QF pilots using "Guard" for chats!!!

[Ace on Base]

This is just PI$$ING me of no end - and its happening more frequently!!!

We listen out on this freq to possibly help some poor fella in trouble - not listen to their DRIVVLE

EVER heard of NUMBERS.... uno, 123.45

Anyone else have this problem (particularly around the southern region

Keep smiling sunshiners (unless you are a QF culprit!!)

[swh]

Ace,

Do us all a favour and let the AusSAR know when you hear the transmissions.

Each time they transmit on 121.5 the sat picks up the signal then manpower can be wasted trying to work out if its an aircraft down, missing hiker, missing vessle or something else.

I know in a few years 121.5 will not be used by the sats, but that time has not arrived yet.

Letting AusSAR know can help them eliminate a bogus signal from someone that actually needs help.

[Ace on Base]

Wilco, SWH!

Next time I will record time, place, and flight number to pass on to AusSAR, Then maybe something may be done to remind these culprits about what good airmanship is about and also radio ettiquete!!

I urge other Ppruners to do the same!

Keep Smiling Sunshiners!

[*Lancer*]

swh, do AusSAR still monitor 121.5? I was under the impression that the only ones listening these days were pilots... even maritime use different frequencies now.

[swh]

Lancer,

As far as I know yes... from the AMSA/AusSAR web site.

Please note: 121.5 MHz distress beacons will cease to operate from February 2009 when only 406 MHz beacons will be detected by the satellite system.

[bonvol]

Ace on Base. Post it on here.

Then we can put it on qrewroom for the dopes to really get embarrassed.

[Keg]

I haven't been around the domestos network much in recent times but I reckon that we've decreased our action on 121.5 on South East Asia over the last couple of years. I see the 'numbers' up a lot more now than I used to.

Instead of putting it up here, why don't you write a letter to the Chief Pilot? That'll get to more QF drivers than putting it on here will!

[Ace on Base]

Bonvol and Keg,

Why dont I put it "HERE" and send the Chief Pilot an email simultaniously!!!

then there should be double the embarasment and BUT KICKING!!!

[Capt Fathom]

It didn't take long for the annual 'which airline is chatting on 121.5' to get underway!
Next.

[Frank Burden]

From a 14 October 2004 (ie about three months ago not 12 months):

I spoke with my mate Swifty at AusSAR and he told me that ATS do not routinely monitor 121.5 MHz, some towers do have the capability using a handheld transceiver, and most aircraft B737 size above monitor the frequency in the cruise. AusSAR relies on Airservices and its ground air communications network to alert it when an emergency situation exists.

Just had a look a ICAO Annex 10, Vol V and it indicates 121.5 MHz is the aviation emergency channel and shall only be used 'for genuine emergency purposes' including its use as an operating frequency for distress beacons (that is ELTs, EPIRBs and PLBs).

The document goes on to say at 4.1.3.1.2 that 'the frequency 121.5 MHz shall be provided at:
a) all area control centres and flight information centres;
b) aerodrome control towers and approach control offices serving international aerodromes and international alternate aerodromes; and
c) any additional location designated by the appropriate ATS authority, where the provision of that frequency is considered necessary to ensure immediate reception of distress calls or to service the purposes specified [earlier].'

and, stating the bleeding obvious:

(4.1.3.1.4) 'The emergency channel shall be guarded continuously during the hours of service of the units at which it is installed.'

Swifty also told me that transmissions on 121.5 MHz can upset units homing to a radiating distress beacon so the frequency should only be used in an emergency. He also said that 406 MHz distress beacons also transmit a low powered 121.5 MHz signal for units to home to the distress beacon (the satellite won't be listening to this frequency from early 2009). But note, 121.5 MHz will remain the aviation distress frequency.

In short, only use 121.5 MHz for emergency situations, note that Airservices does not routinely monitor it (why?) except at some manned towers but not necessarily continuously, and many larger RPTs monitor the frequency in the cruise. So its usefulness in some areas when experiencing an emergency may be questionable and the frequency in use, the overlying ATS frequency if operating in G or the multicom frequency may be better options in these cases.

Thanks for the help Swifty.

Swifty in his drink told me that AusSAR is very much indebted to the high flyers (and for a rotor head that is difficult to swallow) that monitor 121.5 MHz and report distress beacon signals to Airservices to pass on to AusSAR . Unfortunately, the low end of town that are the major customers of the SAR services don't seem to give a toss for their fellow aviators. But then again, no one appreciates these things until it is their loved one out there.

I guess the bottom line is keep off 121.5 MHz unless it is related to an emergency situation. Chat somewhere else and the numbers or company are the best options. However, monitor 121.5 MHz if you have the radio capacity and advise Airservices or AusSAR directly via satphone (if you have the gear) if you hear a distress beacon or an emergency phase being declared by an aircraft.

By the way, Swify told me if it is furphie that the satellites picks up every transmission on 121.5 MHz as they are looking for a swept tone. I told him that my wife is too busy with the broom in the kitchen to be transmitting on VHF at the same time.

[Zarg]

Frank Burden has some really good info there, but I must admit in my 10 years in SAR with CAA and AusSAR, I have never met "Swifty" drunk or sober!

The Cospas-Sarsat Satellite System does not in fact pick up voice transmissions - we trialled it in 1996 - but these voice transmissions will certainly interfere with SAR aircraft homing on a beacon! So, STAY OFF IT UNLESS YOU NEED IT! 'Nuff said!

[Capn Bloggs]

Stop quacking on Guard you morons!

[Andu]

I look forward to testing the collective blood pressure of Prooners when we hear "The" QF XX passing the time of day with his mates on Guard.

Whilst on the subject, why do so many people (who are on a common frequency) chose to use Guard rather than the common freq to ask you to come up the numbers?

[blueloo]

I wouldnt be getting stuck into QF for a "THEQF XXX". I would say its very rare, and chances are if it does occur, it is because it is some individual wally with a carrot up his bum, and is likely the same away from flightdeck. The main culprit and the most frequent (very frequent) is THE SPEEDBIRD. It seems to be an ingrained habit from Nigel - he(she) just cant help himself!!!!!


Having said that, there are 2 separate threads in other forums on this, so no need to start another eh?

[TIMMEEEE]

All very true and frustrating to hear conversations on 121.5, but at the same time we have been called up numerous times on HF with the request to contact aircraft and pass on messages.

Often 123.45 doesnt cut it but yep, good ol 121.5 gets them virtually every time !
And yes, we get them to go to 123.45 to pass on the message.

And no, we dont call ourselves, ""The __" !!!

[DirectAnywhere]

It happens on 121.5 for the simple reason that most aircraft have 3 VHF comms. So why use guard I hear you say??

Comm1 is usually assigned the VHF ATC frequency.
Comm2 is - as a requirement of SOPS - tuned to 121.5

So what about Comm3 I hear you ask?? Comm3 is usually invisible from our point of view as it's being used by the ACARS and autotunes to the applicable ACARS frequency.

So, if you want to get in touch with a QF aircraft, or any other High Capacity RPT inflight for that matter, what is the one frequency they should all be monitoring? Yep, 121.5.

Personally, I only use 121.5 to tell the other aircraft to come up 123.45. But there is a reason to call on 121.5 as it's the only frequency everyone's usually monitoring.

Take a bex and have a good lie down, btw.

[The_Cutest_of_Borg]

QF actually DO call themselves "THE", but only on 123.45 or guard.

It's a shorthand thing. Instead of me saying "this is the Brisbane-Singapore daily", I say this "the QF51" or "the 51". QF pilots generally know where the callsigns are going to.

And yes I agree that any conversation on guard apart from trying to get an aircraft to go to 123.45 is unprofessional.

[BankAngle50]

You’ve got to understand it’s taken the poor long haul radio operator (SO) years to get into that seat and operate under so much VHF coverage. The excitement of talking on the radio will soon dissipate.

For those of us that have read our Jepps, another lovely *Unique to Australia---pilot to pilot Comms on 123.45.

[Captain Can't]

so BA50, how do you raise someone, who could well be on another area frequency and is not monitoring 123.45? Unless you are on HF and have two 'spare' VHFs, 121.50 is on the second... ??

i'm with DA.

[Ron & Edna Johns]

Well, who was wally the other day:

During the HF comms problems over the Pacific during the week, an aircraft was heard using the broadcast procedure on 121.5 as per international procedure. After the postion, FL, ETA, etc was broadcast, some joker was heard to transmit: "You're on guard"................

The first aircraft's Captain (obviously) then jumped on the line and said: "You idiot, he's meant to be!"

Well said, Captain!

Spare me, guys, there really are bigger, more important issues in life than to fret the use of 121.5