Request For Update On Scottish TMA Procedures
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Request For Update On Scottish TMA Procedures
Can any Scottish Types help me out, please? A ‘rush job’ has come in and I have to write an assessment paper this weekend for presentation on Tuesday that includes – among other things - an appreciation of the revised ATC procedures applicable to the Scottish TMA, especially for Glasgow.
Can any one point in the direction of online CAA or NATS papers that describe how the TMA now works? Among many other issues in my extensive ‘brief’ points that I need to cover are:
1. Is Glasgow Approach still done from Glasgow or has this function been transferred to the new centre – if not, is it going to be?
2. What radar feeds are now available at:
3. How is Scottish/Glasgow mitigating the current absence of the Glasgow primary radar? (and from a practical viewpoint how’s it going?).
4. When is the new Glasgow PSR scheduled to be in service? Will this be available at the centre?
5. Are there any TMZs in force in the TMA – has the temporary one covering Whitelee Wind Farm been withdrawn as planned? Are any others planned?
6. Other than the “Proposal for Reclassification of the Glasgow Control Area from Class E to Class D” Stakeholder Consultation, is/are there any other Airspace Change Proposals being staffed?
This section is but an element of the whole paper and time is really against me; and I need to research other esoteric (non-ATC) areas, that are eating up my schedule. Professional inputs from experts would be much appreciated, but pointers to online docs that could be quoted as references (and for my own edification) would be great.
Can any one point in the direction of online CAA or NATS papers that describe how the TMA now works? Among many other issues in my extensive ‘brief’ points that I need to cover are:
1. Is Glasgow Approach still done from Glasgow or has this function been transferred to the new centre – if not, is it going to be?
2. What radar feeds are now available at:
a. The new centre
b. Glasgow Approach (assuming it’s still at Glasgow – see 1 above!)
Are these mosaic/composite displays or selectable heads? I presume the former at the centre.3. How is Scottish/Glasgow mitigating the current absence of the Glasgow primary radar? (and from a practical viewpoint how’s it going?).
4. When is the new Glasgow PSR scheduled to be in service? Will this be available at the centre?
5. Are there any TMZs in force in the TMA – has the temporary one covering Whitelee Wind Farm been withdrawn as planned? Are any others planned?
6. Other than the “Proposal for Reclassification of the Glasgow Control Area from Class E to Class D” Stakeholder Consultation, is/are there any other Airspace Change Proposals being staffed?
This section is but an element of the whole paper and time is really against me; and I need to research other esoteric (non-ATC) areas, that are eating up my schedule. Professional inputs from experts would be much appreciated, but pointers to online docs that could be quoted as references (and for my own edification) would be great.
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Some bed time reading here for starters
Consultations - NATS
Consultations - NATS
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Eeee, I'll be dreaming of bed!
Thanks for the initial steer and VERY prompt response!
Thanks for the initial steer and VERY prompt response!
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Some stuff in the consultation papers supported what I already knew and therefore provides a Reference, but nothing yet on the revised modus operandi of the TMA following the introduction of the new centre. Any further 'steers' forthcoming, please? 
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There have been no revisions to the STMA procedures with the opening of Prestwick Centre. The route structures (STARS and SIDS) have not been significantly amended since their introduction in 1992, although there have been changes to the way traffic is handed over between the TMA sectors, Glasgow and Edinburgh.
The approach units are still located at the airports.
PC uses Multi Radar Tracking (MRT), where information from all offering radars is fed into one "basket" and the best return is then displayed, including Mode S Downloaded Parameters.
The detailed procedures for operating the TMA are contained within the PC, Glasgow, Edinburgh and Prestwick MATS Part 2s, but these documents are commercially confidential.
The approach units are still located at the airports.
PC uses Multi Radar Tracking (MRT), where information from all offering radars is fed into one "basket" and the best return is then displayed, including Mode S Downloaded Parameters.
The detailed procedures for operating the TMA are contained within the PC, Glasgow, Edinburgh and Prestwick MATS Part 2s, but these documents are commercially confidential.
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As Talla Radar says, some info is not in the public domain.
However, that which is:
1. Scottish TMA Approach Control is still done at the airfields. There are no immediate plans to change this.
2. Numerous sources at the Centre including Lowther Hill, Great Dun Fell, Tiree, Belfast, Kincardine, and Glasgow (when complete). Mosaic (MRT), composite (2 sources) and single source are all available options to controllers there.
3. Kincardine Radar fills in the gaps not covered by existing sources or affected by the wind farm. See press release here: Kincardine Radar
4. The replacement is part of the NATS Radar Replacement programme. I suspect it will be available in the new Centre, as with other NATS radars.
No idea of completion date, but they normally take about 1 year to come in to service once work starts.
5. No TMZs in force now. None planned as the windfarm problem was solved by feeding Kincardine in to the new Centre.
6. No changes in the pipeline.
Cheers
However, that which is:
1. Scottish TMA Approach Control is still done at the airfields. There are no immediate plans to change this.
2. Numerous sources at the Centre including Lowther Hill, Great Dun Fell, Tiree, Belfast, Kincardine, and Glasgow (when complete). Mosaic (MRT), composite (2 sources) and single source are all available options to controllers there.
3. Kincardine Radar fills in the gaps not covered by existing sources or affected by the wind farm. See press release here: Kincardine Radar
4. The replacement is part of the NATS Radar Replacement programme. I suspect it will be available in the new Centre, as with other NATS radars.
No idea of completion date, but they normally take about 1 year to come in to service once work starts.
5. No TMZs in force now. None planned as the windfarm problem was solved by feeding Kincardine in to the new Centre.
6. No changes in the pipeline.
Cheers
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Fish, Talla & 10W - much obliged and I'm in your debt. Thanks for sharing the info that you could; it has helped immensely. 
(And just to allay any doubts, I'm not a nimby or journo stirring things up! It's all Kosher!)
(And just to allay any doubts, I'm not a nimby or journo stirring things up! It's all Kosher!)
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Hi, it's not a TMZ. It's Controlled Air Space and is covered under equipment schedules published in the Air Navigation Order. It also requires an ATC clearance and is a known traffic environment. ATC can permit non equipped aircraft to enter.
The CAA Policy is:
No application has been made to change the Scottish TMA to a TMZ through the Airspace Change Proposal and I can see no reason to do so as existing legislation is adequate.
The CAA Policy is:
A TMZ is normally established for overriding safety reasons, where the airspace classification would not ordinarily require aircraft to carry a transponder. Where the case can be made a TMZ may also be established within controlled airspace. The establishment of any TMZ shall be in accordance with the Airspace Change Process contained within CAP 724, the Airspace Charter, and the associated guidance published in CAP 725, the Guidance on the Application of the Airspace Change Process.
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!0W
Reference from the AIP GEN 1.5
5.3.2.2Notified 'Transponder Mandatory Zone' Airspace. For the purposes of ANO 2005 Schedule 5 paragraph 2(3)(b), the following
airspace is notified as a 'Transponder Mandatory Zone' (TMZ):
• The Scottish TMA between 6000 ft ALT and FL 100
• The vertical and lateral bounds of the Stansted TMZ as detailed in AIP AD 2-EGSS.
I forgot about it being 6000ft to FL100
Regards
TUTH
Reference from the AIP GEN 1.5
5.3.2.2Notified 'Transponder Mandatory Zone' Airspace. For the purposes of ANO 2005 Schedule 5 paragraph 2(3)(b), the following
airspace is notified as a 'Transponder Mandatory Zone' (TMZ):
• The Scottish TMA between 6000 ft ALT and FL 100
• The vertical and lateral bounds of the Stansted TMZ as detailed in AIP AD 2-EGSS.
I forgot about it being 6000ft to FL100
Regards
TUTH
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Thanks for that. As no Airspace Change Proposal was raised, maybe the CAA should rescind it ? 
Just a wee update, there is nothing in any of our ATC documentation about us being the proud owners of a TMZ, and after asking around a few folks, it seems none of the guys and girls who work the airspace knew we had one either.
It seems that the CAA (with or without telling our management) slipped in the change to the ANO some time ago (2005 ?), coupled with an appropriate AIP TMZ entry. The effect is to give us what we always had (Mode A&C transponders required above 6000' in the TMA) but without educating the foot soldiers that there was a subtle change afoot.
The change would appear to predate the CAA Policy promised in their Phase 2 Mode S consultation that all TMZs should go through the Airspace Change Proposal. As they have regulatory power to impose TMZs whether consultation occurs or not, they appear to have done so anyway without letting us know.
Wonder what else has sneeked in under the radar, so to speak ?
Just a wee update, there is nothing in any of our ATC documentation about us being the proud owners of a TMZ, and after asking around a few folks, it seems none of the guys and girls who work the airspace knew we had one either.
It seems that the CAA (with or without telling our management) slipped in the change to the ANO some time ago (2005 ?), coupled with an appropriate AIP TMZ entry. The effect is to give us what we always had (Mode A&C transponders required above 6000' in the TMA) but without educating the foot soldiers that there was a subtle change afoot.
The change would appear to predate the CAA Policy promised in their Phase 2 Mode S consultation that all TMZs should go through the Airspace Change Proposal. As they have regulatory power to impose TMZs whether consultation occurs or not, they appear to have done so anyway without letting us know.
Wonder what else has sneeked in under the radar, so to speak ?
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10W: but it's all words innit? As you say it was in place before anyone called them TMZs, but although its establishment followed a different path, it has exactly the same effect - if someone asks one of your guys for a clearance above 6000ft in the TMA, they will immediately be asked to squawk, and if they say "negative transponder" you will probably keep them out until you sort out whether the traffic situation permits a non-transponding transit.
I guess on the same basis all UK airspace above FL100 is a TMZ.
NS
I guess on the same basis all UK airspace above FL100 is a TMZ.
NS
