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Device found in Virgin Blue plane hold

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Old 22nd Sep 2004, 17:01
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Device found in Virgin Blue plane hold

Thurs "The Australian"

Device found in plane hold
By Charles Miranda
September 23, 2004

A POTENTIALLY explosive device has been found in the cargo bay of a jet at Sydney airport - and accidentally carried into the passenger terminal.

An initial NSW Police report has concluded the substance was thermite, a chemical used in grenades. It was found wrapped in a cardboard toilet roll tube with a firework sparkler attached as a 30-second fuse.

The Daily Telegraph has learned the device was discovered in a knotted plastic bag, along with matches, in the cargo hold of a Virgin Blue 737-300 jet by baggage handlers at 11.30am on Monday. But the find was kept quiet, with Australian Federal Police attempting to trace its origin.

A spokesman for Virgin last night played down the threat, declining to comment about the substance.

But he confirmed it was "a flammable substance, powder and matches" and Virgin was reviewing how staff inadvertently carried the package into the airport.

"The point to make is that the device was not checked baggage or hand luggage, that is, it was not screened and appears to have been left [in the aircraft] by someone with access to the airfield," he said.

Thermite is widely used by the military for its armour-piercing capabilities. It burns without oxygen at 3000C and melts metal on contact. Its civilian use includes welding.

The package was found lying loose in the baggage hold of the airliner on Monday on flight DJ-747 from Maroochydore to Sydney.

Despite handlers not knowing what the roll was, they carried it into the Mascot domestic passenger Terminal 2 to be X-rayed.

A NSW Police report has concluded it was a "non-electrical improvised explosive device [IED]" containing the compound thermite.

The AFP is now having the substance more throroughly analysed by laboratory technicians.

Investigators have not ruled out the possibility it was planted by a disgruntled airport or aircraft worker.

It may also have been designed to burn the plane while it was on the ground because it is impossible for passengers or crew to get into the plane's hold during flight.

Virgin is at the centre of an angry exchange over its handling of the incident. The airline failed to immediately alert the airport's security teams of the find, instead carrying it into the airport.

It was then that airport security were alerted who sounded an immediate "duress alert".

The package was then moved to a quarantined area in a valet car park, which was sealed off and the bomb squad called in.

A NSW Police spokesman last night confirmed police were not told of the incident until one hour and 40 minutes after the discovery.

A Sydney Airport Corporation spokeswoman confirmed there was an incident and said that while the airport had "strict protocols", she declined to comment on whether they were followed either by their own staff or Virgin's. She did confirm SACL was not told of the find until after NSW Police had been notified.

It is understood as NSW Police, the AFP and Australian Protective Service (APS) officers sought to search the aircraft, it took off for a scheduled flight to Ballina.

The jet was searched by police, along with sniffer dog squads, at 3.30pm when it returned to Sydney.

Police sources last night said they had "grave concerns" about how Virgin managed the incident.

The incident comes three months after a man left a note in toilets at Sydney airport threatening to "destroy" a terminal.

Qantas staff who found the note allowed the man to fly on to New Zealand and only alerted police after the aircraft had taken off.

* ASIO is checking the background on thousands of airport workers with access to sensitive areas, after authorities found security passes were being held by convicted criminals and sacked employees. The checks should have been completed by June 30 but the agency and AFP asked for an extension.

Thermite
* Thermite has been used in modern weaponry and as an incendiary device

* Is a mixture of aluminium powder and iron oxide. When the two substances ignite they burn at extremely high temperatures

* Used extensively to weld railway tracks

==========================================
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Old 22nd Sep 2004, 22:44
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Perhaps this thread should be attached to and filed under "Lack of Professionalism at Virgin Blue".

It was this however that really horrified me,


The ABC understands police were not called in for more than an hour after the device was discovered.
To further highlight VB's total lack of training of staff in bomb/suspicious article handling and the ultimate in terms of lack of awareness,

A Sydney newspaper has reported the device was carried into the terminal,
For over a year QF have trained ALL STAFF in security measures to deal with handling of suspicious articles.
It appears this is not the case at VB.

Looks like its time Virgin Blue haul their arse into the twenty first century where the possibility of terrorism is a real threat and could adversely affect themselves.

If it was a disgruntled staff member then it looks like Richard Branson needs fork out more pay, as it looks like the standard cheesy smile and group hug mentality just aint going to cut it.

CASA will be doing a full safety audit this time with full co-operation with the Australian Federal Police.
Whatever the outcomes, VB will have to lift their game and start spending more money on training of staff and procedural changes throughout the company because its quite obvious that no security attitude prevails.

Last edited by TIMMEEEE; 22nd Sep 2004 at 22:55.
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Old 22nd Sep 2004, 22:51
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First question: cui bono? There is only one group who would benefit from trouble at VB.
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Old 22nd Sep 2004, 23:08
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So please let me get this straight.
A suspicious article is discovered by baggage handlers and the conversation and actions are something like this:

Bloggs A : 'Hey this article looks suspicious and what the hell is it with this sparkler attached?'

Bloggs B : 'Dunno shags but lets pick up this suspicious looking article and carry it into the terminal'

The cruncher is that it took some lame-brained idiot VB employee over an hour to notify the Federal Police.

If anything the port/airport manager should have been notified and the AFP notified immediately when the article was discovered,let alone physically man handled and moved to where it could be X-rayed in a terminal amongst unsuspecting pax without due assessment.
Its quite obvious that VB has no contingency plans or training in place which is unforgiveable in this day and age.

Having friends killed by an explosion on a CV880 some years back I have seen the direct effects terrorism can cause.

In this case the handling could be summed up as follows:

Lack of training........................................Blatantly obvious
Reprehensible?.........................................Yes
Idiotic?...................................................Y es
Unprofessional?.................................. .....Definitely.
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Old 22nd Sep 2004, 23:22
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From the SMH report...

Mr Huttner said the aircraft was allowed to fly back to Queensland because authorities had made no request for the aircraft to be held until it was searched
Did I read that right? They found a device on-board and then didn't search the rest of the aeroplane before it went off on another revenue flight with a bunch of unsuspecting punters on-board?

That is unbelieveable.

If it is correct, then VB's AOC must be called into question. Or at the very least, a few high profile heads must roll. Huttners quotes in the SMH beggar belief. Without any sort of investigation he has it blamed squarely on a disgruntled employee...

Shaking my head here.
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Old 22nd Sep 2004, 23:34
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My question is how was it supposed to go off? Being a sparkler wouldn't someone have to light it first? Then if they did this then they would have to do it while the plane was one the ground?

Maybe a disgruntled airport employee? As 1013 said "stupid staff" carrying the dman thing into the airport terminal. Leave the damn thing where it stood and get help from the right places.
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 00:06
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playing devils advocate here though ..

if it was in a plastic bag as the article says, and the bag was tied up (or knotted) one would assume that the contents couldn't be seen .. would a baggy open it up to see what was inside anyway? Obviously it isn't going to feel like someone's unmentionables ..

Wouldn't it make sense to have it x-rayed to see what the contents are?

Assuming that not all luggage arrives in a secure condition, how many 'knotted placky bags" do the handlers actually see each week?

In any case, on Lawsy .. the as usual irreverant Anderson has admitted this could have been a stunt by the TWU .. now THAT would be unprofessional and absolutely inexcusable .. AND the full strength of the law should prevail ...
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 00:07
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Devil

The incident comes three months after a man left a note in toilets at Sydney airport threatening to "destroy" a terminal.

Qantas staff who found the note allowed the man to fly on to New Zealand and only alerted police after the aircraft had taken off.
That is unbelieveable.

If it is correct, then QF's AOC must be called into question. Or at the very least, a few high profile heads must roll.

For over a year QF have trained ALL STAFF in security measures to deal with handling of suspicious articles and pax.

Looks like its time QF haul their arse into the twenty first century where the possibility of terrorism is a real threat and could adversely affect themselves.
QF will have to lift their game and start spending more money on training of staff and procedural changes throughout the company because its quite obvious that no security attitude prevails.

Its quite obvious that QF has no contingency plans or training in place which is unforgiveable in this day and age.

Lack of training........................................Blatantly obvious
Reprehensible?.........................................Yes
Idiotic?...................................................Y es
Unprofessional?.................................. .....Definitely.

Shaking my head here.
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 00:32
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Kaptin M

Why don't you just come out & publcily state that you hate everything that Qantas stands for...? Or would you prefer to simply sit on the sidelines & snipe everytime someone mentions them in the news...?

To compare an incident where a note was found, to that where an explosive substance was found on an aircraft, is drawing a long bow...

QF DO have contingency plans in place for this. obviously the system had assessed the article as being of little/no risk, and that the flight could proceed.

As for this latest incident? An entirely different kettle of fish...
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 00:54
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Johnny I think the Kapt may have a bit of tongue in cheek. He was merely responding to the same old guard of Virgin haters who time after time rant on with unintelligent, vacuous garbage. These "inexperienced amateurs" who post here are becoming very monotonous and display a total and complete void of ANY capacity for logical thought.

Because I am not armed with all the FACTS I can't comment. It may well have been a mistake, but of course QF don't make mistakes do they lads? No of course not. You amateurs just go on believing that. One day you will understand differently.

What very SAD people some of you are. I suspect some of you sit waiting for any negative DJ comments by the media and then rush onto your little computers to inform the world (as you know it, ie. LIMITED) of your new found wisdom. What a joke!
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 01:18
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Lightbulb

FYI Johnny Utah, my previous post was merely a series of cut & pastes, with QF substituted for VB. Something I believe Sperm Bank picked up on.
Your comment, "Or would you prefer to simply sit on the sidelines & snipe everytime someone mentions them in the news...?" suitably describes many from BOTH the QF and VB camps, who do precisely that - frequently - on this forum when either of those company's names appears.
As an "outsider" ie. one who is not employed by either company, one watches the "Big Wheel" turn, as BOTH companies, sooner or later, receive "press".

What goes around comes around!

As I have said previously, I regularly travel on QANTAS, and will be doing so again very soon, as it is MY choice of airlines, when I travel internationally.
Unlike your CEO, I try to support Australian products and their employees, when I have a choice - even if that decision occasionally costs me a few extra $$'s of my own.
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 01:53
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Cost of ineptly trained and underpaid/overworked contract baggage handlers...............................$12 per hour

Cost of toilet roll filled with explosive substance with incendiary sparkler attached........................$4.50

Getting sprung by media for moving this both unidentified and suspicious explosive device to the terminal,endangering lives of paying passengers in the process and inept VB management not following standard protocols in alerting the Feds for over an hour till they figured out what the hell it really was .................................................PRICELESS


By the way Kap M, the QF pax you referred to was apparently a University professor that suffers from a common mental disorder but was not on his medication.
He was a frequent flyer that was recognised by staff flying on his regularly flown route.
Yep - he was assessed as suitable to fly by an assessment team which IMHO was incorrect, but either way he was assessed and the authorities consulted.

If it were up to me we would have Lee Kuan Yoo running security at airports in this country, along with 200 Israeli commandos in close support!!

Last edited by Tunguska; 23rd Sep 2004 at 02:05.
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 02:36
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I don`t tend to subscribe to Capt. M`s imputs, but, lets be honest you QF people really are a bunch of frantic thumpers!!
 
Old 23rd Sep 2004, 02:46
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This the latest from News.com.au

The incendiary device aboard a Virgin airliner appeared to have been a hoax and security would have picked up a real terrorist bomb, Transport Minister John Anderson said today.
What, Mr Anderson, you dont call thermite specifically and purposefully wrapped in a bag with a sparkler and matches a bomb? What is the difference? From every angle I look at this thing is a bomb, however rudimentary, regardless of whether the person who placed it there intended it to go off or just to spook someone. I hope they find whoever put it there and lock them up for a very long time.
 
Old 23rd Sep 2004, 02:50
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I think I'll quietly wait for the "exclusive" article on how the device "breached" airport security followed by the lengthy editorial justification of the stunt by whichever media organisation!
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 04:38
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Virgin staff 'not trained for bomb'

Thurs "Herald Sun" late News

Virgin staff 'not trained for bomb'
23sep04

VIRGIN Blue had not trained its workers to cope with an emergency like the discovery of an explosive device on a flight, an airport union said today.

Australian Federal Police today confirmed an investigation was under way into a Virgin Blue flight on Monday.
It is believed an explosive device was found in the cargo hold of a Virgin Blue jet at Sydney airport.

Transport Workers Union (TWU) airport organiser Glenn Nightingale said Virgin Blue had not trained its workers in security procedures.

"They're not trained. They're not aware," Mr Nightingale told radio 2UE.

"They wouldn't know what a bomb, or a typical home-made bomb or a professional bomb looks like. And they're not aware of it.

"They need to be made aware through proper training."

Mr Nightingale said that after an incident last month in which white powder was found on board a Virgin Blue flight he had met with Virgin's management and asked for security and evacuation training.

"That has not occurred," he said.

Passengers and crew on a flight arriving at Sydney Airport from Melbourne on August 26 were evacuated after a potentially hazardous substance was found on the plane.

An Airservices Australia spokesman said the 151 people, including six crew members, were evacuated as a precaution and nobody required medical treatment.

The TWU said Qantas did have security procedures in place to handle similar incidents.

"Qantas have got security procedures called the hot principle," Mr Nightingale said.

"They've trained their workers ... They have a reporting mechanism. They've got evacuation procedures."

Mr Nightingale said the union had met two weeks ago with Prime Minister John Howard to ask for the government and federal police to take control of security training for 10,000 airport workers at the airport.

He rejected suggestions that the union or a union member had deliberately planted the device as a warning.

"That's nonsense, absolutely nonsense," he said.

==========================================
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 04:57
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Are there any serious welders out there that can inform me whether or not this "sparkler" could have been a welding rod and whether or not these two items are ever transported together.
Still even if it is the question is how did it get there in the first place.
I've had a few explosive ****s myself but always keep the dunny roll intact for the clean up.
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 05:34
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VB MEDIA STATEMENT

virginblue.com.au

VB MEDIA STATEMENT

Regarding the security incident reported today, Virgin Blue can clarify the following points.

The matter was brought to the attention of the Australian Protective Services which is the first response unit of the Australian Federal Police, within approximately 15 minutes of discovery of the object.

Virgin Blue has rigorous safety and security training procedures in place for all staff. We continue to review all events as they occur to look at further ways to enhance this training and our procedures.

Virgin Blue is fully co-operating with the investigation by the Australian Federal Police and we encourage all other parties to focus their entire attention to assist in any way they can to do the same.

The Australian Federal Police lead these investigations and any further disclosure of information is at their discretion.

It is the long established policy of Virgin Blue not to conduct media interviews regarding specific security incidents while an investigation is ongoing.

No further comment will be made by Virgin Blue prior to the completion of the investigation.

Issued by:

Virgin Blue
Public & Media Relations

=============================================
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 05:51
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I don't know what a frantic thumper is, nor do I have an axe to grind with DJ, however I know gross negligence when I see it.

To put it another way, how would you feel if you became aware that the aeroplane you were flying in had just had an explosive device removed from it, and yet no search had been done for any more devices before the aircraft was put back into revenue service?

Whoever was responsible for that decision deserves the sack at the very least.

To say 24 hours after the event that it wasn't a proper bomb, misses the point entirely.
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Old 23rd Sep 2004, 06:07
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It is the long established policy of Virgin Blue not to conduct media interviews regarding specific security incidents
How many have they had???
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