Are you a Jersey Tower controller?
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Wicked Witch, I am not sure if you work in ATC at Jersey - I presume you do, judging by your knowledge of the situation. But I can't help thinking that you might be a newcomer, because the CI Zone is a lot less busy than it used to be, and the types of aicrraft that used to come to Jersey haven't really changed much in terms of class. There have been jets for 40 or more years, and a lot more than there are today. There were BAC 111s, B737s, B757s, Tridents (for a few years) and even L1011s. I worked in Jersey for a few years and it was fun! Lots of interesting things going on.
It is much more boring these days and, whilst I accept that "progress" has to be made, I do feel that the quality of controlling in the Zone seems to have dropped to a sort of Lowest Common Denominator level. This doesn't imply criticism of the Jersey controllers, but just the system that they are required to follow.
In the UK there are different standards of controlling in terms of both the controllers and the way they control, which I guess (never having been a controller) is due to the local manager deciding on the implementation of what he or she deems "best practice".
"Best Practice" might be a peculiarly British idea, but whoever's it is, it is a pretty stupid idea which doesn't seem to take account of individual, such as local, needs. It is pretty sad that we are going down this LCD/best practice route, and it is not just happening in ATC or specifically in Jersey.
And I mean no disrespect to any ATCO who is just doing his or her job as required by the boss. Jersey's ATCOs are polite and generally helpful, but you are still vectored all over the sky these days, and that never happened 5 years ago. What has changed?
It is much more boring these days and, whilst I accept that "progress" has to be made, I do feel that the quality of controlling in the Zone seems to have dropped to a sort of Lowest Common Denominator level. This doesn't imply criticism of the Jersey controllers, but just the system that they are required to follow.
In the UK there are different standards of controlling in terms of both the controllers and the way they control, which I guess (never having been a controller) is due to the local manager deciding on the implementation of what he or she deems "best practice".
"Best Practice" might be a peculiarly British idea, but whoever's it is, it is a pretty stupid idea which doesn't seem to take account of individual, such as local, needs. It is pretty sad that we are going down this LCD/best practice route, and it is not just happening in ATC or specifically in Jersey.
And I mean no disrespect to any ATCO who is just doing his or her job as required by the boss. Jersey's ATCOs are polite and generally helpful, but you are still vectored all over the sky these days, and that never happened 5 years ago. What has changed?
Join Date: Sep 2002
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Riverboat,
A pilot's perspective is different to that of an ATCO. WW wasn't saying that there are more jets now... methinks you'll find that prop aircraft are operating at jet levels on short routes these days.
Fact: Ortac is a bottleneck.
Best practice a bad thing? Not sure where you're coming from there. What do you want, everyone to have an independent and maverick approach in aviation???!
And I think you're probably wrong to assume she's a newcomer at the unit.
A pilot's perspective is different to that of an ATCO. WW wasn't saying that there are more jets now... methinks you'll find that prop aircraft are operating at jet levels on short routes these days.
Fact: Ortac is a bottleneck.
Best practice a bad thing? Not sure where you're coming from there. What do you want, everyone to have an independent and maverick approach in aviation???!
And I think you're probably wrong to assume she's a newcomer at the unit.
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: From the NW, but not St Ouen's eh!
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I love nothing more than giving aircraft as many headings as possible NOT!
WW remember the days of Fokkers and Shed's, a much greater mix of slow and fast. Aircraft in a Q to get a stand.....
I would take WW's vast experience on board (does that make up for the kebab comment??)
WW remember the days of Fokkers and Shed's, a much greater mix of slow and fast. Aircraft in a Q to get a stand.....
I would take WW's vast experience on board (does that make up for the kebab comment??)
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Hmmmm.... I seem to have gone from newcomer to old git in a few short postings...
Yes, it was much, much busier but volume and complexity are two very different problems and require different approaches.
Yes, it was much, much busier but volume and complexity are two very different problems and require different approaches.
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Eggs Petition - who decides "best practice"? Our dog is rather nervous and "best practice" for her is to avoid all other dogs and all other humans. Best practice for a starving stray in Italy is to get close to humans, as they are a potential source of food. In other words, best practice is not a real and actual thing, as it changes in different circumstances. It is a flexible thing, or should be, but in Britain people seem to think it is THE way to do all things. We Brits seem to have a lot of faith in the Health and Safety culture that presumably leads to this "Best Practice" idea.
You'll have heard the expression "dumbing down". "Best Practice" is most often an example of it.
That is why I don't like "Best Practice". I like good practice, and when it comes to CI Zone controlling, I just feel that the good practice in the past has become "Best Practice" now. Not as good, not as effective, and, honestly, the controllers don't seem a very happy bunch any more.
Wicked Witch, are you a controller at Jersey? I suspect you aren't but you'll no doubt correct me if I am wrong.
You'll have heard the expression "dumbing down". "Best Practice" is most often an example of it.
That is why I don't like "Best Practice". I like good practice, and when it comes to CI Zone controlling, I just feel that the good practice in the past has become "Best Practice" now. Not as good, not as effective, and, honestly, the controllers don't seem a very happy bunch any more.
Wicked Witch, are you a controller at Jersey? I suspect you aren't but you'll no doubt correct me if I am wrong.
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River,
No... learned behaviour for the dogs in question is to behave as they do because of experiences they alone have had.
That is learned behaviour but subjective.
Best practice is surely an ideal of industry standard from learned lessons that have been shared? That would make it objective in perspective and arguably but probably better as an applied ideal.
Couple of personal observations:
1; I don't think that controllers are ever completely happy and satisfied individuals at work. To explain why would take many pages of discussion. As to why there may be morale issues at Jersey, again it would take many pages of discussion.
2; Not sure, but yes, I think WW wields her whip in the vicinity of the CI. Beware.
No... learned behaviour for the dogs in question is to behave as they do because of experiences they alone have had.
That is learned behaviour but subjective.
Best practice is surely an ideal of industry standard from learned lessons that have been shared? That would make it objective in perspective and arguably but probably better as an applied ideal.
Couple of personal observations:
1; I don't think that controllers are ever completely happy and satisfied individuals at work. To explain why would take many pages of discussion. As to why there may be morale issues at Jersey, again it would take many pages of discussion.
2; Not sure, but yes, I think WW wields her whip in the vicinity of the CI. Beware.
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Ready to fire up her broomstick?
Could the WW be a from a James Bond Film and turn out to be Pussy Galore??
Is she I take it we are talking about A SHE?? THE Wicked Witch be getting ready to fire up her broom stick and cause havoc on the air waves shortly??
After all the 5th of November is not far away??
Is she I take it we are talking about A SHE?? THE Wicked Witch be getting ready to fire up her broom stick and cause havoc on the air waves shortly??
After all the 5th of November is not far away??
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Eggs - fair enough! Maybe commenting about "Best Practice" isn't what we should be doing here, so I will move on. And as for Jersey and a wicked witch, I wonder if this is a pseudonym for a man? A good way of disguising who you are!
And I won't be enjoying the Channel Islands so much in future, as they are moving me to Scotland! (With my blessing - new aircraft, bigger faster!) But I'll still be down once a week, and, to be fair, it is always a pleasure and I'm not upset with the controllers or anyone else: I was just making an observation. Things change and rarely get better.
And I won't be enjoying the Channel Islands so much in future, as they are moving me to Scotland! (With my blessing - new aircraft, bigger faster!) But I'll still be down once a week, and, to be fair, it is always a pleasure and I'm not upset with the controllers or anyone else: I was just making an observation. Things change and rarely get better.
