Qantas - Distasteful?
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Qantas - Distasteful?
Qantas has announced its 2005 profit projection is even higher than 2004.
At the same time it appears its Board and CEO seem to be losing touch with reality, or are they?
To me there are a number of logical disconnects in its business strategy.
1. Continually pressuring its staff on wage cuts and EBA's - by crying poor while making record profits. Announcing a plan to offshore 7000 jobs and a week later increasing its profit projections.
I would have thought this must have a negative effect on staff morale.
2. The Jetstar Asia thing - which is apparently already running into trouble.
I guess my concern is that Qantas has the lions share of capacity into and out of Australia - a left over from Government ownership. Its profits come not from being more efficient, or having smarter management than other airlines, but from its monopoly of capacity.
As a result, Qantas is a highly political animal with very very strong ties to NSW governments of all persuasions, a a fact that has concerned me for a very long time because of its implications for regional airservices and regional development.
I also note that Qantas's largest shareholder is hidden by a nominee company.
While I admit to being entranced by conspiracy theories since the days of working for murdoch/abeles at AN, I cannot but wonder if Australian QF staff, Qantas Shareholders in general and the Australian public are being set up?
By this I mean :- QF staff, your jobs will be outsourced to the lowest tenderer.
QF shareholders: You may be in for a rocky ride. I wonder if a "takeover" offer might surface one day? Maybe even taking QF private?
The general public: We are already paying premium prices for a less than average product, we have done it for thirty years at least. How long is the QF monopoly going to be allowed to continue?
Given the totally complaisant nature of the Howard Government, and the fact that the PM is still a NSW politician, as is Anderson, I expect we are all going to get royally screwed. The QF Board has very strong political connections - and the means to use it.
My predictions: - Singapore will get the minimum capacity on the Pacific route to keep the Singaporean Government happy, if they get anything at all.
Jetstar Asia? My guess is it will be a financial disaster, unless of course Singapore and Qantas do a deal (see item 1.)
QF Australian staff? You are going to get screwed over yet again - dont bother to tell the media, they are in bed with QF.
A380? Even though Melbourne Airport will be ready before Sydney, just watch QF's efforts to ensure that no one flies an A380 to MEL, especially before SYD is ready. You should have heard Max the Axe talking on radio the other day about this, talk about a true son of Sydney!
P.S. Question for QF Will it be possible to run an A380 into and out of Australia WITHOUT passing through Sydney for a TFC or equivalent? My guess is not bloody likely.
At the same time it appears its Board and CEO seem to be losing touch with reality, or are they?
To me there are a number of logical disconnects in its business strategy.
1. Continually pressuring its staff on wage cuts and EBA's - by crying poor while making record profits. Announcing a plan to offshore 7000 jobs and a week later increasing its profit projections.
I would have thought this must have a negative effect on staff morale.
2. The Jetstar Asia thing - which is apparently already running into trouble.
I guess my concern is that Qantas has the lions share of capacity into and out of Australia - a left over from Government ownership. Its profits come not from being more efficient, or having smarter management than other airlines, but from its monopoly of capacity.
As a result, Qantas is a highly political animal with very very strong ties to NSW governments of all persuasions, a a fact that has concerned me for a very long time because of its implications for regional airservices and regional development.
I also note that Qantas's largest shareholder is hidden by a nominee company.
While I admit to being entranced by conspiracy theories since the days of working for murdoch/abeles at AN, I cannot but wonder if Australian QF staff, Qantas Shareholders in general and the Australian public are being set up?
By this I mean :- QF staff, your jobs will be outsourced to the lowest tenderer.
QF shareholders: You may be in for a rocky ride. I wonder if a "takeover" offer might surface one day? Maybe even taking QF private?
The general public: We are already paying premium prices for a less than average product, we have done it for thirty years at least. How long is the QF monopoly going to be allowed to continue?
Given the totally complaisant nature of the Howard Government, and the fact that the PM is still a NSW politician, as is Anderson, I expect we are all going to get royally screwed. The QF Board has very strong political connections - and the means to use it.
My predictions: - Singapore will get the minimum capacity on the Pacific route to keep the Singaporean Government happy, if they get anything at all.
Jetstar Asia? My guess is it will be a financial disaster, unless of course Singapore and Qantas do a deal (see item 1.)
QF Australian staff? You are going to get screwed over yet again - dont bother to tell the media, they are in bed with QF.
A380? Even though Melbourne Airport will be ready before Sydney, just watch QF's efforts to ensure that no one flies an A380 to MEL, especially before SYD is ready. You should have heard Max the Axe talking on radio the other day about this, talk about a true son of Sydney!
P.S. Question for QF Will it be possible to run an A380 into and out of Australia WITHOUT passing through Sydney for a TFC or equivalent? My guess is not bloody likely.
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Sunfish
The 7,000 figure did not come from QF. No 'target has been set and no decisions have been made.
Still waiting for you to tell us where this monoploy is .
Seven new DH8- Q300's delivered to QantasLink last year and another seven DH8 - Q400's plus 10 options just ordered in biggest ever order for the QF regional airline. Don't think you need concern yourself there.
As above , still waiting for you to tell us where this monopoly is. perhaps you could indicate on what routes.
The announced A380 LAX - MEL service answers your question to QF.
Since your arrival on this forum you have unmercilessly lashed QF with misinformation and somewhat weird conspiracy theories. One would have thought that with your self proclaimed ex - CEO status you would have some idea of business management practices.
You have told us that you had not flown on QF for three years , have you managed to aquaint yourself recently with the product you so vigourously deride.
Announcing a plan to offshore 7,000 jobs
monopoly of capacity
(concern about) implications for regional airservices and regional development
How long is the QF monopoly going to be allowed to continue
The announced A380 LAX - MEL service answers your question to QF.
Since your arrival on this forum you have unmercilessly lashed QF with misinformation and somewhat weird conspiracy theories. One would have thought that with your self proclaimed ex - CEO status you would have some idea of business management practices.
You have told us that you had not flown on QF for three years , have you managed to aquaint yourself recently with the product you so vigourously deride.
Gee, who would have thought that Australia's oldest city, situated in Australia's largest state population wise (roughly 1/4 of Australia's population) would receive most of the services coming in from overseas...? 
Especially given that it is a premier toursit destination in its own right as one of the worlds most photogenic cities....
I'd suggest it's time you GET OVER IT Sunfish - go & do some study for your PPL...
Especially given that it is a premier toursit destination in its own right as one of the worlds most photogenic cities.... I'd suggest it's time you GET OVER IT Sunfish - go & do some study for your PPL...
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Not quite....
Allow me to add my bit. Two bits actually:
Yes you're absolutely right slumfish. The gov't should ensure our other international carrier gets an equal share. And they would be??? Keerist. Or maybe the gov't should ensure a foreign competitor is given a bigger slice of the action than has already been lost?
What are you on man???
The corporation that slumfish was the CEO of:
Must be a non-VMC day down at the dero club...
PS: If ya gonna troll, at least make it something funny.
Allow me to add my bit. Two bits actually:
Qantas has the lions share of capacity into and out of Australia
Or maybe the gov't should ensure a foreign competitor is given a bigger slice of the action than has already been lost? What are you on man???
The corporation that slumfish was the CEO of:
Must be a non-VMC day down at the dero club...
PS: If ya gonna troll, at least make it something funny.
Nunc est bibendum
Sunfish, I've often enjoyed a lot of your posts. You seem to know a bit about the marketing and management side of things and your comments have been the occasional wake up call for both the management side of the airline industry (if they bother reading) and the pilot/unionised side of the airline industry (if they bother comprehending what they read).
However, this rant does you no justice and this constant harping on about QF being 'sydney centric' or 'monopolising' the airways has got to stop. Last I checked (about 18 months ago), QF had less than 40% of the inbound traffic to Australia. You may want to compare that with SQ's figures for Singapore, Malaysia's figures for them and Thai's figures for Thailand. I think you'd find that QF has more competition than any of them.
As for being 'sydney centric', I'm not sure how that explains that a bunch of my trips next roster have me positioning to ADL, PER, BNE and MEL to operate services that originate from there. I think we serve most states in Australia pretty well. I'd like to see us do better on some (ADL-HKG, ADL-SIN direct instead of via DRW, ADL-BLI, ADL-Tasman although I think we've started a few of those!) and so on) but I reckon we give most destinations a fair shake.
Anyway, you need to chill a bit more, take the anti Sydney and QF chip off the shoulder and have a wider look at the industry.
(You are however spot on about the moral at QF. Not flash and not going north anytime soon!
)
However, this rant does you no justice and this constant harping on about QF being 'sydney centric' or 'monopolising' the airways has got to stop. Last I checked (about 18 months ago), QF had less than 40% of the inbound traffic to Australia. You may want to compare that with SQ's figures for Singapore, Malaysia's figures for them and Thai's figures for Thailand. I think you'd find that QF has more competition than any of them.
As for being 'sydney centric', I'm not sure how that explains that a bunch of my trips next roster have me positioning to ADL, PER, BNE and MEL to operate services that originate from there. I think we serve most states in Australia pretty well. I'd like to see us do better on some (ADL-HKG, ADL-SIN direct instead of via DRW, ADL-BLI, ADL-Tasman although I think we've started a few of those!) and so on) but I reckon we give most destinations a fair shake.
Anyway, you need to chill a bit more, take the anti Sydney and QF chip off the shoulder and have a wider look at the industry.
(You are however spot on about the moral at QF. Not flash and not going north anytime soon!
)
Thread Starter
Jeez, that got you stirred up.
Hanoi, 40% share constitutes a monopoly position in any industry because the rest is spread about through multiple small players in the Australian market. So yes, Qantas has a dominant market position.
I have no qualms about Sydney being a nice city, however I would like to make my point below:
Try looking at Qantas's North American website and try and schedule direct flights from any place to Melbourne and Sydney.
Take for example, leaving LAX for MEL and SYD on 26th January returning 23 rd February
this is what you get for Sydney
Los Angeles to Sydney - return for 1 adult
Total Price*
(USD)
Date
Flight
From
To
Duration
Aircraft
Fare Class
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF012
Los Angeles
22:30 Sydney
08:00 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF107
Sydney
12:35 Los Angeles
07:00 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF012
Los Angeles
22:30 Sydney
08:00 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF011
Sydney
15:20 Los Angeles
09:45 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF108
Los Angeles
23:45 Sydney
09:15 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF107
Sydney
12:35 Los Angeles
07:00 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF108
Los Angeles
23:45 Sydney
09:15 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF011
Sydney
15:20 Los Angeles
09:45 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$3055.14
Wed 26 Jan 05
Flight operated by another carrier QF3060
Los Angeles
18:30 Honolulu
22:23 29h 30m
767-300
Economy
Qantas flight QF004
Honolulu
11:55 (Thu) Sydney
19:00 (Fri) 747-300
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF107
Sydney
12:35 Los Angeles
07:00 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$3055.14
Wed 26 Jan 05
Flight operated by another carrier QF3060
Los Angeles
18:30 Honolulu
22:23 29h 30m
767-300
Economy
Qantas flight QF004
Honolulu
11:55 (Thu) Sydney
19:00 (Fri) 747-300
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF011
Sydney
15:20 Los Angeles
09:45 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted.
For Melbourne you get "we cannot find a solution for this itinerary".
From conversations with a few friends overseas over a number of years I find it is hard, if not impossible to get direct flights to and from any capital city without passing through Sydney inbound or outbound - yes there are direct flights, but they are always full well in advance.
The net effect of this is a skewing of overseas investment dollars into NSW at the expense of the rest of the country because after 20+ hours in an aircraft ANYONE will get off ANYWHERE.
To put it another way folks. If for some bizarre reason Qantas was hubbing out of Hobart, then that state would have the lions share of overseas investment.
By the way, nobody has yet directly answered my previous question or contradicted me. Is it possible for any Qantas AC to arrive and leave australia without going through Sydney for a maintenance check? What about the A380 as well? If it isn't, then it proves my point.
Hanoi, 40% share constitutes a monopoly position in any industry because the rest is spread about through multiple small players in the Australian market. So yes, Qantas has a dominant market position.
I have no qualms about Sydney being a nice city, however I would like to make my point below:
Try looking at Qantas's North American website and try and schedule direct flights from any place to Melbourne and Sydney.
Take for example, leaving LAX for MEL and SYD on 26th January returning 23 rd February
this is what you get for Sydney
Los Angeles to Sydney - return for 1 adult
Total Price*
(USD)
Date
Flight
From
To
Duration
Aircraft
Fare Class
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF012
Los Angeles
22:30 Sydney
08:00 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF107
Sydney
12:35 Los Angeles
07:00 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF012
Los Angeles
22:30 Sydney
08:00 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF011
Sydney
15:20 Los Angeles
09:45 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF108
Los Angeles
23:45 Sydney
09:15 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF107
Sydney
12:35 Los Angeles
07:00 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$1068.11
Wed 26 Jan 05
Qantas flight QF108
Los Angeles
23:45 Sydney
09:15 (Fri) 14h 30m
747-400
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF011
Sydney
15:20 Los Angeles
09:45 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$3055.14
Wed 26 Jan 05
Flight operated by another carrier QF3060
Los Angeles
18:30 Honolulu
22:23 29h 30m
767-300
Economy
Qantas flight QF004
Honolulu
11:55 (Thu) Sydney
19:00 (Fri) 747-300
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF107
Sydney
12:35 Los Angeles
07:00 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted
$3055.14
Wed 26 Jan 05
Flight operated by another carrier QF3060
Los Angeles
18:30 Honolulu
22:23 29h 30m
767-300
Economy
Qantas flight QF004
Honolulu
11:55 (Thu) Sydney
19:00 (Fri) 747-300
Economy restricted
Wed 23 Feb 05
Qantas flight QF011
Sydney
15:20 Los Angeles
09:45 13h 25m
747-400
Economy restricted.
For Melbourne you get "we cannot find a solution for this itinerary".
From conversations with a few friends overseas over a number of years I find it is hard, if not impossible to get direct flights to and from any capital city without passing through Sydney inbound or outbound - yes there are direct flights, but they are always full well in advance.
The net effect of this is a skewing of overseas investment dollars into NSW at the expense of the rest of the country because after 20+ hours in an aircraft ANYONE will get off ANYWHERE.
To put it another way folks. If for some bizarre reason Qantas was hubbing out of Hobart, then that state would have the lions share of overseas investment.
By the way, nobody has yet directly answered my previous question or contradicted me. Is it possible for any Qantas AC to arrive and leave australia without going through Sydney for a maintenance check? What about the A380 as well? If it isn't, then it proves my point.
Sunfish you asked...
What does it matter? That is like asking if VB aircraft can avoid going to Brisbane for maintenance.
Is it possible for any Qantas AC to arrive and leave australia without going through Sydney for a maintenance check?
Thread Starter
Yes it does matter, and no one will answer my question.
It mattered when I was told that Qantas had a monopoly on 747 turnarounds (unless you were Singapore, Malaysian, Cathay or Air NZ) because it meant that every European or American AC had to go through Sydney on the way in, or the way out of Australia.
The three hour stop in Sydney biased foriegn investment NSW's way because people from New York and London were effectively being told the Melbourne and Brisbane (Let alone Adelaide) were three hours further away from the power centers of the globe than Sydney.
The reaction to my humble suggestion that AN break this monopoly and invest a little more when tooling up for the 767 was met with EXTREME anxiety by AN management I was simply told "Abeles will have our balls if we try to break the QF monopoly". You want a statutory declaration?
Listening to Max the Axe last week about the A380 preparations confirms this QF centric attitude is alive and well because it is the only good reason overseas investors have for locating a business in Sydney.
It mattered when I was told that Qantas had a monopoly on 747 turnarounds (unless you were Singapore, Malaysian, Cathay or Air NZ) because it meant that every European or American AC had to go through Sydney on the way in, or the way out of Australia.
The three hour stop in Sydney biased foriegn investment NSW's way because people from New York and London were effectively being told the Melbourne and Brisbane (Let alone Adelaide) were three hours further away from the power centers of the globe than Sydney.
The reaction to my humble suggestion that AN break this monopoly and invest a little more when tooling up for the 767 was met with EXTREME anxiety by AN management I was simply told "Abeles will have our balls if we try to break the QF monopoly". You want a statutory declaration?
Listening to Max the Axe last week about the A380 preparations confirms this QF centric attitude is alive and well because it is the only good reason overseas investors have for locating a business in Sydney.
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Listening to Max the Axe last week about the A380 preparations confirms this QF centric attitude is alive and well because it is the only good reason overseas investors have for locating a business in Sydney.
I'm sure you would have no problem with the "QF centric attitude" if they were based out of Melbourne!?
