Swiss ATC killing trial commences
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 1999
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: global
Joined: Oct 2002
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 8,204
Likes: 348
From: London UK
Can someone remind me please.
Why did Skyguide end up with getting the full blame for the situation when the Bashkirian 154 captain did the opposite of what TCAS was telling him. If you've read the transcripts even the Second Officer was challenging him over this and saying the RA took precedence over the controllers instruction.
Why did Skyguide end up with getting the full blame for the situation when the Bashkirian 154 captain did the opposite of what TCAS was telling him. If you've read the transcripts even the Second Officer was challenging him over this and saying the RA took precedence over the controllers instruction.
The Original Party Animal
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 375
Likes: 0
From: Around the corner
Why did Skyguide end up with getting the full blame for the situation when the Bashkirian 154 captain did the opposite of what TCAS was telling him.
Interesting link:
http://www.iasa.com.au/folders/Safet...yguided-3.html
It is also interesting to know that in January 2001 one and a half years before Überlingen, a very similar incident happened over Japan.
Note the recommendation of the Japanese investigation authorities:
The commission recommended a.o. that the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) put priority on computer orders over instructions from controllers to prevent similar incidents.
ICAO did nothing!
Remember: one and a half years before Überlingen!!
http://aviation-safety.net/database/...?id=20010131-2
Joined: Sep 2000
Aviation Qualifications: Non-Aircrew
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
From: FACT
Blood slightly boiling again...
Do I not like that BBC report.
Grossly oversimplified and written by someone who has clearly never spoken to an ATCO or a Pilot in their life.
"...but insists the attack on Mr Nielsen, who died in front of his own three children, was not already premeditated."
So he just flew to ZRH, checked-in at the Welcome Inn Kloten by the airport, glanced at www.tel.search.ch and www.map.search.ch where you can get the names and addresses of everyone in the country, bought a large knife in Migros, walked down the hill, past the Pizza place at Wilden Mann, up the hill again, waited outside his house and then just accidentally killed him.
And would I do the same in his position?
Having lost my wife and children like that.
I don't know. But if I didn't know the airline and ATC industries, I probably would be trying to blame "someone". And I might not be very rational about it.
But I do still wonder who told the accused the name of the ATCO...
Grossly oversimplified and written by someone who has clearly never spoken to an ATCO or a Pilot in their life.
"...but insists the attack on Mr Nielsen, who died in front of his own three children, was not already premeditated."
So he just flew to ZRH, checked-in at the Welcome Inn Kloten by the airport, glanced at www.tel.search.ch and www.map.search.ch where you can get the names and addresses of everyone in the country, bought a large knife in Migros, walked down the hill, past the Pizza place at Wilden Mann, up the hill again, waited outside his house and then just accidentally killed him.
And would I do the same in his position?
Having lost my wife and children like that.
I don't know. But if I didn't know the airline and ATC industries, I probably would be trying to blame "someone". And I might not be very rational about it.
But I do still wonder who told the accused the name of the ATCO...
Joined: Jun 2001
Aviation Qualifications: LAME
Posts: 676
Likes: 0
From: Over The Hills And Far Away
Already in R&N
ZURICH, October 26 (RIA Novosti) -- The Supreme Court of Zurich sentenced Russian Vitaly Kaloyev to eight years in jail Wednesday for the premeditated murder of a Swiss air traffic controller, but his defense said it would appeal, and Russian prosecutors said they would seek Kaloyev's extradition.
The sentence will include the 610 days during which Kaloyev, who lost his wife, daughter, and son in an air crash in 2002, has already been detained in Switzerland pending the court verdict.
When the verdict was announced, Kaloyev refused to get up.
"I am accused of burying my children. Why would I stand up?" he said.
Peter Nielsen, a Skyguide air traffic controller, was stabbed to death on February 24, 2004 near his house in the Swiss town of Kloten. Kaloyev was arrested in a local hotel a day later.
Kaloyev lost his family in an air crash on July 2, 2002 when a Tu-154 plane owned by Bashkirian airlines collided with a DHL-owned Boeing over Germany's Lake Constance. Sixty-nine people, including 45 Bashkirian children, who were flying to Spain for a holiday, and two Boeing pilots, were killed.
German investigators said the accident was due largely to negligence on the part of Skyguide, and partially the fault of the two Russian pilots.
Kaloyev's defense team decided to appeal against the verdict, defense lawyer Markus Hug said.
Prosecutors described the verdict as too lenient, and said that they might consider an appeal, Prosecutor Ulrich Weder said after the trial.
The Russian Justice Ministry said it would seek Kaloyev's extradition to Russia to serve his sentence there, Saak Karapetyan, the director of the international law and cooperation department of the ministry, told the Ekho Moskvy radio station.
Since Russia and Switzerland have no extradition agreement, and Russia has only signed but not ratified the 1983 European Convention, the only option would be to sign a separate agreement on this particular case, Karapetyan said.
"The main thing is for Kaloyev to agree," he said.
Taimuraz Mamsurov, the president of the Russian North Caucasus republic of North Ossetia where Kaloyev was born, attended the trial as a private person.
"Skyguide can be happy and sleep calmly. Our Vitaly will be in prison, and Nielsen who bore the brunt of the company's sins is no longer with us."
Kaloyev's brother Yury said: "I had to attend the trial of my brother today, instead of a trial of those who killed 71 people."
He also showed photos of the bodies of children who died in the crash.
ZURICH, October 26 (RIA Novosti) -- The Supreme Court of Zurich sentenced Russian Vitaly Kaloyev to eight years in jail Wednesday for the premeditated murder of a Swiss air traffic controller, but his defense said it would appeal, and Russian prosecutors said they would seek Kaloyev's extradition.
The sentence will include the 610 days during which Kaloyev, who lost his wife, daughter, and son in an air crash in 2002, has already been detained in Switzerland pending the court verdict.
When the verdict was announced, Kaloyev refused to get up.
"I am accused of burying my children. Why would I stand up?" he said.
Peter Nielsen, a Skyguide air traffic controller, was stabbed to death on February 24, 2004 near his house in the Swiss town of Kloten. Kaloyev was arrested in a local hotel a day later.
Kaloyev lost his family in an air crash on July 2, 2002 when a Tu-154 plane owned by Bashkirian airlines collided with a DHL-owned Boeing over Germany's Lake Constance. Sixty-nine people, including 45 Bashkirian children, who were flying to Spain for a holiday, and two Boeing pilots, were killed.
German investigators said the accident was due largely to negligence on the part of Skyguide, and partially the fault of the two Russian pilots.
Kaloyev's defense team decided to appeal against the verdict, defense lawyer Markus Hug said.
Prosecutors described the verdict as too lenient, and said that they might consider an appeal, Prosecutor Ulrich Weder said after the trial.
The Russian Justice Ministry said it would seek Kaloyev's extradition to Russia to serve his sentence there, Saak Karapetyan, the director of the international law and cooperation department of the ministry, told the Ekho Moskvy radio station.
Since Russia and Switzerland have no extradition agreement, and Russia has only signed but not ratified the 1983 European Convention, the only option would be to sign a separate agreement on this particular case, Karapetyan said.
"The main thing is for Kaloyev to agree," he said.
Taimuraz Mamsurov, the president of the Russian North Caucasus republic of North Ossetia where Kaloyev was born, attended the trial as a private person.
"Skyguide can be happy and sleep calmly. Our Vitaly will be in prison, and Nielsen who bore the brunt of the company's sins is no longer with us."
Kaloyev's brother Yury said: "I had to attend the trial of my brother today, instead of a trial of those who killed 71 people."
He also showed photos of the bodies of children who died in the crash.
