xinebessa,

If it were me I'd go for the ealier option, there really isn't a lot you can do to prepare yourself for stage 2 so I'd say its better to just get on with it.

Courses
 

Aero in Oct was pushed back to Jan. That has now been pushed back to July and will already be full I'm sure, so if you want to do Aero it will probably be Oct next year! And that is if NATS are letting people put their name down for it this far in advance...

Area in Feb is full and I believe May must be full by now as well seeing as a lot of people on the Feb course were pushed back on to it.

So expect a long wait folks! :(

Area is best anyway. :ok:

Does anyone know what the failure rate is like at stage 2 ? Im sure I read somewhere that about 55% of people who pass stage 1 also pass stage 2 ?

With respect, who cares? At all points during selection you're competing against a standard not between other applicants.

As I understand it I think 3% of those who apply get through selection to training and of those, 90% fail at stage 1 and probably half at stage 2 and another half at stage 3.

T250

with respect, I obviously care .. hence asking

thanks however for following up with an answer

Just done the online questionnaire

wow some strange questions there!

I have been invited to stage 2 even before carrying out the questionaire, seems odd if its possible to fail at the questionnaire stage (would have thought they'd make you do the questionnaire and wait for the results before inviting you to stage 2..

Can anyone shed some light on this ? Will I get an email telling me if I passed the personality questionnaire or not separate from the stage 2 day result?

cheers

Whilst reading through the motivation material for stage 1 I found some information that seems to be contradictory, but maybe i'm just missing something completely.

On page 5 it says: "On January 20th 2005 the first phase of the Northern Oceanic Transition Area (NOTA) was established within the Shanwick Oceanic Control Area to the North of the Shannon FIR/UIR. Shannon Area Control Centre has been delegated to provide air traffic services within the NOTA."

Then later: "As mentioned earlier the first phased of the NOTA was established in early 2005 within this airspace. This area that NATS is responsible for is known as the Shanwick Oceanic Control Area and the responsibility for providing ATC services to aircraft flying in this airspace is that of the Oceanic Control Centre at Prestwick."

So i'm confused. Everything i have read so far says that its at Prestwick where they have responsibility for flights in the NOTA, what is the Shannon Area Control reference all about?

Quite a lot of that booklet is out of date and contradictory. I'm fairly certain that example you used doesn't come up in the motivational paper anyway. Don't worry too much about it for stage 1.

The FEAST test battery is patented and under copyright law cannot be distributed without the original writer of the program. Obviously NATS and Eurocontrol don't want ANYONE to have a go at this test before sitting it in exam conditions.

The Skytest version of this is to enable you to hone your skills that will be tested by the FEAST test.

You'll be better off (money wise) searching round all the simple 2d games around on the internet, object collision, simple arithmatic, spaital awareness and learning your left and right (for instance if you were looking at someone, your left would be his right etc).

thegolfpimp, although you may feel you're being good in practicing for these tests, you're in fact only going to be kidding yourself.
When you first sit the tests at CTC the first disclaimer you are hit with is something along the lines of:- if you have sat this test before, you can count its significance as a measure of aptitude to be compromised. These tests are DESIGNED to find out who is cut out for the college and who isn't.

I hate to get on my podium again but if you fail the tests, the chances are you haven't got the aptitude. END OF!

It means because you know whats coming in the tests you are not giving a true reading and as a result of this - you may struggle at the college. I don't wish to offend anyone but anyone having sat the FEAST battery will verify this fact. Its a statement written by Eurocontrol not by me but I am fully behind their ethos..

Hi guys, I'm new on here, but have my Stage 1 booked for the 18th Dec in Fareham and am so glad i've just found this forum, in time! Everyone seems really supportive and knowledgeable about this whole process!

I just have a couple of questions regarding the motivation test material. The word document has information about 25 or so planes at the end of it, can anyone tell me how much or little of this information you need to know about for the test? Also what format is this test, multiple choice/short answers/short essays? Any help on this from anyone who has already done stage1 would be greatly appreciated!

Apologies if this has been asked too!

Thanks!

Amen to thegolfpimp. If they have included it in the material, learn it, after all it is called the motivation paper for a reason ;-) Although there was only 3 or 4 questions on them in my stage 1 paper, still 3 or 4 easy marks if you ask me :D

This question does get asked an awful lot, if i were in your shoes try to categorise them all into different classes of aircraft and then at least you'll know what size aircraft you're dealing with in the paper.

Best of luck anyway.

thegolfpimp,

NATS haven't been using FEAST for very long - it was introduced in spring 2009. There were a few people on the summer courses (Jul/Aug starts) that went through this selection process - everyone else went through the old system - and there's still a mix on the most recent courses.

It probably won't be for another year at least before any problems with the selection process become obvious. I don't know any stats, but I know of 3 people who've just finished the college and were 2nd time applicants - all did very well, so no obvious disadvantage there.

Thanks guys, good advice! I'll get right on it!!

lizplt
I know your trying to be helpful, but saying that you don't think that question comes up in the motivation paper isn't exactly comforting!

Is the motivation paper not different questions for each group of people that sit it? Don't see how there can be any certaintity it won't be asked. And if it is asked.....

On another point, is there any questions at stage 1 that ask you to approximate distances between two locations? For example, London-Dubai. On another website regarding stage 1 prep it says this is something you should look at, not seen it mentioned anywhere else, not sure how up to date the site is either.

Cheers

Rokkala
 

Its multiple choice and if you've read, learnt and maybe even made notes on the document you'll be fine! There are some questions on distances between major international hubs ie London/New York/Paris/Dubai/ but again, its multiple choice and if you've learnt your stuff you'll be fine.

Hi,

Anybody has an idea about average age for passing NATS selection process?

T250

I know it's multiple choice, my concern was that in the test document they give two different answers to who has responsibility for control of the NOTA. First it says it is Shanwick Area Control Centre, then later they it is Prestwicks Oceanic Control Centre that has responsibility for the NOTA.

So, worst case scenario you get a question on that and both answers are listed among the multiple choice. I'm pretty confident i won't need to rely on one question like that to pass, but still, just seems bizarre.

Thanks for confirming that about the distances questions.

Stage 3 Tomorrow
 

Hello all, long time watcher, first time poster

Firstly I want to say thanks to everyone especially PAT42 whose help with what exactly is going on has been great with my prep. I have stage 3 tomorrow and I think I've got as much preperation done as I can so fingers crossed I dont do anything stupid. Is anybody else on here down for tomorrow, if so I'll see you there!

@Rokkala:

Shanwick Area Control Centre is a combination of Shannon in Ireland and Prestick in Scotland. Shannon deals with the HF radio from pilots out of radar range, and Prestwick deals with the ones within radar range (I believe) so you wont get a question asking you to distinguish between the two

Cheers for that paul.

Good luck tomorrow, let us know how it goes!

paulfoley30 check your PMs!!

I just passed stage 2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh my god I am so happy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Really did not have a clue how I did on the day, I knew I screwed up a couple of the tests, but its impossible to gauge how I did on the rest of them, guess I did ok though:D. I only did it last Friday 20th, just got home from work and found the email waiting for me!

Thegolfpimp - gheck out Pat42's post on stage 2 - I think it is on page 232, post 4625 - it describes exactly what is involved, and also has a link to a description of the FEAST test on wikipedia. The only way my day differed from pat42's was that I did the NATS computer tests first, then the FEAST test, and then finished with the SDM test - which was fantastic! Pat42 - I totally agree with you about how much fun this was - it took me a little while to get into it, and fully understand what I needed to do, but I loved it - wish it could have gone on for longer!!!!!

Time to start the prep for stage 3 now...:(

I shall try and be more comforting in the future. :ok:

The NOTA is actually looked after entirely by the Shannon Area Control Centre now. It was passed over in 2006. There is a map of it here:
http://www.iaa.ie/files/2008/images/...95311_nota.gif

Rescheduling Stage 1
 

Hi Guys

I re-scheduled my stage 1 a couple of weeks ago as I didn't feel ready and in the confirmation email it says you can do this no problems.

The thing is, due to a manic couple of weeks at work mainly, I still haven't done as much prep as I'd like so I'm considering postponing it again. Is this likely to go against me at any point in the process? I think I'll stand a much better chance of passing if I book it again in a couple of weeks.

Cheers

Hi,
I was doing 2nd stage last friday as well, and on monday morning they already sent me the "Congratulations" email.

A bit amazed that I passed it, and even more that they gave the answer only after one working day.

Like everyone else I want to thank pat42 for his notes. Although he didn't give any answers ( not like he could :ok:) but was very helpful.

Anyway, to everyone who is about to attend the 2nd stage, no matter how bad you feel after all the tests, you should have hope.

Rokkala
 

Don't worry so much about the test document, especially not just one question, as the questions are most definitely not as in depth as you would think from the amount of info they give you.

Liz was right, that particular question isn't in the test, and the questions are always the same questions, which is a stupid move on NATS part, but they are. i think this has been mentioned a while back on this forum. However, if you've read the document and have even a reasonable memory and some concept of ATC and aviation, you'll be fine. Trust me, worry more about the cubes and diagramming, there more challenging.

Stage 3!
 

I passed!

Oh my god I can't believe it, I heard yesterday, the first working day after my interview! I am so happy right now it's unbelievable, it's just such a relief to know i'm in and that I can stop worrying about it now.

Anyone else who had stage 3 on the 20th heard back yet? Good luck to the rest of you!

I will do another post soon talking a bit about the 'stage 3 experience'!:ok:

Adam I'm well pleased for you congrats! Clare text me to say you passed!! So exciting well done!!

Have you heard from any of the others from our S2?

I think we owe Clare a drink!!

Cheers for the replies. Congrats Adam!

Liz
 

Thanks Liz and Rokkala!

Liz, there were two people at my stage 3 who had been at our stage 2, Mike and John were there names, but I don't know how they've done with stage 3. I know that obviously yourself and I think Mannequin both passed stage 3, and Peter(ps82) has his stage 3 sometime soon(he is visiting Swanwick tomorrow).

Clare has had a lovely bottle of rose wine and Ferrero Rocher from me, but I agree that she deserves a big thank you!

When have you booked your medical for?

Have you got a start date yet?

Pre-Application
 

Hi,

I have been directed to this site by a friend who is an ATCO. After reading your comments on what they (NATS) would be expecting of you to pass is extremely helpful, thank you. However, is there anything i can try and revise before doing the online application as you can no doubt guess
1) i dont want to make an ass out of myself
2) having tried to do as much reaserch into the ATC as possible im starting to come up against a brick wall and need help.

Are there any books that might be advantageous to my revision?

Many thanks,

Henry

I've got my medical booked for the 4th Dec and am ridiculously excited about it because it means shortly after (if I pass...I have a Class I medical so should be ok...touch wood) then I'll get a start date! Then I'll let you know.
I've not heard from anyone else recently. I'll PM you actually cuz its prob not interesting to anyone else.

Some really helpful books I found were:
Mechanical Aptitude and Spatial Relations Tests. Good for cubes. If you want a photocopy of the good pages then I'll be happy to send a few out. May as well rinse my current job of postage and photocopying whilst I'm still there. PM me if you want them.
A couple of the girls at my stage 3 all had Air Traffic Control (Abc): Amazon.co.uk: G.R. Duke: Books and it seemed pretty good.
Pooleys Air Pilot's Manual is pretty good for basics too. Obviously more emphasis on the actual flying side of things but the laws don't change.

To be honest though it's all in that info they send you. Having an interest in aviation and how it works helps a lot too.

Congrats Adam :D Good to see so many people from our Stage 2 got through!

I haven't heard yet, which doesn't really bode too well but nevermind! One of the other guys from our Stage 2 sat the Stage 3 with me too, don't know if he's heard either though.

Sweet! Thanks For The Info.

I Currently Fly And Have Done For About 6 Years Or So, So The Basic Are There For The Flying Side Of Things But Trying To Work The Other Way Round Is Another Question. However, I Have Just Bought The Abc Atc And An Apptitude Book But Just Have To Wait For It To Be Delivered. The Other Books I Shall Definately Get.

What Is The Pack Like They Send You? Do They Send A Pack For Each Step Of The Interview Processes?

Hi, a big well done to everyone who passed from my Stage 2, excellent news.
Had my Stage 3 yesterday, hello to everyone who was there and good luck, was nice to meet you all! :ok:

Stage 3
 

I sat my stage 3 on the 18th and heard on Monday afternoon that I was successful, just waiting for the information via email to be able to book my medical. Any of the others that sat theirs on the 18th heard yet??

Congrats Sam :)

I haven't heard anything yet :\

Many thanks....Dont worry to much Manequin as they only phoned me as they had missing information on my application due to the system crashing when I was applying originally. The HR lady confirmed all the info then put me on hold and came back to say that I was successful, although they have not sent me an email to say so. Sure you'll get a positive response soon!

Catman,

Why all the CAPS?