St Mawgan
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Proctor,
You will be well looked after, St Mawgan has had many plaudits from previous Work Experience students. You may not make it as a fully endorsed controller during the week, but you will have plenty of hands on experience within the constraints of an operational tower.
St Mawgan has a reputation for being a sleepy hollow, but as mentioned earlier it has some extremely busy periods, and plenty of variety. One day last year saw 26 different aircraft types. Mix in one of the busiest LARS units and the real picture is somewhat different.
Nearly every detachment to St Mawgan comes up with the same comments about how it suits their needs, and many also wish they were based here. The MOD is being very short sighted in choosing to close the base.
As for the comment about time off, we wish! The airfield is open 363 days a year, to the hours previously mentioned, and has less staff numbers than units with little or no weekend or extended hours commitment - so yes, they do lots of secondary duties, but they also put in a lot of hours too. The Raytheon Falconer Trophy(Cossor Trophy of old) may come in for a fair bit of banter, but hey, we get a good night out at their expense in a top hotel, so who's complaining!
PS We will make the tea, just make sure you bring a plentiful supply of biscuits to go with it! See you soon.
Raven
You will be well looked after, St Mawgan has had many plaudits from previous Work Experience students. You may not make it as a fully endorsed controller during the week, but you will have plenty of hands on experience within the constraints of an operational tower.
St Mawgan has a reputation for being a sleepy hollow, but as mentioned earlier it has some extremely busy periods, and plenty of variety. One day last year saw 26 different aircraft types. Mix in one of the busiest LARS units and the real picture is somewhat different.
Nearly every detachment to St Mawgan comes up with the same comments about how it suits their needs, and many also wish they were based here. The MOD is being very short sighted in choosing to close the base.
As for the comment about time off, we wish! The airfield is open 363 days a year, to the hours previously mentioned, and has less staff numbers than units with little or no weekend or extended hours commitment - so yes, they do lots of secondary duties, but they also put in a lot of hours too. The Raytheon Falconer Trophy(Cossor Trophy of old) may come in for a fair bit of banter, but hey, we get a good night out at their expense in a top hotel, so who's complaining!
PS We will make the tea, just make sure you bring a plentiful supply of biscuits to go with it! See you soon.
Raven
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Having flown from there this morning with Southwest Airways, I can confirm some at least of what has been said here - a number of small delta-winged fast manoeuvrable and NOISY ac were wizzing around as we walked out to the Dash 8.
The thing that really pi55ed me off as a member of the RAF travelling on duty was that the cheeky g1ts at the 'Newquay International Airport' charged us an additional £5 each 'Airport Development Charge'. In effect (if I ever manage to get a claim into JPA) the RAF is paying for the joke of a civvy airport on the other side of its own runway to be developed... arrse.
Presumably the civvies don't have 'Airfield Driving Permits?'. If they do, I recommend SATCO St Mawgan keeps a closer eye on what's going-on round the apron - one numpty reversed a large transit pick-up truck around the back of one of the ac at about 20 mph - no sign of a marshaller!
The thing that really pi55ed me off as a member of the RAF travelling on duty was that the cheeky g1ts at the 'Newquay International Airport' charged us an additional £5 each 'Airport Development Charge'. In effect (if I ever manage to get a claim into JPA) the RAF is paying for the joke of a civvy airport on the other side of its own runway to be developed... arrse.
Presumably the civvies don't have 'Airfield Driving Permits?'. If they do, I recommend SATCO St Mawgan keeps a closer eye on what's going-on round the apron - one numpty reversed a large transit pick-up truck around the back of one of the ac at about 20 mph - no sign of a marshaller!
Last edited by SirToppamHat; 30th Jun 2006 at 16:49.
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Rumour is that the Jobs for the new 'Civil' St Mawgan will be in Flight next month. Anyone any details?
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SirToppam
Thats a bit of a jaundiced view about the development tax. As you say, the RAF will reimburse you so you don't lose out, and as far as the airport is concerned, you are just another passenger - the fact that you are in the RAF is irrelevant. The Airport(or its owners the County Council) is charged by the MOD under the terms of their contract for the use of their services, and it is up to them how they raise their revenue. In effect, the MOD is being paid for you using the airport. The departure tax is controversial, and a lot of hot air has been vented over it, not least by a couple of the airlines using it as propaganda to hide their real reasons for not continuing scheduled services - Ryanair being the main culprit. However, most passengers questioned about it are in favour of it, or at least, do not mind paying it. Also bear in mind that the alternative to the tax is to make the ratepayers pay by increasing the council tax. Surely its better to charge the people that use the service, rather than the local residents?
And if you are less than amused by the tax, spare a thought for the staff at the airport - they get no concession either, and they earn far less than you do.
As for the ramp staff - they do not come under SATCOs jurisdiction until they enter the taxiway - the aprons come under the control of the airport. RAF personnel cannot enter the aprons when aircraft are on the ground unless cleared to do so by the airport security staff, and that is laid down by the CAA. That doesn't excuse bad driving on the airfield, but are you sure there was no marshaller??
Try to look on the bright side - where else in the UK do you get an air display while waiting for your flight?
Raven
Thats a bit of a jaundiced view about the development tax. As you say, the RAF will reimburse you so you don't lose out, and as far as the airport is concerned, you are just another passenger - the fact that you are in the RAF is irrelevant. The Airport(or its owners the County Council) is charged by the MOD under the terms of their contract for the use of their services, and it is up to them how they raise their revenue. In effect, the MOD is being paid for you using the airport. The departure tax is controversial, and a lot of hot air has been vented over it, not least by a couple of the airlines using it as propaganda to hide their real reasons for not continuing scheduled services - Ryanair being the main culprit. However, most passengers questioned about it are in favour of it, or at least, do not mind paying it. Also bear in mind that the alternative to the tax is to make the ratepayers pay by increasing the council tax. Surely its better to charge the people that use the service, rather than the local residents?
And if you are less than amused by the tax, spare a thought for the staff at the airport - they get no concession either, and they earn far less than you do.
As for the ramp staff - they do not come under SATCOs jurisdiction until they enter the taxiway - the aprons come under the control of the airport. RAF personnel cannot enter the aprons when aircraft are on the ground unless cleared to do so by the airport security staff, and that is laid down by the CAA. That doesn't excuse bad driving on the airfield, but are you sure there was no marshaller??
Try to look on the bright side - where else in the UK do you get an air display while waiting for your flight?
Raven
You should really enjoy it down there
As everyone else has said, July will be fairly busy. All sorts down here at the moment - Even a herc doing circuits over the flat
Looking at them from the civvie side, the Controllers all seem very polite and friendly. And no doubt just as sociable
As everyone else has said, July will be fairly busy. All sorts down here at the moment - Even a herc doing circuits over the flat
Looking at them from the civvie side, the Controllers all seem very polite and friendly. And no doubt just as sociable
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Originally Posted by Grumpy Old ATCO
Rumour is that the Jobs for the new 'Civil' St Mawgan will be in Flight next month. Anyone any details?
BD
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Sorry Raven30, but this is just another example of the traveller being hit whilst the airlines boast about how cheap their flights are. Now I am not saying that it's reasonable for the council-tax payer to pick up the cost of the development, but I agree with you the cost should at least be passed-on HONESTLY to the airlines which would force them to charge more realistic prices rather than blame the council. The main reason I was grumpy was because of the irony of it.
Absolutely! I was astonished by what I saw, but, as you suggest, it was all on the apron.
On the whole, though, better than flying to Exeter or Bristol then driving!
STH
are you sure there was no marshaller??
On the whole, though, better than flying to Exeter or Bristol then driving!
STH
Last edited by SirToppamHat; 1st Jul 2006 at 13:38.
Where would SERCo get the controllers from anyway? When NATS lost Boscombe Down, the successful bidder (Airwork) was only able to get about 5 controllers to replace the 16 or so NATS ones; as far as I know none of these validated (apart from one who transferred from NATS and therefore already had validations) hence the CAA refused the unit a license and the RAF took over!
It would be no good recruiting abroad, because you would need an ATCO License valid in the UK. Safeskys where are you?
It would be no good recruiting abroad, because you would need an ATCO License valid in the UK. Safeskys where are you?
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Safeskys - no thanks!
No doubt the Flight International ads will reveal all - but I don't think either of the two contractors mentioned will get a look in.
No doubt the Flight International ads will reveal all - but I don't think either of the two contractors mentioned will get a look in.
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Umm, must wander down to St Moggie one day. Last time I visited there was a Victor sitting rather sadly at the end of the runway having slightly extended its landing run and two 5 Sqdn Lightnings on the pan as well as the usual bunch of Nimrods that were based there.
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add to that approach where it seems the whole of cornish puddle jumpers need to talk to you and tell you there life story! we did over 15000 LARS tracks last year and countless FIS's! Bloody civvies!!
You just can't win! You don't talk to them and hear them talk about unidentified traffic, so you call them, to be helpful, and get accused of giving your life story
I had a bimble down to Lands End last month, with a mate in his kite. Decided to follow him as he had a transponder and I didn't. Next, I heard the controller asking him if we were a two-ship formation (we were microlights actually), to which he replied to the affirmative, at which point I thought I'd identify myself.
When signing off to go to Lands End the controller told me to "have fun with your playmate!" Cheeky $^&ger!
Can't complain about the service though. Kept the tanker at a distance from us on the return trip, I couldn't quite get the pilot's name as he zoomed past!
You just can't win! You don't talk to them and hear them talk about unidentified traffic, so you call them, to be helpful, and get accused of giving your life story
I had a bimble down to Lands End last month, with a mate in his kite. Decided to follow him as he had a transponder and I didn't. Next, I heard the controller asking him if we were a two-ship formation (we were microlights actually), to which he replied to the affirmative, at which point I thought I'd identify myself.
When signing off to go to Lands End the controller told me to "have fun with your playmate!" Cheeky $^&ger!
Can't complain about the service though. Kept the tanker at a distance from us on the return trip, I couldn't quite get the pilot's name as he zoomed past!
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the mediator!
pbrookes, totally understand your point especially as mil ATCO who also flies said puddle jumpers as well as providing service to them every day. I get to see both sides of the story.
Trouble is the CAA teaches PPLs to say everything on RT, and you do often get a rather protracted transmission. A good tip I was taught, which rings true as a controller, is to check in first with your call sign and type of service requested - then wait for the controller to respond rather than go head first into all the other details. Gives everyone a "heads up" of who is out there and a chance to write a flight strip!
I often find myself battling for either side when I find myself in a radar room or flying club crew room - always good to play devils advocate.
My opinion is that if there is someone available for you to talk to then do, Especially at St Mawgan where the MATZ blocks off the entire land mass and they will often, as you said, require some degree of coordination.
As for St Mawgan generally, given the current tempo of operations and the RAF requirement to be able to activate and run a civil airport, we might have lost a key source of experience and knowledge when the place closes. It is a lovely bit of the UK and is more than interseting in terms of traffic from an ATC perspective. Given the achievements of the Air Traffikers last year their award of the Falconer Trophy was well deserved. The previous Chief of the Air Staff referred to the exercises at SMG as the most important activity undetaken by the RAF second only to deployed operations.
Nuff said.
Trouble is the CAA teaches PPLs to say everything on RT, and you do often get a rather protracted transmission. A good tip I was taught, which rings true as a controller, is to check in first with your call sign and type of service requested - then wait for the controller to respond rather than go head first into all the other details. Gives everyone a "heads up" of who is out there and a chance to write a flight strip!
I often find myself battling for either side when I find myself in a radar room or flying club crew room - always good to play devils advocate.
My opinion is that if there is someone available for you to talk to then do, Especially at St Mawgan where the MATZ blocks off the entire land mass and they will often, as you said, require some degree of coordination.
As for St Mawgan generally, given the current tempo of operations and the RAF requirement to be able to activate and run a civil airport, we might have lost a key source of experience and knowledge when the place closes. It is a lovely bit of the UK and is more than interseting in terms of traffic from an ATC perspective. Given the achievements of the Air Traffikers last year their award of the Falconer Trophy was well deserved. The previous Chief of the Air Staff referred to the exercises at SMG as the most important activity undetaken by the RAF second only to deployed operations.
Nuff said.
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How do you EGDG ATCOs manage all that traffic that's been talked about on this thread given the amount of clutter from wind farms? You've got 4 or 5 of them visible - must be a nightmare providing a RAS?
NS
NS