are now roughly equal. Thats to say
most LCC's, Airlines, commuters pay the same.
So pilot jobs have become more portable, the conditions are rubbish
everywhere, pilots go wherever it suits.
The airlines are trying everything, increase retirement age, basing
deals, commuter contracts, to maintain current terms.
Who will crack first
There is a worldwide shortage of experienced pilots, at all levels of
the industry. Suffer you management buzzards, our time has come.
The supply/demand situation for pilots is at last showing signs of change.
Emirates payrise, Brazilians being recruited around asia/middle east, job
ads worldwide increasing, furloughed pilots returning to american carriers.
The heroic managers who have cynically used pilot surpluses to screw
down conditions/salaries have created a problem.
The PROBLEM is all levels of aviation are now roughly equal. Thats to say
most LCC's, Airlines, commuters pay the same.
So pilot jobs have become more portable, the conditions are rubbish
everywhere, pilots go wherever it suits.
The airlines are trying everything, increase retirement age, basing
deals, commuter contracts, to maintain current terms.
Who will crack first
There is a worldwide shortage of experienced pilots, at all levels of
the industry. Suffer you management buzzards, our time has come.
Join Date: Mar 2001
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In one of my employment excursions from aviation i was a maniac in Sydney driving a Dairy Farmers truck, dealt firsthand with the TWU, in my opinion these guys are far too blunt an instrument to use in aviation.
Although they certainly do have some balls about them.
Although they certainly do have some balls about them.
Join Date: Oct 2004
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here is an interesting read......an article on "supply and demand"
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...china-and.html
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...china-and.html
Nunc est bibendum
Kaptin M summed up the situation nicely in his post on another thread. (Unfortunately PPRUNE bans the link or I'd share it with you all).
Let me get this straight, in my mind.
Airline management don't like their staff leaving to work for other airlines, when those staff are offered a better deal - that's poaching!
But it's quite acceptable for CEO's to leave one airline to go to another, when their multi-million dollar salaries are bettered at one of the opposition companies.
When there was a glut of pilots, it suited the suits to knock our conditions back whenever they wanted to - "Market forces" was the excuse. "There are lots of unemployed pilots looking for work."
Now that the wheel has swung through 180 degreees, and there's a shortage of pilots - a shortage that is going to dramatically INCREASE over the next 2 and 3 years - and airlines that NEED pilots are improving the conditions from the rubbish we've had, management are trying to stop their staff from doing what they've been doing!
Hypocrisy is a word that comes to mind, isn't it?
And what about "loyalty"?
Loyalty existed within many staff, in many companies, even when the salaries were relatively low.
That loyalty the staff felt, was because they were treated with some respect and compassion - and that respect was reciprocated.
The mid 1980's and 1990's saw a "New Age" aggressive management that treated all staff as dispensable, and cut numbers ruthlessly, often to below levels that would have afforded optimum service to passengers.
In return, management rewarded themselves with salaries and bonuses, the enormity of which had never been seen before in airlines.
And so we are now rapidly arriving at the scenario of having a driver sitting in his carriage, but with the horses needed to get it moving going to greener pastures.
If more money is needed to retain staff, the solution is obvious as to where millions can be resourced.
Market forces demand it!
Airline management don't like their staff leaving to work for other airlines, when those staff are offered a better deal - that's poaching!
But it's quite acceptable for CEO's to leave one airline to go to another, when their multi-million dollar salaries are bettered at one of the opposition companies.
When there was a glut of pilots, it suited the suits to knock our conditions back whenever they wanted to - "Market forces" was the excuse. "There are lots of unemployed pilots looking for work."
Now that the wheel has swung through 180 degreees, and there's a shortage of pilots - a shortage that is going to dramatically INCREASE over the next 2 and 3 years - and airlines that NEED pilots are improving the conditions from the rubbish we've had, management are trying to stop their staff from doing what they've been doing!
Hypocrisy is a word that comes to mind, isn't it?
And what about "loyalty"?
Loyalty existed within many staff, in many companies, even when the salaries were relatively low.
That loyalty the staff felt, was because they were treated with some respect and compassion - and that respect was reciprocated.
The mid 1980's and 1990's saw a "New Age" aggressive management that treated all staff as dispensable, and cut numbers ruthlessly, often to below levels that would have afforded optimum service to passengers.
In return, management rewarded themselves with salaries and bonuses, the enormity of which had never been seen before in airlines.
And so we are now rapidly arriving at the scenario of having a driver sitting in his carriage, but with the horses needed to get it moving going to greener pastures.
If more money is needed to retain staff, the solution is obvious as to where millions can be resourced.
Market forces demand it!
Spik Inlish
Yo...
I'm waiting for some innocuous little CAR paragraph amendment to appear, dealing with an English language proficiency test prior to issue of an Aussie ATPL.
Or maybe a course syllabus for "Aviation English".
Me, cynical ? Nahhhhh...
I'm waiting for some innocuous little CAR paragraph amendment to appear, dealing with an English language proficiency test prior to issue of an Aussie ATPL.
Or maybe a course syllabus for "Aviation English".
Me, cynical ? Nahhhhh...
Join Date: Nov 1999
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Murray Cod,
We don't just need a stronger union we need ONE UNION!
That is QF/DJ/JQ/Regionals/GA all under the one encompassing pilots union, not join a trade union. Then we won't see the constant undermining and racing to the bottom that is occuring due to guys and gals fearing for their jobs if they're not 'cheap' enough, amongst other reasons.
Regardless of which company we work for, we're all in the same boat here. We all fly and we all work for companies who are sharpening their knives to our terms and conditions.
We don't just need a stronger union we need ONE UNION!
That is QF/DJ/JQ/Regionals/GA all under the one encompassing pilots union, not join a trade union. Then we won't see the constant undermining and racing to the bottom that is occuring due to guys and gals fearing for their jobs if they're not 'cheap' enough, amongst other reasons.
Regardless of which company we work for, we're all in the same boat here. We all fly and we all work for companies who are sharpening their knives to our terms and conditions.
