Highest ever holding stack entry?
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Are you just talking about the final holding stacks for say LHR or are you talking at any level at any hold for whatever reason?
I know Lambourne and Ockham have both had a/c in them at FL170 (17,000 ft) when holding for LHR quite regularly and possibly even Bovingdon (don't know normal upper limits), further out BRASO has held regularly upto FL240, BEWLI has held FL260, and these all in normal ops waiting for approaches at LHR (sometimes LGW in GIBSO case). I also know that BEXIL (for LGW from the south) has had an a/c holding FL350, GIBSO (out to the west) FL330 and once I saw an a/c holding FL410 at SAM. The first occasions were a few years ago during one foggy VERY early morning at LGW where a/c were waiting for the southern runway to reopen after night works as the visual approach to the northern runway was well outside limits. The last occasion was due to an emergency. We occasionally have to hold for other centres too, and a/c have held at SFD (Seaford) FL290/FL300/FL310/FL320/FL330 due to bad weather at Paris Charles De Gaulle, and something similar at DVR (Dover) when the Brussels Centre computer failed. May fixes have a published hold procedure or two, just that many aren't used in normal every day ops.
I know Lambourne and Ockham have both had a/c in them at FL170 (17,000 ft) when holding for LHR quite regularly and possibly even Bovingdon (don't know normal upper limits), further out BRASO has held regularly upto FL240, BEWLI has held FL260, and these all in normal ops waiting for approaches at LHR (sometimes LGW in GIBSO case). I also know that BEXIL (for LGW from the south) has had an a/c holding FL350, GIBSO (out to the west) FL330 and once I saw an a/c holding FL410 at SAM. The first occasions were a few years ago during one foggy VERY early morning at LGW where a/c were waiting for the southern runway to reopen after night works as the visual approach to the northern runway was well outside limits. The last occasion was due to an emergency. We occasionally have to hold for other centres too, and a/c have held at SFD (Seaford) FL290/FL300/FL310/FL320/FL330 due to bad weather at Paris Charles De Gaulle, and something similar at DVR (Dover) when the Brussels Centre computer failed. May fixes have a published hold procedure or two, just that many aren't used in normal every day ops.
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I don't see why you would find holding at FL170 so unbelievable. Into Dubai we regularly have the holding stack up to FL250 or 260, but the stacks lower level is 10,000ft, whereas I guess yours is lower.
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i suppose it takes all the calculations out of the descent? being able to enter the hold near your cruise and then being let down by ATC at you destination, by the way are you allowed to hold while still in cruise? i wouldnt of thought so, if yes it would produce some good pics
cheers
scott waterworth
cheers
scott waterworth
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In Oz we regularly hold at cruise altitudes; I've spun biz jets at FL450. This happens about 200 miles from touch. MAESTRO tells us so; absorb delays higher and further out is the object, apparently helps with fuel burn.
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We have published enroute holding patterns, so that when we run out of levels for aircraft going from the Middle East to Europe through Saudi Airspace (Non Radar, 10 minutes requirement and limited levels available), we have another option. Seeing a Singapore Airlines 747-400 hold at FL360 doing 500 kts was a sight to see. It was a BIG pattern!!!
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At Eastern Radar in the early 90s (and most definately before) we would hold ac (F111s and A10s) in primary holds up to FL240 and then have a secondary hold for the other ac on recovery. Once levels became available in the primary hold we would shuttle ac over, climb the rest and bring more ac into the lower levels of the secondary hold.
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Not unusual for top of the ONGAR stack to be above 200 in low vis back in the early 70's before flow control was invented. Quite odd being 'on speaker' with about 15 aircraft holding on freq...... until the RVR went up............
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At the end of a night shift in the late 80's we went under on the Lyd sector. We ended up puting a BA Heathrow inbound into the Big hold at FL350. It was the only level I could work out was safe.
As I unpluged it was still at 350 about 20 miles from Big.
I took a long time to get to sleep that day.
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As I unpluged it was still at 350 about 20 miles from Big.
I took a long time to get to sleep that day.
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