NATS career structure
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Mr Chips I'm sure your bosses say please and thank you as you whisk past laden with trays of delicious steaming ribs and steaks. Not to mention those heavenly frozen Margheritas.
Oh the joy of singing Happy Birthday to a party of celebratory travellers pausing to exclaim 'Thank Goodness Its Friday'.
Sarcasm aside though, I totally agree with you on the subject of NATs management. However, times are changing, we now have the benefit of a highly experienced ex US Special Forces superman taking care of all matters training for new ATSAs. So things are looking up!
Oh the joy of singing Happy Birthday to a party of celebratory travellers pausing to exclaim 'Thank Goodness Its Friday'.
Sarcasm aside though, I totally agree with you on the subject of NATs management. However, times are changing, we now have the benefit of a highly experienced ex US Special Forces superman taking care of all matters training for new ATSAs. So things are looking up!
Join Date: Jan 1999
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Not One Single Second
On a pedantic note, we don't serve steaks - can't give out steak knives airside y'see... 
And we don't do singing either
But yes, for the benefit of anyone not knowing what i switched to, I know work for TGI Fridays, and believe me, they have a far far better management team than NATS, and care more about their staff than NATS. I have received far more help and encouragement in 6 months my new job than in the last few years (last year especially) in my old.
Was it worth the change? yes.
Do I have a potential career after all these years? yes
Do I regret my decision? Not one single second since I quit NATS, not one single second.
And we don't do singing either
But yes, for the benefit of anyone not knowing what i switched to, I know work for TGI Fridays, and believe me, they have a far far better management team than NATS, and care more about their staff than NATS. I have received far more help and encouragement in 6 months my new job than in the last few years (last year especially) in my old.
Was it worth the change? yes.
Do I have a potential career after all these years? yes
Do I regret my decision? Not one single second since I quit NATS, not one single second.
StandupfortheUlstermen
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Nobody told us there was a career structure, or is that just something else they don't want us Brizzel guys to find out!?
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Ill second Bexils comments at the beginning, there is NO career development in NATS or in any other ATS organisation basically. This isthe sad state of events in all countries. the s**t (those are usually the useless controllers) floats to the top and somehow manages to penetrate this invisible ceiling that most of humans cant seem to penetrate.
Never been able to work that one out after 20 years
Never been able to work that one out after 20 years
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Mr Chips
I'll keep this short. In my involvement with NATS and ATC (in the UK) for 10 years(on and off) I have rarely seen that much self delusion.
How can your training structure be the best in the world if it's a dynamic mess. Delusions of private sector efficiency with soundbites and PR stunts juxtaposed with an apprentice style 'like me/i'm popular' face fits culture at the coalface. And typical European public sector 'yes man', sideways promotion in management.
I must also add that my colleagues and myself laise with many talented NATS staff/management who are well aware of this and do an amazing job as well as being great people.
How can your training structure be the best in the world if it's a dynamic mess. Delusions of private sector efficiency with soundbites and PR stunts juxtaposed with an apprentice style 'like me/i'm popular' face fits culture at the coalface. And typical European public sector 'yes man', sideways promotion in management.
I must also add that my colleagues and myself laise with many talented NATS staff/management who are well aware of this and do an amazing job as well as being great people.
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Errrr Bumpy you have well and truly confused me... I have posted twice on this thread, once slagging off NATS, and the second time slagging off NATS whilst bigging up TGI Fridays (operated by Whitbread in the UK) have you mistaken me for someone who says nice things about NATS?
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validation
No Mr Chips, I was personally validating your criticism. Everything should be criticised, hopefuly constructively.
I recently was present at a meeting with someone who was involved with Human Factors in NATS. He described a Macho attitude, I disagreed. I know exactly what a macho attitude is through experience.
Through a certain family member and my work I can easily identify self delusion fuelled by greed, desperation, self preservation and in a small percentage love of the job (which I respect a bit)
I recently was present at a meeting with someone who was involved with Human Factors in NATS. He described a Macho attitude, I disagreed. I know exactly what a macho attitude is through experience.
Through a certain family member and my work I can easily identify self delusion fuelled by greed, desperation, self preservation and in a small percentage love of the job (which I respect a bit)
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I think that there is a career progression for those that are interested in that sort of thing. its not extensive,
ie for an atco you can become an ojti, almost all do
you can then become an assessor,the next step
then maybe an examiner to carry out boards or LCE who checks the atco's to ensure that they are still working within the rules
but it has to be said that these jobs entail a fair amount of work and are not well rewarded financially at the moment.
on the mangement route at a centre you can become a bank supervisor, looking after the general running of the sectors
next a watch supervisor, then a watch manager but the further you go up the scale the further you get away from doing the job of atco which is why i joined in the first place. in order to gain promotion though you have to jump through a lot of hoops and get the right ticks in the right boxes which to be honest some people just cannot be arsed with.
there's also projects that you can apply to participate in but again there is generally no financial award(unless you are managing it)
just a quick idea of some of what's available but hope it helps
ie for an atco you can become an ojti, almost all do
you can then become an assessor,the next step
then maybe an examiner to carry out boards or LCE who checks the atco's to ensure that they are still working within the rules
but it has to be said that these jobs entail a fair amount of work and are not well rewarded financially at the moment.
on the mangement route at a centre you can become a bank supervisor, looking after the general running of the sectors
next a watch supervisor, then a watch manager but the further you go up the scale the further you get away from doing the job of atco which is why i joined in the first place. in order to gain promotion though you have to jump through a lot of hoops and get the right ticks in the right boxes which to be honest some people just cannot be arsed with.
there's also projects that you can apply to participate in but again there is generally no financial award(unless you are managing it)
just a quick idea of some of what's available but hope it helps
