No Speed?

[cavokkid]

I would like to ask a question to any London controler handling departures at LHR. More often than not we are told 'No Speed' - what exactly do you expect from us following that clearance. I understand it to mean that once above 6000ft we cleared to increase speed above 250kts, in order to comply with noise routes. However many collegues seem to prefer to increase speed immediately regardless of present altitude or position in the departure.

I'd appreciate your professional advice.

[Not Long Now]

It means you do not have to remain at 250kts or below whilst on the SID, and can accelerate now, or whenever you want. You do not have to, but can if you like.
As far as I am aware it does not mean you can ignore noise criteria (point of and radius of turns etc) although from heathrow as I recall most of these are fairly immediate on departure (Staines bit on DVR off 27?) and so probably finished by the time we lift the speed. You do not have to wait until 6000ft.

Even though I believe the noise tracking remains the pilot's responsibility, Gatwick departures to the west off easterlies and to the east of westerlies, we are not supposed to remove the speed until the initial turn has been made to 'assist ' in keeping the plane within the noise profile, although these turns are far tighter than any heathrow turns (except possibly CPT off 09).

Also the thread on 250kts presently running may negate all this as we are to trial 'not routinely lifting the speed restriction on departure' in the TMA...

[ukatco_535]

Not long now,

Is there another reason for not taking the speeds off Gatwick sids going 'round the corner'. i.e. so they do not erode separation on heathrow sids??

Just curious as that was my belief... tho it does also keep them on the NPRs

[Not Long Now]

UKA,
as I remember (about 7 years ago???) when there was a pink/yellow/blue, what ever it was, issued stating not to remove speed 'til round the corner it was primarily due to noise tracking and those nasty little reports that appeared every now and again saying ABC123 left the NPR track. The airlines get fined, look into it, and discover we said no speed, so blamed us. This was overruled but a reminder issued to 'help' by delaying the no speed til turn complete.
Yes it also helps not to hit the LL RMA/deps but I think safety was secondary to appeasing noise lobby on this particular one.
I may of course be wrong, memory not what it was in old age and all that...

[AlanM]

It means you do not have to remain at 250kts or below whilst on the SID, and can accelerate now, or whenever you want. You do not have to, but can if you like

....and of course some aircraft - esp A340s - even slow down/remain very slow when NO SPEED is given, to give a better ROC. At least one nice little video on the safety booth-kiosk-thingy showing that one!

[eyeinthesky]

Also, the lifting of a speed restriction does not remove the requirement for you to comply with any level restrictions, either on a SID or further down route. If speeding up means you won't be able to make the restrictions, don't speed up!

[ukatco_535]

I was thinkign along the lines of a Gatwick SAM dep off 26 coming into possible conflict with a slow climbing MID dep if the speed was taken off before turning the corner... not so much about the RMA.

We all know how well Springbok 221 climbs!!