New Manchester Push Procedures
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Samsonite Avenue
Posts: 1,538
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
New Manchester Push Procedures
Just heard that the good old cardinal points of the compass are no longer to be used when issuing a non standard push back clearance at Manch. Apparently the new system will use a selection of pre determined geographic places that will be used instead?
Perhaps the ATCOs on the front line think that this is a better system? I know it is early days but I can't help but think that this is making matters more complicated with extra R/T loading plus, what is ultimately non standard phraseology for non English native speakers.
If this gets a thumbs down from the ATCOs, then would you appreciate us doing what we can through our reporting channels etc? If there has been misaligned push backs in the past, then surely this is down to the handling agent not ensuring that their tug crews know their North from their South etc and not ATC?
Perhaps the ATCOs on the front line think that this is a better system? I know it is early days but I can't help but think that this is making matters more complicated with extra R/T loading plus, what is ultimately non standard phraseology for non English native speakers.
If this gets a thumbs down from the ATCOs, then would you appreciate us doing what we can through our reporting channels etc? If there has been misaligned push backs in the past, then surely this is down to the handling agent not ensuring that their tug crews know their North from their South etc and not ATC?
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Berkshire, UK
Age: 79
Posts: 8,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Pushback approved; face the t-junction just west of Mobberley"
This surely must be a wind-up, or the work of a loony?
Wonder what bright ideas they have for radar control?
This surely must be a wind-up, or the work of a loony?
Wonder what bright ideas they have for radar control?
Last edited by HEATHROW DIRECTOR; 3rd Jan 2011 at 08:39.
As pushback vehicles are not normally fitted with a compass and as the pushback vehicle drivers are local guys familiar with the location of the runways, terminals, security entrances etc; may be this unusual idea is not as daft as it may sound? All the guy at the pointy end has to do is relay the message.
It seems probable that MAN have experienced problems with pushbacks and have decided, in consultation with ATC, pushback drivers et al, that this method will eliminate the problems. Just a thought.
It seems probable that MAN have experienced problems with pushbacks and have decided, in consultation with ATC, pushback drivers et al, that this method will eliminate the problems. Just a thought.
Per Ardua ad Astraeus
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 18,579
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nod - I'm sure H49 is well aware of the crew's responsibilities, and I am also sure that what 'she' says in relation to pushback/point direction makes admirable sense. Not dissimilar to "Pushback to face west keeping your tail clear of Taxiway 'A'" - I was not in the habit of getting out during pushback to check the tail position
I'm sure even the diehards will get used to it - if it works!
I'm sure even the diehards will get used to it - if it works!
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Age: 62
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
heard that the good old cardinal points of the compass are no longer to be used when issuing a non standard push back clearance at Manch. Apparently the new system will use a selection of pre determined geographic places that will be used instead?
Last edited by BAND4ALL; 3rd Jan 2011 at 10:27.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Samsonite Avenue
Posts: 1,538
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As pushback vehicles are not normally fitted with a compass and as the pushback vehicle drivers are local guys familiar with the location of the runways, terminals, security entrances etc; may be this unusual idea is not as daft as it may sound?
Surely the most efficient way of eliminating any 'rogue' push backs is to ensure that the push back crews are given extra training and not to burden what is at times, a busy ATC environment?
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Berkshire, UK
Age: 79
Posts: 8,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mister Geezer..... Sensible words. I did GMC at a fairly busy place for 20+ years and never had any problems with "push back and face north", etc. Maybe at that place, tug crews received proper training?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Samsonite Avenue
Posts: 1,538
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Perhaps Rusholme would be a better feature for PIA to point towards? I wonder if the Saudi Arabian will be ever asked to 'push and face Mecca'? 
HD - Nail on the head I think!
HD - Nail on the head I think!
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Unknown
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Agreed with HD
but why pay for proper training... that would make sense!!
As mentioned on the manchester airport forum, it isn't all tug crews, but like with everything at Manchester, one person makes a mistake and instead of that one person being taught properly now nobody can do that, what a way to work....
but why pay for proper training... that would make sense!!
As mentioned on the manchester airport forum, it isn't all tug crews, but like with everything at Manchester, one person makes a mistake and instead of that one person being taught properly now nobody can do that, what a way to work....
Join Date: May 2000
Location: On top of the world
Age: 73
Posts: 116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fuel Crossfeed
How about the reciprocal - "expedite taxi to Stand 16 - oh, by the way, there's a sale in Duty Free" 
Directions to face during pushback given to female flight crew will be - push to face the Trafford Shopping Center
Join Date: May 2000
Location: On top of the world
Age: 73
Posts: 116
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ew
I think a few of us old gits prefer the 70's humour (even if it is male chauvinist piggery) to the obscene stuff that passes for humour nowadays e.g. Frankie Boyle & Chubby Brown
I think a few of us old gits prefer the 70's humour (even if it is male chauvinist piggery) to the obscene stuff that passes for humour nowadays e.g. Frankie Boyle & Chubby Brown
Last edited by off watch; 4th Jan 2011 at 16:41. Reason: spelling
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Toronto
Age: 57
Posts: 531
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In about 7 years working at Manchester I don't recall ever having a wrong way push. I always used "push behind stand xx" if a non-standard push was required. If the aircraft was on stand 215 and pushed behind 214 then they would be facing north-west automatically. Seemed to work fine.
Why you would give a location more than 200 feet from where you are seems pointless and overly complex. Keep it simple!
Why you would give a location more than 200 feet from where you are seems pointless and overly complex. Keep it simple!