3 cheers for the LACC boys and girls....
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Thanks dtycln,
I certainly have never had any gripe against LACC atcos, in fact we work very closely with them here and have a good working relationship and long may it continue.
We all trained together at Bournemouth and I am sure there is no inclination to change the excellent relationship we currently have.
Strength in numbers , we all after all do the same damn job that of controlling aircraft, be it at the approach or en-route phase of flight.
Sounds like someone is trying to be controversial here at conference, I hope common sense prevails.
I certainly have never had any gripe against LACC atcos, in fact we work very closely with them here and have a good working relationship and long may it continue.
We all trained together at Bournemouth and I am sure there is no inclination to change the excellent relationship we currently have.
Strength in numbers , we all after all do the same damn job that of controlling aircraft, be it at the approach or en-route phase of flight.
Sounds like someone is trying to be controversial here at conference, I hope common sense prevails.
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No big deal. Go to conference, see what the motion is actually about then vote. It's called democracy.
Join Date: Jan 2001
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Mr. Middleton was spotted at the south coast "Dome" not so many weeks ago......
oh, and he owes me LOTS of pints...
To the Blue Anchor, and beyond
Rgds BEX
oh, and he owes me LOTS of pints...
To the Blue Anchor, and beyond
Rgds BEX
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Findo with all your experience of union conference you must be stirring it.
DtyCln is entirely correct, if the motion is rubbish then conference will vote it out, even the LACC delegates may vote against.
If you dont like the motion then like a good union member you will let your unit delegates know and they will take your opinion into account.
How many loony ScACC, MACC, every other unit motions are voted out by conference every year, many i think you will agree.
As long as two members can send a motion to conference there will always be stupid, ill advised and down right rubbish debated at conference.
You really should know better
And by the way, a mandating meeting long before conference....where do you dream that one up from, for many years the ONLY unit NOT allowed to have a section meet at Bredbury pre-conference was the old West Drayton section. If mandating ever took place it was long before my time, and that is a lot of years ago!!
DtyCln is entirely correct, if the motion is rubbish then conference will vote it out, even the LACC delegates may vote against.
If you dont like the motion then like a good union member you will let your unit delegates know and they will take your opinion into account.
How many loony ScACC, MACC, every other unit motions are voted out by conference every year, many i think you will agree.
As long as two members can send a motion to conference there will always be stupid, ill advised and down right rubbish debated at conference.
You really should know better
And by the way, a mandating meeting long before conference....where do you dream that one up from, for many years the ONLY unit NOT allowed to have a section meet at Bredbury pre-conference was the old West Drayton section. If mandating ever took place it was long before my time, and that is a lot of years ago!!
Last edited by Big Nose1; 17th Oct 2002 at 23:28.
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Big Nose .. I do apologise for being so silly. I will wait to see the democratic process in action. It will be nice to see the LACC delegates listening to the debate and voting sensibly after being persuaded by the debate. And not once will they all vote together or call for a card vote when conference delegates vote against their wishes.
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LACC BASHING
FINDO
For someone with the wealth of union and conference experience you have, I thought you would behave better. To suggest that LACC or West Drayton AC delegates are mandated is a nonsense. This has not happened for at least 11 years! If they want to vote collectively either by show of hands or card vote then that's democracy. Just as all the other sections do.
For those that don't know, a card vote would have to seconded by another unit anyway. For LACC to win a card vote they would have to carry at least TC and LL with them.
For the record in the last 10 years 7 card votes that I can recall have been initiated by AC delegates. 3 at the "suggestion" of the then BEC in which you were a part! (What price democracy then?) ( Remember the FIR debate)
For the record the last card vote called by AC delegates seconded by both TC and LL was LOST. The reason, not all AC or in fact TC delegates voted the same way. True democracy at work!
The ATCOs branch has enough problems keeping the membership together before, during and after conference. Your comments are at best mischievous but do nothing to promote the good that conference achieves. Members should be encouraged to take part, submit motions (loony or not) and contribute to the branch as a whole.
For someone with the wealth of union and conference experience you have, I thought you would behave better. To suggest that LACC or West Drayton AC delegates are mandated is a nonsense. This has not happened for at least 11 years! If they want to vote collectively either by show of hands or card vote then that's democracy. Just as all the other sections do.
For those that don't know, a card vote would have to seconded by another unit anyway. For LACC to win a card vote they would have to carry at least TC and LL with them.
For the record in the last 10 years 7 card votes that I can recall have been initiated by AC delegates. 3 at the "suggestion" of the then BEC in which you were a part! (What price democracy then?) ( Remember the FIR debate)
For the record the last card vote called by AC delegates seconded by both TC and LL was LOST. The reason, not all AC or in fact TC delegates voted the same way. True democracy at work!
The ATCOs branch has enough problems keeping the membership together before, during and after conference. Your comments are at best mischievous but do nothing to promote the good that conference achieves. Members should be encouraged to take part, submit motions (loony or not) and contribute to the branch as a whole.
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LACC bashing Chicken ?? Shhurly some mistake. How can you infer that from a few comments in response to being told that we can all go to conference and vote down rubbish motions ?
If the LACC delegates (and all others) all vote according to the quality of the debate then that is nice to hear ... as I said.
I do dispute the timescale of the last mandating but hopefully that is now academic.
If you look at my original post on this thread I am very appreciative of the way the LACC members have stood up and advanced our conditions recently.
I for one have submitted my (loony) motions this year. Looks like lots of our colleagues have done so too and we have a record agenda. All our members are being constantly encouraged to submit motions - hopefully as a first step in becoming active.
Unfortunately we still have the sort of cynical comment which started this thread without a scent of rationale or being prepared to discuss and debate in the open.
Keep fighting the good fight folks
If the LACC delegates (and all others) all vote according to the quality of the debate then that is nice to hear ... as I said.
I do dispute the timescale of the last mandating but hopefully that is now academic.
If you look at my original post on this thread I am very appreciative of the way the LACC members have stood up and advanced our conditions recently.
I for one have submitted my (loony) motions this year. Looks like lots of our colleagues have done so too and we have a record agenda. All our members are being constantly encouraged to submit motions - hopefully as a first step in becoming active.
Unfortunately we still have the sort of cynical comment which started this thread without a scent of rationale or being prepared to discuss and debate in the open.
Keep fighting the good fight folks
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Looks like there may not be a LACC delegation at all at ADC.
Most if not all of the prospective delegates have had the Special Leave refused or just ignored by the ORO. This could mean that the largest and most influential unit in the country being under or not represented.
There was a shambles last year where even students were recruited to be delegates and it was promised that this would not happen again-WELL IT HAS
The LACC reps are constantly being denied facility time and most meetings take place in spare time accruing even more TOIL. It really is time the BEC pulled their finger out and played hard ball on this one. NO TIME ALLOCATED=NO AGREEMENTS signed.
Most if not all of the prospective delegates have had the Special Leave refused or just ignored by the ORO. This could mean that the largest and most influential unit in the country being under or not represented.
There was a shambles last year where even students were recruited to be delegates and it was promised that this would not happen again-WELL IT HAS
The LACC reps are constantly being denied facility time and most meetings take place in spare time accruing even more TOIL. It really is time the BEC pulled their finger out and played hard ball on this one. NO TIME ALLOCATED=NO AGREEMENTS signed.
Last edited by 250 kts; 21st Oct 2002 at 20:13.
More than just an ATCO
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I thought that the NATS private forum was created for this sort of thing.
Further visible proof to your management of how divided you are and won't further your cause at all
Further visible proof to your management of how divided you are and won't further your cause at all
