Weight & Balance with Free Seating??
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Weight & Balance with Free Seating??
excuse my ignorance but...
does anyone know how weight and balance figures for pax work if they are not given assigned seats??
How can they shuffle pax within different zones if they dont know how many are in each??
ps.
This is definately not a Jet* bashing opportunity thankyou. I would appreciate at least a few informed posts.
Thanks
CF2
does anyone know how weight and balance figures for pax work if they are not given assigned seats??
How can they shuffle pax within different zones if they dont know how many are in each??
ps.
This is definately not a Jet* bashing opportunity thankyou. I would appreciate at least a few informed posts.
Thanks
CF2
Its been covered here....
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...t=jetstar+trim
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...t=jetstar+trim
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The answer is with the use of standard weights.
The real question should be one of security.....how do you reconcile the pax manafest with the seat # of the goon who has just threatened the cabin crew......Joe Bloggs just doesn't cut it when calling ahead for the police to meet the aircraft at the gate......unfortunately an event that is becomming all to frequent.
Or how about Mr. Unidentifiable slumped foward in their seat clutching their chest and looking the wrong shade of grey......who is he? What do you mean he has no identifiable documents on person? With a name can come previous medical history / meal preferences / frequent traveller / frequent malcontent........ how does an airline bar a traveller if the cannot identify them in the first place.
And finally, it has been seen that in the mad rush to get the "best seats" (if ever there could be said to be one in an all y class aluminium tube!) the mothers and young children come off worst in the rush................. gives cattle class a whole new meaning.
In an attempt by the accountants to save costs on computer systems and boarding cards is born another bad idea.
The real question should be one of security.....how do you reconcile the pax manafest with the seat # of the goon who has just threatened the cabin crew......Joe Bloggs just doesn't cut it when calling ahead for the police to meet the aircraft at the gate......unfortunately an event that is becomming all to frequent.
Or how about Mr. Unidentifiable slumped foward in their seat clutching their chest and looking the wrong shade of grey......who is he? What do you mean he has no identifiable documents on person? With a name can come previous medical history / meal preferences / frequent traveller / frequent malcontent........ how does an airline bar a traveller if the cannot identify them in the first place.
And finally, it has been seen that in the mad rush to get the "best seats" (if ever there could be said to be one in an all y class aluminium tube!) the mothers and young children come off worst in the rush................. gives cattle class a whole new meaning.
In an attempt by the accountants to save costs on computer systems and boarding cards is born another bad idea.
Evertonian
Fire wall. Once airborne, how do you know if the person in seat 15g was allocated 15g anyway? People move around the cabin, unless the flight's full, with an allocated system anyway. If you've requested Police attendance on arrival, it couldn't be too hard to say; "That's him Officer"
As for Mr Unidentifiable, unless he was seeking asylum and his passport was in the toilet, he's supposed to have ID for check-in isn't he? Assuming he has a medical condition, then surely the onus is on him to have his tablets etc (oh, and yes, I've been in situations where we've had to retrieve baggage for medication!) I know people that are allergic to Penicillin and there is no requirement to state that to the airline prior to travel, so I don't see how this differs greatly to allocated systems.
Your final point about Mums & kids in the crush, I've seen elsewhere a Jet* staff member saying that they actually board the elderly & families first.
The Weight & Balance side isn't all that complicated for free seating. As stated, seats can be restricted for takeoff anyway, if a situation is known in advance. As a loadcontroller, it's safe to assume that all window seats will be occupied, forward to aft, then the aisle seats, forward to aft.
What I want to know is if the punters have started throwing bags from the doorway into seats yet? This was one of the consequences of free seating in the States.
As for Mr Unidentifiable, unless he was seeking asylum and his passport was in the toilet, he's supposed to have ID for check-in isn't he? Assuming he has a medical condition, then surely the onus is on him to have his tablets etc (oh, and yes, I've been in situations where we've had to retrieve baggage for medication!) I know people that are allergic to Penicillin and there is no requirement to state that to the airline prior to travel, so I don't see how this differs greatly to allocated systems.
Your final point about Mums & kids in the crush, I've seen elsewhere a Jet* staff member saying that they actually board the elderly & families first.
The Weight & Balance side isn't all that complicated for free seating. As stated, seats can be restricted for takeoff anyway, if a situation is known in advance. As a loadcontroller, it's safe to assume that all window seats will be occupied, forward to aft, then the aisle seats, forward to aft.
What I want to know is if the punters have started throwing bags from the doorway into seats yet? This was one of the consequences of free seating in the States.
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Buster Hyman I agree with you that people do move around the cabin after take off, but the vast majority of pax stay in their allocated seats (if allocated seating is that airlines policy)... Whilst this is not a dig at J* at all (I have mates who work there) I personally prefer to have a manifest with names and seat numbers printed on it, because 9 times out of 10 people stay in their seats, and in the event of a medical emergency and the passenger is travelling on their own, its nice to have their name etc ready to pass on to the ground, who can in turn open up the reservation and get any details from there... then you ask "ok so if they are travelling on their own, how do you know they were there the whole flight? How do you know they have not moved?" well you ask the people around them! Its also good to have their names in situations where they are becoming rowdy/disruptive etc... addressing rowdy pax by their name is often useful in dissolving a situation!
Thats just my thoughts anyway
Its also good to have their names in situations where they are becoming rowdy/disruptive etc... addressing rowdy pax by their name is often useful in dissolving a situation!Thats just my thoughts anyway
Evertonian
sinala1. Yes, sorry, I didn't really elaborate did I. I too would prefer a manifest with seats etc, but I was just playing Devils advocate.
My point was that, it can be done, it's not too complicated, but I personally, would prefer the allocated seating option.
My point was that, it can be done, it's not too complicated, but I personally, would prefer the allocated seating option.
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I thought it was interesting looking at the back of a qf safety card the other day that there's a big paragraph dedicated to why you must stay in your allocated seat until the aircraft is at cruise.
How can they justify and enforce that if they let pax sit where ever they want on jetstar? Seems a bit weird to me. I'd much rather have an allocated seat in any case... even if it means I can't change it if I don't like it!
How can they justify and enforce that if they let pax sit where ever they want on jetstar? Seems a bit weird to me. I'd much rather have an allocated seat in any case... even if it means I can't change it if I don't like it!
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So Buster in essence you agree with what I said but you decided to argue a contrary view......just for the hell of it.
I thought I divorced you 3 years ago.
I see now why your tally sits at 3K +
I thought I divorced you 3 years ago.
I see now why your tally sits at 3K +
Last edited by fire wall; 2nd Aug 2004 at 10:44.
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How can they justify and enforce that if they let pax sit where ever they want on jetstar? Seems a bit weird to me. I'd much rather have an allocated seat in any case... even if it means I can't change it if I don't like it!
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I would assume that each PAX would require a boarding pass or something similar (unallocated) to get through the gate for security purposes. That would answer most of the questions regarding identification of Mr. Sick, Mr. Grumpy, Mr. Incognito etc.....
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Hugh it helps for identification upon initial boarding of the a/c, but then the boarding pass invariably gets stuffed into the rubbish/pants pocket/seat pocket etc... so a manifest with names on allows for immediate (if not always 100% correct, if they have moved, but I would say a good 98% of the time correct) identification, along with booking reference numbers etc.. 
I would have thought THE best reason for seat allocation was in case there was ever an incident where identification of the body was required it would be 98% correct to go by the seat number.
With regard to Cutest's post Every coach company I have ever drove for has manditory manifests with seat allocation at booking, regardless of pax numbers.
With regard to Cutest's post Every coach company I have ever drove for has manditory manifests with seat allocation at booking, regardless of pax numbers.
Evertonian
And with that example of making an argument, I bet you got taken to the cleaners...
As for 3k+, it did get wound back to 0 some time back.
As for 3k+, it did get wound back to 0 some time back.
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Buster, that would be the arguement you said you agreed with.................same logic as the ex as well (or lack of).
Are you still wearing that same shade of Revlon war paint? No need to rush to a response pet, you may crack a nail.
Are you still wearing that same shade of Revlon war paint? No need to rush to a response pet, you may crack a nail.
Evertonian
No, I agree with the concept. Your argument was lame as I pointed out.
You need to try harder...
...perhaps playing the ball instead of the man would be a start.
You need to try harder...
...perhaps playing the ball instead of the man would be a start.
