Visual approach
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ATCO2 .....nobody is argueing here - everyone simply discussing what is relevant in their neck of the woods - if you don't wanna contribute, don't.
Back to the issue - in my books, SVFR and VFR don't fly VMC approaches, they are still considered "VFR", therefore they fly visual flight rules! SVR is treated as IFR wrt seperation standards, but is not cleared for any type of approach. Here SVFR is also only in the CTR to allow VFR a/c in and out when vis is below VFR minimas.....
Back to the issue - in my books, SVFR and VFR don't fly VMC approaches, they are still considered "VFR", therefore they fly visual flight rules! SVR is treated as IFR wrt seperation standards, but is not cleared for any type of approach. Here SVFR is also only in the CTR to allow VFR a/c in and out when vis is below VFR minimas.....
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Approaches maintaining VMC were pulled out of the UK MATS Pt1 a few years ago. It was in order to prevent confusion between approaches maintaining VMC, visual approaches and visual descents..... guess that worked then
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AFAIR "VMC Descent/Climb Through" is a procedure used when you don't feel like vectoring to 5 miles to get separation and the pilot requests it, has the other in sight, by day yadda yadda yadda (as per Delay Undet). It is not coupled to an approach of some type be it Visual-, VMC- or IFR-Approach. That said, I do not hold an App rating of any kind so I could be smoking some good S%$T.
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@ATCO2: thanx for your post.
Basically that was my question, is there anywhere in the ICAO documents anything about visual approach and FL100?
Since you wrote "Wait for that to be written somewhere in national regulation to be applicable to your airport.", I guess there isn't
My only mistake was actually that I didn't specify ICAO docs when starting the thread
Sorry
But it was interesting to read what it's like in other parts of the world.
Basically that was my question, is there anywhere in the ICAO documents anything about visual approach and FL100?
Since you wrote "Wait for that to be written somewhere in national regulation to be applicable to your airport.", I guess there isn't
My only mistake was actually that I didn't specify ICAO docs when starting the thread
Sorry
But it was interesting to read what it's like in other parts of the world.
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Bluesky : isn't vmc climb/descent to be used to expedite traffic when radar is not available - not when as you so elloquantly put it " when you dont feel like vectoring to 5 miles". i was taught on my approach radar course that i count authorise VMC Climb or Descent if I had serviceable radar.
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TATC, unfortunately I can't answer you on that one. Suffice to say that I have used this on many an occation(with radar), before the 10 000ft/FL100 rule was added a year or two ago. The amount of clandestine prompting involved in getting a pilot to ask for it was legendary. But as for radar/non-radar, I have no idea. Some parts of the world utilise it differently. Damn sad that it can't be used above FL100/10 000ft.
I would think (sucking this out of my thumb though), that whether you have radar or not won't matter as the pilots do their own separation.
I would think (sucking this out of my thumb though), that whether you have radar or not won't matter as the pilots do their own separation.
Last edited by BlueSkye; 15th Feb 2007 at 12:47. Reason: Stuff added
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Hi,
I have simmiler question. Today happend to me. One of the pilot was radar vectored for the ILS approach and at minimum radar vectoring altitude requested to descent visualy to join ILS. Some ATCOs allow this, instructing an aircraft to maintain ground contact(terrein clearance) and to report established. I do not do it. I have never been told to do so during my education but I saw some ATCOs in neighbouring countries do it. Who can tell me if it is allowable or not taking into consideration ICAO rules.
Thanks in advance,
Regards
I have simmiler question. Today happend to me. One of the pilot was radar vectored for the ILS approach and at minimum radar vectoring altitude requested to descent visualy to join ILS. Some ATCOs allow this, instructing an aircraft to maintain ground contact(terrein clearance) and to report established. I do not do it. I have never been told to do so during my education but I saw some ATCOs in neighbouring countries do it. Who can tell me if it is allowable or not taking into consideration ICAO rules.
Thanks in advance,
Regards
