Callsign Speedbird 8 Yankee Golf
Per Ardua ad Astraeus
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 18,579
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Know anything about the Double Scotch callsign Lon
'Chug-a-lug' ring any bells?
More than just an ATCO
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Up someone's nose
Age: 75
Posts: 1,768
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
TT, probably Kees S. You know alcohol would never pass my lips
BOAC - the controllers' favourite airline. I would never swoop so low as to sell encyclopedias. The wife, yes. Encyclopedias, no.
yes we probably spoke many times. I was at Maastricht from day 1, first in the Brussels Sectors, lastly in the Deco lot.
BOAC - the controllers' favourite airline. I would never swoop so low as to sell encyclopedias. The wife, yes. Encyclopedias, no.
yes we probably spoke many times. I was at Maastricht from day 1, first in the Brussels Sectors, lastly in the Deco lot.
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: a few track miles south of BEKOL
Age: 57
Posts: 140
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
the thing i find interesting is that this call sign methodology is not consistently applied. for example, the LHR - YUL sector still uses the 'speedbird niner fife' call sign, while the return uses '8 yankee golf' (as opposed to niner four). i would have thought if they would use one call sign methodology. i'm pretty sure tho that the YUL - LHR uses 8 yankee golf due to the fact that they follow speedbird 294 all the way across the pond.
Last edited by bigjames; 3rd Aug 2009 at 00:59. Reason: correct aviation numerology!
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think it's rather clunky having some of those callsigns, as they are pretty hard to say. I think BA are quite lucky as they use the flight number where possible whereas Lufthansa use trigraphs. If everyone used the new system it would just be even more confusing, especially as Lufty change the callsigns every season. Intuitively I always thing they're "Fraction" rather than Lufty with those callsigns.
easyJet use the new system for UK domestic and LTN, but not LGW and STN.
I remember the chaos back in 1995 when BMA1 became BMA1NL, much less elegant but avoided the problem of
BMA1 GLA-LHR
BMA51 EDI-LHR
BMA81 BFS-LHR
BMA331 MME-LHR
BMA411 LBA-LHR all working Heathrow Director at the same time....
easyJet use the new system for UK domestic and LTN, but not LGW and STN.
I remember the chaos back in 1995 when BMA1 became BMA1NL, much less elegant but avoided the problem of
BMA1 GLA-LHR
BMA51 EDI-LHR
BMA81 BFS-LHR
BMA331 MME-LHR
BMA411 LBA-LHR all working Heathrow Director at the same time....
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: The foot of Mt. Belzoni.
Posts: 2,001
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I remember, seeing strange circular 'stickers' from the 1980s, "DDD, CHUG-A-LUG", or something similar.
Allegedly it was related to sponsorship of a controllers football competition and the DDD meant 'Don't Delay Dan-Air'.
I might be wrong though.
Allegedly it was related to sponsorship of a controllers football competition and the DDD meant 'Don't Delay Dan-Air'.
I might be wrong though.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: USA
Age: 66
Posts: 2,183
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Zooker...quite right...I believe it was because DanAir were amenable to giving ATC cheapies/freebies and as such we would not delay them(code word Chug-A-Lug). Allegedly
Per Ardua ad Astraeus
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 18,579
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There's a rumour there might have been some 'dwinkies' involved too? It was good to see the tradition carried into the BA days post '92 but it gradually got diluted ('non-standard, don't you know?')
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: In the rain
Posts: 269
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BA94 was Speedbird Niner Four up until mid 2008 when it was changed to 8YG. BA95 flew as Speedbird 7MY (iirc) for a while around the same time but was changed back to Speedbird Niner Fife.
Probably to do with BA294 as Thunderbug / bigjames mentioned, the change was probably caused by one of the flights being retimed or someone complaining.
I wish the people I work for would get into the alphanumerics. Picture 6331, 6321, 5231 and 1339 (to take just one example) all on frequency at the same time, late in the evening with thunderstorms doing their best to obscure the radio.
S.
Probably to do with BA294 as Thunderbug / bigjames mentioned, the change was probably caused by one of the flights being retimed or someone complaining.
I wish the people I work for would get into the alphanumerics. Picture 6331, 6321, 5231 and 1339 (to take just one example) all on frequency at the same time, late in the evening with thunderstorms doing their best to obscure the radio.
S.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Germany
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Alphanumeric callsigns the next best thing since sliced bread ...
Personally, I don't believe alphanumeric callsigns are better than digits only when it comes to reducing confusion. Just think of all the alphanumeric tail numbers that fly around daily, plus it doesn't help if, for example, a certain UK airline that operates into Gatwick uses ABC12GW as a callsign. If other airlines come up with the same bright idea of choosing their callsigns after the airport the flight operates to or from ...
Where I work, I sometimes end up with callsigns like ABC787Y, DEF78DY, and GHI87Y which doesn|t do a lot more than tie up the tongues of everyone involved ...
Where I work, I sometimes end up with callsigns like ABC787Y, DEF78DY, and GHI87Y which doesn|t do a lot more than tie up the tongues of everyone involved ...
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: LONDON
Age: 51
Posts: 525
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As a learning PPL - CAP413 does not seem to give any indication as to how and why these non registration compliant names are allocated. Surely registration would be more useflul than flight numbers.
I see there is alot of flexibility at the discression of the controller to avoid confusion as in abbreviating callsigns - but does G-XXXX have to sign on as such following cap413 - or do they just state speedbird xxxx.
Are the callsigns an unwritten rule ? or have I not got that far through CAP 413.
I see there is alot of flexibility at the discression of the controller to avoid confusion as in abbreviating callsigns - but does G-XXXX have to sign on as such following cap413 - or do they just state speedbird xxxx.
Are the callsigns an unwritten rule ? or have I not got that far through CAP 413.
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Berkshire, UK
Age: 79
Posts: 8,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
<<Surely registration would be more useflul than flight numbers.>>
jofm5 Yes, of course it would and many years ago commercial aircraft did use registration letters as callsign, as do the vast majority of light aircraft now. How to use the callsign is clearly explained in the R/T Manual.
Airlines use flight numbers because the flight plans for scheduled flights are stored in ATC computers worldwide. The flight plans are automatically activated for ATC purposes sometime prior to the scheduled time and all controllers who will be responsible for the flight are provided with flight plan details automatically. If registration letters were used, every one of those flight plans would either have to be individually filed or the airlines would have to notify ATC of the registrations of the aircraft on particular flights. To be honest, airlines often have trouble amending the aircraft type, which is why ATC requires pilots to confirm the type, so it woulod be a monumental nightmare messing with registrations.
Lastly, in the event of confusion ATC can request a pilot to use any callsign they choose but it doesn't happen too often.
jofm5 Yes, of course it would and many years ago commercial aircraft did use registration letters as callsign, as do the vast majority of light aircraft now. How to use the callsign is clearly explained in the R/T Manual.
Airlines use flight numbers because the flight plans for scheduled flights are stored in ATC computers worldwide. The flight plans are automatically activated for ATC purposes sometime prior to the scheduled time and all controllers who will be responsible for the flight are provided with flight plan details automatically. If registration letters were used, every one of those flight plans would either have to be individually filed or the airlines would have to notify ATC of the registrations of the aircraft on particular flights. To be honest, airlines often have trouble amending the aircraft type, which is why ATC requires pilots to confirm the type, so it woulod be a monumental nightmare messing with registrations.
Lastly, in the event of confusion ATC can request a pilot to use any callsign they choose but it doesn't happen too often.
Naughty but Nice
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Southern England
Posts: 194
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
<<Lastly, in the event of confusion ATC can request a pilot to use any callsign they choose but it doesn't happen too often>>
Which reminds me of the old tale of a callsign confusion where the controller in question told one of the pilots that from now on he would be known as "Bob"... just after the Blackadder series was fresh out I believe. Apparently the pilot was a bit of a stick in the mud and didn't see the funny side.
Cheers,
N
"Keep smiling, it makes people wonder what you're up to..."
Which reminds me of the old tale of a callsign confusion where the controller in question told one of the pilots that from now on he would be known as "Bob"... just after the Blackadder series was fresh out I believe. Apparently the pilot was a bit of a stick in the mud and didn't see the funny side.
Cheers,
N
"Keep smiling, it makes people wonder what you're up to..."
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Berkshire, UK
Age: 79
Posts: 8,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Probably the same misery we had at Heathrow once. BEA Viscount went round, told us there was a lady stuck in the lavatory. We asked: "Will she be there from Monday to Saturday?" He filed a complaint... So, if you're reading this, Captain, you were a miserable ratbag!!!
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: 51N
Age: 72
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well . . . perhaps we should have said Monday to Sunday . . if she was feeling "All Week" 
Or . . IF she was . . "Alwight" . . perhaps that was the best place for her
Cheers . . 99
Or . . IF she was . . "Alwight" . . perhaps that was the best place for her
Cheers . . 99