CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
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CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Some of the issues I see from the New Cost recovery policy of the government.
1. What will the cost be for a small operator to have their delegates checked by CASA where the controlling office is not co-located with the operator. Will travel and accommodation be charged as well? True cost recovery!
2. The expectation that one gets a service if they are paying for it. Meaning what is the cost where a delegate fails a check. Is the company to keep paying out?
3. With this in mind, what if a CASA delegate has it in for an operator and gets back at them through the charging system.
4. Is CASA now an impartial organisation purely involved with safety, or will it become a defacto SE Asian regulator where anything is possible as long an money changes hands?
I am not saying this any of these situations will happen, but histroy shows that whenever changes take place of this magnitude, not every situation has been thought through.
1. What will the cost be for a small operator to have their delegates checked by CASA where the controlling office is not co-located with the operator. Will travel and accommodation be charged as well? True cost recovery!
2. The expectation that one gets a service if they are paying for it. Meaning what is the cost where a delegate fails a check. Is the company to keep paying out?
3. With this in mind, what if a CASA delegate has it in for an operator and gets back at them through the charging system.
4. Is CASA now an impartial organisation purely involved with safety, or will it become a defacto SE Asian regulator where anything is possible as long an money changes hands?
I am not saying this any of these situations will happen, but histroy shows that whenever changes take place of this magnitude, not every situation has been thought through.
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
http://casa.gov.au/corporat/fees/index.htm
They reckon that they'll cut the fuel excise by a few percent, I can see how this'd help operators. But that isn't proposed till 'round 2008.
I don't think it will happen though, they're too greedy.
They reckon that they'll cut the fuel excise by a few percent, I can see how this'd help operators. But that isn't proposed till 'round 2008.
I don't think it will happen though, they're too greedy.
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
niles I think CASA has become a defacto SE asian regulator, and anything is possible provided the colour of your money is right...
Grandpa Aerotart
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Fuel excise?
I am fairly sure Avgas attracts no such tax...at least according to Air BP when I asked them a few years ago....Avtur may well do but I know not.
Anyone know what the exact %s are?
It seems such secret squirell information that I would not be at all surprised to find the Govt suggesting they will reduce it but then not do it after all...because of extenuating circumstances of course
The Govt is awash with money from the GST etc that we pay on all aviation spending from fuel to maps...and yet they continue to tax us.
What we need is ALL GST collected from Aviation be put back into Aviation. Like the Trust they have in the US.
User pays?
We do already and always have...multitudinous times over!
I am fairly sure Avgas attracts no such tax...at least according to Air BP when I asked them a few years ago....Avtur may well do but I know not.
Anyone know what the exact %s are?
It seems such secret squirell information that I would not be at all surprised to find the Govt suggesting they will reduce it but then not do it after all...because of extenuating circumstances of course
The Govt is awash with money from the GST etc that we pay on all aviation spending from fuel to maps...and yet they continue to tax us.
What we need is ALL GST collected from Aviation be put back into Aviation. Like the Trust they have in the US.
User pays?
We do already and always have...multitudinous times over!
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
http://www.ato.gov.au/businesses/con...tm&page=12&H12 shows the current Gasoline
rate as $0.02854 per litre.
The 2002 Fuel Tax Inquiry report http://fueltaxinquiry.treasury.gov.a...rt/default.asp in Feb 2002
Casa's proposed 8% phased reduction in the excise starting in 2008 would reduce the excise to around 2.62c/litre, resulting in an astounding saving of around 13c/hour in fuel for most GA.
Excises, levies, duties, GST, imposts et all... they're all just different names for taxation
For use as aircraft fuel
The 2002 Fuel Tax Inquiry report http://fueltaxinquiry.treasury.gov.a...rt/default.asp in Feb 2002
Aviation gasoline (Avgas) and aviation turbine fuel (Avtur) are excised at 2.808 and 2.845 cents per litre respectively.
Excises, levies, duties, GST, imposts et all... they're all just different names for taxation
Last edited by Biggles_in_Oz; 8th Jan 2006 at 05:02. Reason: current ATO rate
Grandpa Aerotart
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
You're correct. I was thinking about the old style fuel tax not a small excise...Air BP did in fact tell me there was only a several cents/liter excise.
Quite amazing really. Mogas taxed hugely (75% or something similar?) is still cheaper than Avgas which is hardly taxed at all...economies of scale at work!
That aside Australia is far and away the most over taxed, over regulated society in the world...and we get less and less value for those taxes as time goes by.
A govt with an $11.5 Billion surplus who still thinks it needs to privatise more and turn more public services into private monopolies needs a wake up call...but the system is not designed to allow that.
Democracy at work?
I don't think so.
Quite amazing really. Mogas taxed hugely (75% or something similar?) is still cheaper than Avgas which is hardly taxed at all...economies of scale at work!
That aside Australia is far and away the most over taxed, over regulated society in the world...and we get less and less value for those taxes as time goes by.
A govt with an $11.5 Billion surplus who still thinks it needs to privatise more and turn more public services into private monopolies needs a wake up call...but the system is not designed to allow that.
Democracy at work?
I don't think so.
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Will they charge for ramp checks too?
CASA: Mr xxx we are here to do a ramp check. Please show us your licence, charts etc.
Me: Sorry, I don't have any money on me, can we do this some other time?
CASA: Mr xxx we are here to do a ramp check. Please show us your licence, charts etc.
Me: Sorry, I don't have any money on me, can we do this some other time?
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Quote for CFI Instructor Rating Renewal - $540.00
ATO approval for Gr1 Instructor - passed 14th Octber, 2005 - constantly told on CEO's desk for the past 4 weeks.
ATO approval for Gr1 Instructor - passed 14th Octber, 2005 - constantly told on CEO's desk for the past 4 weeks.
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
turbantime, I'll give it a go next time and tell you what happens 
$130 for an endo!!
If you do a twin endo with a constant speed and Retract well that cost $390?
Nah that can't be right
$130 for an endo!!
If you do a twin endo with a constant speed and Retract well that cost $390?
Nah that can't be right
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
If you do a twin endo with a constant speed and Retract well that cost $390? Nah that can't be right
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Isn't it a user pays situation? they require me to have a licence, they require me to have a medical, they require me to have endorsments listed on my licence, they require they photo licence, they require me to have the asic card and associated security checks, not to mention the DG awareness certificate. I can fly just as good and just as effeciently without any of the above. they should pay for it.
Maybe, next time I fill out a logbook entry (they require it) or a CAO 48 record (they require it) a pax manifest (they require it) or any other associated CASA required paper work, I should send them an invoice. And do you really think they will pay $130 per hour?. who gets that sort of money in this industry?.
Sure glad we have a $11.5 billion surplus........don't know why, but sure I sure am glad.
Maybe, next time I fill out a logbook entry (they require it) or a CAO 48 record (they require it) a pax manifest (they require it) or any other associated CASA required paper work, I should send them an invoice. And do you really think they will pay $130 per hour?. who gets that sort of money in this industry?.
Sure glad we have a $11.5 billion surplus........don't know why, but sure I sure am glad.
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
tipsy 2, they are still expenses that have to come out of our pocket, and the less you earn(like me), the less effective the tax deduction.
HTF can CASA say that it costs $130 for someone to type is a few letters on your licence to add an endo, then print it off and mail it out, it wouldn't take 5 mins. I have been at the counter and watched them add an endo to my licence and give me my new licence 30 secs latter.
F***
HTF can CASA say that it costs $130 for someone to type is a few letters on your licence to add an endo, then print it off and mail it out, it wouldn't take 5 mins. I have been at the counter and watched them add an endo to my licence and give me my new licence 30 secs latter.
F***
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Strewth tipsy, last time I pat you in a hamock. Traitor.
I guess they won't mind paying me on my invoice then. After all, its an expenditure required to run the business and that makes them able to claim it as a tax refund.
I guess they won't mind paying me on my invoice then. After all, its an expenditure required to run the business and that makes them able to claim it as a tax refund.
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
When I filled out the forms for the ASIC I noted in the appropriate box that it took me 2 hours to complete it (running around getting photos, someone to witness it, posting, it actually took longer). I've invoiced CASA for the postage, cost of the photos and two hours of my time.
Waiting to see if anyone at CASA is silly enough to forward payment.
Waiting to see if anyone at CASA is silly enough to forward payment.
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Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
The budgie is "Waiting to see if anyone at CASA is silly enough to forward payment."
Mostly CASA are not that silly. Now if you have sent it to the pilyaks in the OLC you can definately expect payment by return mail. Yes they are that silly
Wiz, you behave or I'll tell some stories
tipsy
Mostly CASA are not that silly. Now if you have sent it to the pilyaks in the OLC you can definately expect payment by return mail. Yes they are that silly
Wiz, you behave or I'll tell some stories
tipsy
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
CASA has to recover costs, but there are two sides to every coin - which is why it is a crying shame that we do not have an effective organisation representing pilots and operators.
Let me explain. The other side of the coin of "user pays" is that "User says". In other words, if we have to pay for a service, then we can actually have a greater say on the content and quality of the service. However we need a proper organisation to represent our interests to CASA on a constructive "win/win" basis.
In other words, CASA has to recover costs. What costs does CASA incur that we can help them reduce, thereby saving CASA and of course ourselves money?
I'm sure all of you can put your thinking caps on and come up with sensible suggestions. For a start, does CASA have an internal cost reduction program? Then we need an industry body that can engage with CASA and look at areas where we can jointly reduce waste and streamline processes.
Another example. Why do we have annual (or biannual) reviews and medicals? What would the operational effect be if those periods were lengthened by six months? That would equate to about an 18% immediate cost reduction I think.
Let me explain. The other side of the coin of "user pays" is that "User says". In other words, if we have to pay for a service, then we can actually have a greater say on the content and quality of the service. However we need a proper organisation to represent our interests to CASA on a constructive "win/win" basis.
In other words, CASA has to recover costs. What costs does CASA incur that we can help them reduce, thereby saving CASA and of course ourselves money?
I'm sure all of you can put your thinking caps on and come up with sensible suggestions. For a start, does CASA have an internal cost reduction program? Then we need an industry body that can engage with CASA and look at areas where we can jointly reduce waste and streamline processes.
Another example. Why do we have annual (or biannual) reviews and medicals? What would the operational effect be if those periods were lengthened by six months? That would equate to about an 18% immediate cost reduction I think.
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Don't forget that these are all 'work related expences' to be claimed back at tax time.
tipsy
tipsy
There are CAA's in Africa that are more efficient than CA$A, charge you 10bucks to put an endorsement and guess what it takes about 3 mins to do and print out same as in oz. Unless the price of paper, ink and electricity has soared to level where it costs the $130 to put an endo on your license i cant really see any cost recovery but a hell of a lot of profit..
I can see another europe happening here which is basically the end of GA and aviation only being for the rich not the real enthusiest..
Re: CASA Cost Recovery - The Ramifications
Sunfish you're correct about GA having no effective representation. It's a mess. Tipsy, no CASA aren't that silly but one can live in hope regards the payment.
I now expect to recieve my ASIC sometime in March 2007 for being such a smartarse.
I now expect to recieve my ASIC sometime in March 2007 for being such a smartarse.