F15/18s over London.
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F15/18s over London.
About 20 miutes ago two F15/18 flew very fast and low (<1000ft) across London heading in an Easterly direction. Does anyone know what they were doing?
SoS
SoS
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Am not ATC but..had a report from my brother who works in the City to the effect that the aircraft we flying sufficiently low as to be appear to be making efforts to avoid some of the taller buildings 
Obviously looks can be deceiving but they do seem to have been v. low indeed, anyobdy ATCOs care to comment (see also a similar thread on reporting points).
Obviously looks can be deceiving but they do seem to have been v. low indeed, anyobdy ATCOs care to comment (see also a similar thread on reporting points).
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They were probably too low to affect the final approach to Heathrow, but were certainly right across the final approch to London City. At the time the approach to London City was from the west as a 142 had just turned on to final about five minutes beforehand.
In the light of what happened two weeks ago in Germany, and in the absence of any tactical reason for them being there I'd rather they took some other route.
john x
In the light of what happened two weeks ago in Germany, and in the absence of any tactical reason for them being there I'd rather they took some other route.
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Speed of sound wrote: "In the light of what happened two weeks ago in Germany, and in the absence of any tactical reason for them being there I'd rather they took some other route. "
That's a remarkable statement to make, particularly the first few words. Perhaps you'd better enlighten us as to what you really mean. Fast jets low over London are not unusual - a few weeks ago the Red Arrows plus assorted jest flew at low level down the Mall but I don't recall anyone complaining....
That's a remarkable statement to make, particularly the first few words. Perhaps you'd better enlighten us as to what you really mean. Fast jets low over London are not unusual - a few weeks ago the Red Arrows plus assorted jest flew at low level down the Mall but I don't recall anyone complaining....
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Class A airspace?
Could prove to be a costly error if no one knew they were there.
Almost certainly they were en route not above a thousand feet or similar so as not to compromise the commercial traffic.
Almost certainly SVFR, and if LC had already filled up its stands, there wouldn't be a problem (Particularly if they were talking to Thames Radar)
95% of the above is guesswork. Do I win?
Could prove to be a costly error if no one knew they were there.
Almost certainly they were en route not above a thousand feet or similar so as not to compromise the commercial traffic.
Almost certainly SVFR, and if LC had already filled up its stands, there wouldn't be a problem (Particularly if they were talking to Thames Radar)
95% of the above is guesswork. Do I win?
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HD
the point about the Arrows etc. is that everyone knew from the papers about the flypast, as it had been fairly extensively announced what route, types, times etc.
The F-18s, if such they were, forgot to issue the Press Release.
The US may be used to and be reassured by 16s on CAP overhead football games but not yet so true in Europe.
the point about the Arrows etc. is that everyone knew from the papers about the flypast, as it had been fairly extensively announced what route, types, times etc.
The F-18s, if such they were, forgot to issue the Press Release.
The US may be used to and be reassured by 16s on CAP overhead football games but not yet so true in Europe.
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What's a 142?
Get a life, guys! From what I see, two fast jets did a fly-by of London. So what if it wasn't announced in advance and televised? They obviously had the permission of ATC and would naturally have been complying with minimum height rules. Just enjoy the show and don't look for controversy where there isn't any.
Get a life, guys! From what I see, two fast jets did a fly-by of London. So what if it wasn't announced in advance and televised? They obviously had the permission of ATC and would naturally have been complying with minimum height rules. Just enjoy the show and don't look for controversy where there isn't any.
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Eyeinthesky.. Hear hear! I agree 100%. There are a few busybodies on here who simply don't know what goes on. If they had the vaguest idea of some things that go on above the skies of London which are never publicised they'd have a blue fit!!
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f15s/18s
as far as im aware no fighters(or fast jets as the raf call them) should be below 2000' over london, or indeed any built up area. it wouldnt be the first time that the yanks have got it wrong.
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Fighter jets flying fast, close and low in Class A airspace, under SVFR and with ATC permission will:
a) increase the possibility of an accident?
b) decrease the possibility of an accident?
c) have no effect on the possibility of an accident?
Speed of Sound
a) increase the possibility of an accident?
b) decrease the possibility of an accident?
c) have no effect on the possibility of an accident?
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MMMm........HD you are, as always right on the money.
Look at the oher alternatives for going from East of London to Farnborough...
1. Go over the top at FL180+
2. Go via LAM/Stapleford/Elstree/Denham/Waltham/Blackbushe at 2.4 or below
3. Go via BIG/OCK at 2.4 or below
4. Stay in Controlled airspace at legally accepted levels?
MMMmm - me thinks that answer 4 works best!!
All weekends are spent with Single Squirrel/R22 etc legally overflying central London, mainly on pleasure flights. Concorde returned the other day with an engine out and (I AM GUESSING HERE) landed on 27R as the southern runway is still too bumpy. Did that fly over central London/populated areas?? It probably did. Why?? Because it may have been safer to do so for the aircraft.
We can't elliminate EVERY risk in flying. SIMPLE AS THAT.
SO, back to the original matter........
Capital's GA7 sits over the West End daily at 1500 and often follows the M40 to Northolt. PPL's fly over London LEGALLY at 1500 and you think that is more dangerous than F18's??
Lets not get too excited here people. As mentioned, it was legal for Liz a few weeks back, with a million people underneath!
It was controlled, it was legal - 'nuff said.
Look at the oher alternatives for going from East of London to Farnborough...
1. Go over the top at FL180+
2. Go via LAM/Stapleford/Elstree/Denham/Waltham/Blackbushe at 2.4 or below
3. Go via BIG/OCK at 2.4 or below
4. Stay in Controlled airspace at legally accepted levels?
MMMmm - me thinks that answer 4 works best!!
All weekends are spent with Single Squirrel/R22 etc legally overflying central London, mainly on pleasure flights. Concorde returned the other day with an engine out and (I AM GUESSING HERE) landed on 27R as the southern runway is still too bumpy. Did that fly over central London/populated areas?? It probably did. Why?? Because it may have been safer to do so for the aircraft.
We can't elliminate EVERY risk in flying. SIMPLE AS THAT.
SO, back to the original matter........
Capital's GA7 sits over the West End daily at 1500 and often follows the M40 to Northolt. PPL's fly over London LEGALLY at 1500 and you think that is more dangerous than F18's??
Lets not get too excited here people. As mentioned, it was legal for Liz a few weeks back, with a million people underneath!
It was controlled, it was legal - 'nuff said.