Maximum number of a/с on the FQ
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 712
Likes: 17
From: SE England
Every position will have different sensible limits, which will differ for each individal and weather conditions and complexity on the day. I doubt that an individual can give undivided attention to more than 10 different flights doing different things, but procedures can be in place to simplify things so that you are not controlling individual flights so much as working a system.
You can have 40ish in the ATZ and further traffic joining without holding them off, but there is no way you could control each flight individually as there is not sufficient RTF time.
You can have 40ish in the ATZ and further traffic joining without holding them off, but there is no way you could control each flight individually as there is not sufficient RTF time.
Last edited by Dan Dare; 27th November 2012 at 15:45.
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 63
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From: Moscow
Thanks, Dan. We used to have the limits. Now we only have a certain number of planes for an hour, not that of a/c which are in the sector at the same time.
*FQ is my interpretation of 'frequency'. Sorry.
*FQ is my interpretation of 'frequency'. Sorry.
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8,266
Likes: 1
From: Berkshire, UK
OK thanks. There are so many variables. At a training airfield where I once worked it was not unusual to have 6-8 in the circuit with several joining, all talking to the Tower controller. They were all VFR so they were basically looking out for themselves. However, try 8-10 IFR on the frequency when you are going for 2.5 to 3nm final approach spacing. That can be busy. However, in controlled airspace IFR flights are usually following strict procedures with highly professional pilots which helps considerably. I believe the RAF had rules about how many aircraft could be handled at once but when I worked in UK Civil ATC no such rules applied.
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 171
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From: London UK
In reply to Heathrow Director:
You were right! When I was at LATCC (Mil), we had an (almost) strict '3 a/c per console' policy. But, as you point out, these were VFR & IFR mixed, some were over the North Sea doing whatever they wanted. Some had to be thread, like a needle, through the Ambers. Sometimes 5 aircraft was boring, sometimes 1 was enough to make you cry!
In answer to the OP:
Yes, an ATCO can normally specify a limit. A Tower controller can instruct Approach to 'hold off' and a sector controller can hope that Flow Control will keep him sane. In between, most units will have some sort of policy. Some times it works, sometimes it doesn't, but I think most will agree that ATC work nowadays is a lot safer for all concerned than it was in the 60s & 70s when you just did your best with whatever was thrown at you, eh Bren?
You were right! When I was at LATCC (Mil), we had an (almost) strict '3 a/c per console' policy. But, as you point out, these were VFR & IFR mixed, some were over the North Sea doing whatever they wanted. Some had to be thread, like a needle, through the Ambers. Sometimes 5 aircraft was boring, sometimes 1 was enough to make you cry!
In answer to the OP:
Yes, an ATCO can normally specify a limit. A Tower controller can instruct Approach to 'hold off' and a sector controller can hope that Flow Control will keep him sane. In between, most units will have some sort of policy. Some times it works, sometimes it doesn't, but I think most will agree that ATC work nowadays is a lot safer for all concerned than it was in the 60s & 70s when you just did your best with whatever was thrown at you, eh Bren?
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 712
Likes: 17
From: SE England
Busiest? Almost certainly.
Most difficult? Nah, that is not really full air traffic control separating traffic, it is VFR "see and avoid" with lots of options open and procedures in place to move the traffic.
I expect the most difficlut would be any busy TMA when weather avoidance starts during an already busy delayed period and no place to go. How many would be on frequency then? I don't know, but it will feel like too many.
Most difficult? Nah, that is not really full air traffic control separating traffic, it is VFR "see and avoid" with lots of options open and procedures in place to move the traffic.
I expect the most difficlut would be any busy TMA when weather avoidance starts during an already busy delayed period and no place to go. How many would be on frequency then? I don't know, but it will feel like too many.
Joined: Nov 2005
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
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From: Wildest Surrey
At a subsequent PFA Rally at Cranfield, at one time I had 7 on the hard runway and another 14 on final all on my frequency. Course there were almsot as many on the parallel grass runway but that was using a different frequency
More than just an ATCO
Joined: Jul 1999
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From: Up someone's nose
I more than had my hands full one night with two 737s inbound to EDDH. They ended up in, then East Germany, both at FL 290, and in formation. Neither felt in a position to do anything else and I was being kept busy by Air Defense screaming in one ear and the Supervisor screaming in the other. Both were telling me to do something, but neither had any ideas what. Eventually wegot somebody in E. Germany on the landline and he just said, "What aircraft. I am not looking at the radar. " 
