ADL new terminal - well thought out?

[turbantime]

Looks like the regional passengers are getting a major shafting from the owners of ADL airport.

http://www.rex.com.au/corp_info/mc_adlviews.aspx

Appalling conditions, nightmare security checks, claustrophobic walkways, thoughtless airport design…and the list goes on. In their own words, regional travellers of South Australia tell it like it is, no holds barred.
Download your complete guide to AAL’s mistreatment of its regional passengers (powerpoint slideshow, 3MB)

[7gcbc]

a quote from some time ago......

Originally Posted by 7gcbc

Highly unlikely given SA's "mickey-mouse-mckinsey-mba'ers" (conceit doth overcome reality), however it really does remain to be seen.
The Rex statement is so loose, and AALs' commitment vague, one wonders if it is PR.
If I were REX i'd get legal, once aal have them in there, they will go live with the Terminal at Rex's expense.

no surprise there then............

Original thread: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...=202036&page=2

[Deejay 1]

Turbantime

I think only Rex regional passengers are having issues, not regional passengers per se.

Last time I looked the following flew to:

QFLink Port Lincoln, Kingscote
O'Connor Whyalla, Mt Gambier, Mildura and Port Augusta
Rex fly to all of the above except Mildura and Port Augusta, therefore the public has a choice of who to fly.
QfLink and o;connor pax grumbling???? Not that I've seen or heard.

Sure Rex passengers to Ceduna, Coober Pedy and Roxby might be suffering.

Anyway I would suggest its only a 800m walk if the pax have to go to gate 12, or whatever the furthest gate is.

Rex should be grateful that GWA fell over last year, imagine the cries they would be having then.

I think Rex are having a huge dummy spit, especially over some of the issues, and if they're not careful might not end up with anything!

[7gcbc]

Originally Posted by Deejay 1

Sure Rex passengers to Ceduna, Coober Pedy and Roxby might be suffering.!

so, it's OK to allow regional pax and by inference regional lines to suffer ?

Originally Posted by Deejay 1

I think Rex are having a huge dummy spit, especially over some of the issues, and if they're not careful might not end up with anything!

and it is , in plain view here, allowable to threaten a regional operator with removal of FACILITIES by a second rate airport, in effect , like it or lump it ?

Why cannot REX expect the same service as the majors ? or are jets and large cash what AAL have in mind, if I were rex I'D sue THE sob's, and make my core business income for the next 2 years, cash generation out of aal.

Originally Posted by 7GCBC_yawn

If I were REX i'd get legal, once aal have them in there, they will go live with the Terminal at Rex's expense.

[sprucegoose]

I don't get the gate numbering system. Why have a 14L and 14R? what was wrong with sequential numbering?

[SkySista]

Reading the pax comments on the Rex website, fair enough, the walk is too long for elderly/immobile...

but... airbridges for Metros/JetstreamsSAABs? (whatever they're using these days...) Err... is this done anywhere else? Would love to see the logistics in hooking a Metro to a bridge... hahaha....

Seriously though, couldn't they have some sort of buggy-train system (you know, those golf cart thingies with trailers on for people to sit in.... at least then they could ferry the less mobile pax around...

Anyone got a diagram of this new layout vs the old one?? I'll go Google it now, maybe my mental picture on reading the article isn't totally correct...

[Captahab]

Originally Posted by Deejay 1

Turbantime
I think only Rex regional passengers are having issues, not regional passengers per se.
Last time I looked the following flew to:
QFLink Port Lincoln, Kingscote
O'Connor Whyalla, Mt Gambier, Mildura and Port Augusta
Rex fly to all of the above except Mildura and Port Augusta, therefore the public has a choice of who to fly.
QfLink and o;connor pax grumbling???? Not that I've seen or heard.

Maybe the fact that REX carry 95% of the sum total of all of the above may justify their insistence on maintaining the standard that got them that got them those numbers in the first place.
Ahab

[aviator's_anonymous]

Well, basically anybody that flies into Adelaide from an unsecure aerodrome has to do the "cattle walk" and get security screened upon arrival at the new terminal. It's not just Rex. I feel for all the regional flyers, especially the ones coming off the National Jet flights on the BAE146. They actually get hooked up to the aerobridge, walk up the aerobridge, just to walk down again to get airside while they are escorted around to the "cattle walk" to get to the security screening point. And if rex thought the security screening point wait for passangers were long on their saab/metro flights upon arrival... the 146 has over 70 pax on a full flight...so i bet the security wait ain't the shortest for them... but then, after all the beeping and taking shoes/belts off due to the over sensitive sensors.. they then have to walk up stairs again....just to get back into the terminal. Then there's the 400-600m walk to the esculators down to the arrivals hall just to collect their luggage.. (a revenue raising design for retail perhaps?... they could have designed it so passengers didn't have to re-enter the terminal to pass all the retail shops, rather than a direct route to the baggage claim area?)

Also Re: Sprucegoose L and R bays....it's so when there's a bigger jet say on a bay to the left....a smaller jet can still park in the bay next to it on the right...but it has to be positioned on the bay "Right".. if that makes sense.. there's a whole guide to what planes can be situated next to each other for wingtip clearances and all... saw it somewhere, have to find it again...

And just to stay "on track" with this post... i would have to probably say, no...this terminal probably wasn't the best thought out terminal around. Some nice things about it, but lacking in many areas too...

[V1OOPS]

Originally Posted by aviator's_anonymous

... collect their luggage.. (a revenue raising design for retail perhaps?... they could have designed it so passengers didn't have to re-enter the terminal to pass all the retail shops, rather than a direct route to the baggage claim area?)

Right about the retail aspect. Retailers were promised xx pax/hour past their stores, so AAL obliged by creating a design to match maximum exposure, feeding in the regionals at each end.

Compared to what they've already walked from the aircraft, inbound regional pax are security scanned within a relatively short distance of the baggage carousels - at the Qantas end less than 100m and maybe 150m for Rex pax. However AAL insists they queue for a screening that would be quite unnecessarily if they could avoid the trip upstairs (more lift queues) to the shops just so they can queue for the escalators back down and catch their bags that arrived on the carousel 10 minutes earlier for many.

Two Saabs arriving together isn't unusual considering the delay imposed by AAL/DOTARS, so like the 146 at the southern end, a protracted full 'shoes off' screening awaits 70 impatient customers typically heading outside. In fact the tail ends of these longer queues are often still 'outside' in the cold/hot, dirty/smelly (did the builders use it for something else?), grey/gloomy cattle race. A better description for it would be 'a culvert up to 250m long that allows tarmac runoff to flow in and accumulate underfoot with no internal drainage, no emergency exits and frequently locked or occasionally jammed (30+deg) metal doors blocking progress'. They're abysmal, dangerous and demeaning, and the architech of these metal tubes should be put in stocks for a week within rotten fruit range of the pax.

The simplicity of an immediate unscreened exit to the outside compared to the expensive, labour instensive and convoluted journey provided by AAL is patently obvious to every passenger using a regional into the new terminal. The old building worked way better for them and hence Rex's public threat to return if things weren't remedied in AAL's poorly sited, poorly conceived, poorly designed and poorly built (fuel) cash cow.

[turbantime]

Why the heck are PAX required to be screened on arrival from an unsecure airport? What problem does that f*ing solve? They going to hijack the Taxi on their way home? Geez this security ****e needs a shakeup.

[Capn Bloggs]

Unbelievable!

[Mr McGoo]

Regional Pax have to be screened because they may be transferring to an interstate flight, or they might pass on a prohibited item to someone who is already in the sterile area.

[Grog Frog]

Why not bring Regionals in at ground level straight to baggage reclaim, thereby bypassing security requirements?
BTW in the current setup do outgoing and incoming regional pax share the same cattle crush at the same time. If they do then incoming “non-sterile” pax are contaminating the screened and therefore sterile outgoing pax.

[Captahab]

Originally Posted by Mr McGoo

Regional Pax have to be screened because they may be transferring to an interstate flight, or they might pass on a prohibited item to someone who is already in the sterile area.

Not quite the case, they can only pick up their baggage outside of security and therefore have to go back through security anyway.
What seems to be happening now is that they come off a SAAB or 146, go through security....throught the terminal past the shops.....out of the secure area to downstairs and pick up their baggage and then they have to come back through the security again to access an interstate flight.
All that the regionals want is that their customers go straight to the baggage belt area and then the 10% or so that may be going interstate can proceed to security as if they had just driven up to the airport.

Passengers arriving from a country town for a doctors or other appointment in ADL should'nt have to stand in a galvanised tunnel with another 60 to 100 people lined up ahead at security when they dont want(need) to enter the secure area in the first place.

The way that regional passengers are being directed (past the shops) and re-directed at the moment is simply disgusting.

Any regional such as REX etc that does'nt speak up and attempt to do something does not deserve to be carrying fare paying passengers because they are not attempting to provide adequate duty of care.

The management of AAL have forgotten that it is a flamin airport, not bloody Rundle Mall.

AHAB

[Jungmeister]

Originally Posted by sprucegoose

I don't get the gate numbering system. Why have a 14L and 14R? what was wrong with sequential numbering?

The original concept was that the gates and aerobridges were able to be used by both Medium and Heavy aircraft. The spacing is such that each bay accepts two Medium (14L and 14R) or one Heavy (14C?). I haven't seen the final product in action but I assume that loading for the Heavy would be via a single gate. I don't know how the aerobridges are utilised, but I suspect that the Heavy would be loaded via a single aerobridge only.
This "Multi User" function allows more flexiblity, utilising the normal vacant International stands for Domestic operations. It also allows for increased use of Wide bodied aircraft on domestic service.
Has anyone experienced delays on the taxiway system with RWY 05 or RWY 30 only in use? I think that the first week of operation has all been on RWY 23.

[aviator's_anonymous]

Originally Posted by Grog Frog

BTW in the current setup do outgoing and incoming regional pax share the same cattle crush at the same time. If they do then incoming “non-sterile” pax are contaminating the screened and therefore sterile outgoing pax.

I beleive on the Rex end, the "cattle run" is divided in half... half for incoming, and half for outgoing pax?? Correct me if i'm wrong..i haven't been down the Rex end before...
I do know that on the other end at Gate 50, Qlink and O'connor have to ensure that if they are boarding pax, that no incoming aircraft have pax crossing paths while they are boarding. I don't think it has been a major problem as of yet down that end due to Qlink and O'connor not having that many flights in at the same time.

Originally Posted by V1OOPS

The simplicity of an immediate unscreened exit to the outside compared to the expensive, labour instensive and convoluted journey provided by AAL is patently obvious to every passenger using a regional into the new terminal.

I feel for the Qlink Dash's Pax and O'connor pax coming off their aircrafts today. They both came in only minutes after the NJS 146 with a full pax load, so there were definately a few backed up at security.
Funny thing, while all pax were waiting to get screened to go back INTO the terminal today, they had to wait there and watch as the ground crew and aircrew swiped their access cards and walked out the exit immediately to the carpark/arrival's area. I think one security personnel had to stop one pax from leaving the area? It really is a bad set up... *sigh*

[V1OOPS]

Originally Posted by aviator's_anonymous

I beleive on the Rex end, the "cattle run" is divided in half... half for incoming, and half for outgoing pax?? Correct me if i'm wrong..i haven't been down the Rex end before...(

It is a seriously divided 'cattle run' with floor to ceiling sheet metal and girders ensuring not even water passes under the divider wall - hence tarmac rain/fuel runoff and exhaust/wind blown debris collects against the inside wall. You couldn't have made a more effective debris trap, but this one also traps pax on a hot day.

Funny thing, while all pax were waiting to get screened to go back INTO the terminal today, they had to wait there and watch as the ground crew and aircrew swiped their access cards and walked out the exit immediately to the carpark/arrival's area. I think one security personnel had to stop one pax from leaving the area? It really is a bad set up... *sigh*:

Quite right and I don't blame them trying to save a strip search and long trip past the newsagent. The inbound pre-screening entry/waiting area is also the delivery bay 'checkpoint' with panoramic windows and automated glass doors revealing a corner of the pax baggage claim area, and maybe their friends, just 60m away across a small car park - all streetside and as 'unsecure' as these inbound pax. In fact anyone waiting for friends could wander over and get in an early greeting through the glass - no signs or fences to suggest they can't.

So why not let them out?

[aviator's_anonymous]

Re: Rex's Website Media Relsease on the 13th Febuary, 2006.

According to their Press relase on the 13th of February, 2006.
http://www.rex.com.au/corp_info/ShowNews.aspx?nid=59
Rex are Happy Following Talks with AAL>?
Does Anyone know of what outcomes resulted from these Talks and what things have been implemented?

[missleadfoot]

Where are the Quick Check machines? I would have thought they would be standard in a brand new terminal.

[aviator's_anonymous]

If you're talking about Virgin Blue's Auto check-in...they're right there in the departure hall....can't really miss it. If it's Qantas's...not sure if they have it here in Adelaide. But if u don't have any luggage, you can go straight through security to their service desk inside the sterile area and get your boarding pass without having to line up.

One thing i do want to know tho! Who on earth designed the automatic sliding doors at the end of the "cattle walk" into security area at arrival Gate 51? They have no sensors on it, so Passangers who want to let themselves in to security screening...can't... only someone who has a building access pass can let you in...and if someone does swipe you in, the door only opens for...20 seconds max? before it closes and you have to swipe it again to open it! And if the door happens to shut on you, gawd help you! Cuz if you happen to get trapped or pinched by it...there are no sensors on it like elevator doors which will sense it has hit something and open up again...it will just keep closing! Law suit waiting to happen?