What does 'O' stand for?
Time merchant
Joined: Sep 2001
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From: Belgium
It's the region, it doesn't stand for anything in particular, "Over there!" maybe.
Countries in that region with the indicator prefixed by O are:
Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, UAE, Oman, Pakistan, Iraq, Syria, Qatar and Yemen.
flowman
Countries in that region with the indicator prefixed by O are:
Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, UAE, Oman, Pakistan, Iraq, Syria, Qatar and Yemen.
flowman
Joined: Jul 2005
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From: New Zealand
Hi sharp,
If you're at an ATC unit, just ask for the ICAO location indicator decoding book. It has an excellent, fold-out map that shows all the various regions and their associated identifying region letters. If I recall correctly, they don't possess any real logic to them; they are a hang-over from the past when the AFTN couldn't handle a lot of figures. I sometimes wonder why plain language hasn't replaced a lot of the data put into FPLs, NOTAMs and the like.
We're stuck with them for now. Cheers.
If you're at an ATC unit, just ask for the ICAO location indicator decoding book. It has an excellent, fold-out map that shows all the various regions and their associated identifying region letters. If I recall correctly, they don't possess any real logic to them; they are a hang-over from the past when the AFTN couldn't handle a lot of figures. I sometimes wonder why plain language hasn't replaced a lot of the data put into FPLs, NOTAMs and the like.
We're stuck with them for now. Cheers.
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 73
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From: Namibia
From what I've figured out, some countries have the second letter as a designator. Examples:
LATI - Tirana, Albania
LGTS - Thessaloniki, Greece
LBSF - Sofia, Bulgaria
EDDL - Dusseldorf, Germany (Deutschland)
LIMC - Milano, Italy
EPWR - Wroclaw, Poland
LFPB - Le Bourget, France
ENGM - Oslo, Norway
And the list goes on...
Yet, there are many that have no resemblance at all...
LWSK - Skopje, Macedonia
LJLJ - Ljubljana, Slovenia
EKCH - Copenhagen, Denmark
It could be a coincidence, I am not sure...
Somebody with more knowledge could tell us.
LATI - Tirana, Albania
LGTS - Thessaloniki, Greece
LBSF - Sofia, Bulgaria
EDDL - Dusseldorf, Germany (Deutschland)
LIMC - Milano, Italy
EPWR - Wroclaw, Poland
LFPB - Le Bourget, France
ENGM - Oslo, Norway
And the list goes on...
Yet, there are many that have no resemblance at all...
LWSK - Skopje, Macedonia
LJLJ - Ljubljana, Slovenia
EKCH - Copenhagen, Denmark
It could be a coincidence, I am not sure...
Somebody with more knowledge could tell us.
Joined: Nov 2006
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From: UK
The definitive reference is ICAO DOC 7910: Location Indicators, but you need a suscription to get it. Wikipedia, although sometimes questioned for its accuracy, gives us this map: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...-countries.png
Joined: Feb 2008
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From: Standby...call you back..
Hi,
my small contribution to this...
E stand for (Europe , mainly north europe)
L stand for latin contries like Italy, france, spain etc...
second letter for the contry..B for Belgium, E for Spain ( epagnol) etc..
for some contry 3th letter stand for region..ex lfPb P = Paris
Latest letter sometimes related to the city but no real rule..
my small contribution to this...
E stand for (Europe , mainly north europe)
L stand for latin contries like Italy, france, spain etc...
second letter for the contry..B for Belgium, E for Spain ( epagnol) etc..
for some contry 3th letter stand for region..ex lfPb P = Paris
Latest letter sometimes related to the city but no real rule..
Joined: Apr 2001
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From: Australia
Years ago, Australia had A. For example:
ASCB - Canberra
ASSY - Sydney
At an ICAO meeting it was decided that a different system was going to be used to determine the location idenifiers.
The Australian respresentative put up his hand and asked, 'Why?'
Therefore, Australia got Y.
In Oz the second letter generally relates to the FIR, although many places are a throwback to when there were more that the current 2 FIRs. For example:
YMML - Melbourne, in the Melbourne FIR
YPPH - Perth, formally in the Perth FIR but now in the ML FIR
Y
ASCB - Canberra
ASSY - Sydney
At an ICAO meeting it was decided that a different system was going to be used to determine the location idenifiers.
The Australian respresentative put up his hand and asked, 'Why?'
Therefore, Australia got Y.
In Oz the second letter generally relates to the FIR, although many places are a throwback to when there were more that the current 2 FIRs. For example:
YMML - Melbourne, in the Melbourne FIR
YPPH - Perth, formally in the Perth FIR but now in the ML FIR
Y
Joined: Jul 2005
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From: New Zealand
Hi Rule 3,
You're right; modesty prevented me from mentioning that. As an aside, Oman does have an historical claim to large parts of the UAE. Remember, it was Oman and the Trucial States
Just waiting for the cross-border skirmishing to start
You're right; modesty prevented me from mentioning that. As an aside, Oman does have an historical claim to large parts of the UAE. Remember, it was Oman and the Trucial States
Just waiting for the cross-border skirmishing to start
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Over Graz
Minor contribution: The "E" in Spain is for España
Some areas, such as South America: SBRF (eg.) South, Brazil, Recife
Places like Canada, for instance: CYKZ for Buttonville.
Actually, many, many places in Canada have codes that don't make any sense at all.
Some areas, such as South America: SBRF (eg.) South, Brazil, Recife
Places like Canada, for instance: CYKZ for Buttonville.
Actually, many, many places in Canada have codes that don't make any sense at all.
More than just an ATCO
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 1,773
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From: Up someone's nose
From the old AFTN designators; Denmark uses EK because ED was already allocated to West Germany. ( East germany had ET IIRC) EK fits nicely with Køpenhagen.
In the UK the third letter designated the circuit therefore GW for Luton and GD for bristol Lulsgate and for most (all?) civilian airfields in Scotland having P, Q for the military
Of course, this was all still in the future when I started.
In the UK the third letter designated the circuit therefore GW for Luton and GD for bristol Lulsgate and for most (all?) civilian airfields in Scotland having P, Q for the military
Of course, this was all still in the future when I started.
Last edited by Lon More; 8th March 2008 at 13:54.
Joined: Apr 2002
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From: Who cares? ;-)
as has already been mentioned, "E" is for most of Europe. The second letter "D" for Germany from "Deutschland". Most large international airfields have a second "D", then the letter fitting it, if available.... like Frankfurt= EDDF, Hamburg=EDDH, etc. After the wall fell, all civilian fields kept the "ED__", the military ones were then given the "ET__" formerly used by the East German fields, as already mentioned.
Other fields are given indicators relating to the next big airport plus their own name, when possible. Egelsbach near Frankfurt has EDFE (FE=Frankfurt / Egelsbach), EDFM=Mannheim.
Since you can only have so many combinations with 4 letters, some indicators make no sense... though sometimes still do if you look at them closer. Aschaffenburg has EDFC. F=Frankfurt, C= VOR "Charlie", located nearby. Or a small field north of Frankfurt, EDGR=Giessen-Reiskirchen. Some may have historical meanings that are no longer clear.
But does it really matter?
Other fields are given indicators relating to the next big airport plus their own name, when possible. Egelsbach near Frankfurt has EDFE (FE=Frankfurt / Egelsbach), EDFM=Mannheim.
Since you can only have so many combinations with 4 letters, some indicators make no sense... though sometimes still do if you look at them closer. Aschaffenburg has EDFC. F=Frankfurt, C= VOR "Charlie", located nearby. Or a small field north of Frankfurt, EDGR=Giessen-Reiskirchen. Some may have historical meanings that are no longer clear.
But does it really matter?
aceatco, retired
Joined: Sep 2002
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From: one airshow or another
In the UK the third letter designated the circuit therefore GW for Luton and GD for bristol Lulsgate and for most (all?) civilian airfields in Scotland having P, Q for the military
Luton used to be EGLN when connected to Heathrow Comms Centre, then became EGGW when connected to the (then) 'new' Croydon Comms Centre (went there once, Jeeez!) Now everyone is (sort of) connected to Heathrow again. Happy days.
More than just an ATCO
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 1,773
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From: Up someone's nose
That was a bit before our time i think Steve.
It lives on , I see, EGLN London/Heathrow (Southern Area Maintenance Unit).
BTW Re Croydon. Wasn't one of Luton Flying Club's Moths the last aircraft to land there, after the airfield had officially closed? An engine problem or WX?
Happy days; Phil Jeffrey and me in a C150, but we didn't have the suffix 'heavy' then
It lives on , I see, EGLN London/Heathrow (Southern Area Maintenance Unit).
BTW Re Croydon. Wasn't one of Luton Flying Club's Moths the last aircraft to land there, after the airfield had officially closed? An engine problem or WX?
Happy days; Phil Jeffrey and me in a C150, but we didn't have the suffix 'heavy' then