Low flying military traffic
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Low flying military traffic
I have a question for military / civvie ATCO's: If in a slowmoving spamcan, on a FIS, and squawking what is my protection from getting nutted by a low flying military aircraft?
Do they ever check in for info of aircraft likely to be in the area? Do they rely on picking up the transponder signals? Just eyeball?
Would be interesting to hear your thoughts. Thanks in advance,
LF
Do they ever check in for info of aircraft likely to be in the area? Do they rely on picking up the transponder signals? Just eyeball?
Would be interesting to hear your thoughts. Thanks in advance,
LF
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Your protection is YOUR mark 1 eyeball.
A FIS is a non radar service (discussed to death in the past on this forum) the controller may or may not use radar to enhance this service but I certainly wouldnt expect it or any radar derived traffic info.
Personally, IF i had a reasonable idea which contact you were (or had identified you for another reason) AND happend to be quiet enough to spot the confliction AND had time to do so, I would call the traffic(duty of care) IF I can see it- if it is truly low level chances I wont see it (or you for that matter- see my first statement!)
Either way, why are you flying at low level??
A FIS is a non radar service (discussed to death in the past on this forum) the controller may or may not use radar to enhance this service but I certainly wouldnt expect it or any radar derived traffic info.
Personally, IF i had a reasonable idea which contact you were (or had identified you for another reason) AND happend to be quiet enough to spot the confliction AND had time to do so, I would call the traffic(duty of care) IF I can see it- if it is truly low level chances I wont see it (or you for that matter- see my first statement!)
Either way, why are you flying at low level??
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Lee
Your "protection" is to:
a. Have a proper knowledge of the service you have asked for and got.
b. Avoid areas where you may be in conflict (duty of care to one's self) if reasonable.
c. Re read point a. and get a higher level of service if point b can't be applied.
If you choose to fly in places / hts where you have no help - you are one yer own and liable to see "suprise" traffic.
KISS
Your "protection" is to:
a. Have a proper knowledge of the service you have asked for and got.
b. Avoid areas where you may be in conflict (duty of care to one's self) if reasonable.
c. Re read point a. and get a higher level of service if point b can't be applied.
If you choose to fly in places / hts where you have no help - you are one yer own and liable to see "suprise" traffic.
KISS
Hi Lee,
Here's some more info for you:
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/SRG_GAD_SSL18.PDF
Best advice - stay out of the weeds!
LXGB
Here's some more info for you:
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/SRG_GAD_SSL18.PDF
Best advice - stay out of the weeds!
LXGB
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Thanks all,
Evil Kineval - I am not flying at low level, and I do know and understand the services provided under FIS. Thanks for your help, but please don't be alarmed; the question was hypothetical.
LXGB - Thanks for the link - I had read through SS18 in LASORs prior to posting this.
LF
Evil Kineval - I am not flying at low level, and I do know and understand the services provided under FIS. Thanks for your help, but please don't be alarmed; the question was hypothetical.
LXGB - Thanks for the link - I had read through SS18 in LASORs prior to posting this.
LF
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Lee Frost
I am not alarmed, I merely answered your questions.
Generally Mil aircraft in the low flying system just listen out on the low level quiet frequency(which I believe is still UHF) so do not get any traffic info. If they are transitting near a known "hot spot" they may call for info but that would be subject to workload.
I do not believe any mil fast jets yet have any form of Conflict warning system (CWS) but I think they are under quite a lot of pressure to develop something useable-if you read the airprox summaries that come out every 6 months. So to answer your other qustion they still rely on the eyeball (s)
I am not alarmed, I merely answered your questions.
Generally Mil aircraft in the low flying system just listen out on the low level quiet frequency(which I believe is still UHF) so do not get any traffic info. If they are transitting near a known "hot spot" they may call for info but that would be subject to workload.
I do not believe any mil fast jets yet have any form of Conflict warning system (CWS) but I think they are under quite a lot of pressure to develop something useable-if you read the airprox summaries that come out every 6 months. So to answer your other qustion they still rely on the eyeball (s)
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So to answer your other qustion they still rely on the eyeball (s)
Last edited by effortless; 15th Jun 2005 at 16:27.
T.U.F.O
Seconded! And in answer to the original question, we can also look for IFF transmissions. In the aircraft I fly (Tornado F3), we operate most of the time with a radar service from fighter control agencies, and that combined with the kit we have on the jet means that most of the time we have greater SA on other aircraft than perhaps you might.
Err-ing slightly off-topic, but I also think that having two pairs of trained eyes looking out of the jet helps! From my personal experience, the majority of the time we are the ones who see you and not vice-versa.
Not meant in an antagonistic way, just an observation
FM
Seconded! And in answer to the original question, we can also look for IFF transmissions. In the aircraft I fly (Tornado F3), we operate most of the time with a radar service from fighter control agencies, and that combined with the kit we have on the jet means that most of the time we have greater SA on other aircraft than perhaps you might.
Err-ing slightly off-topic, but I also think that having two pairs of trained eyes looking out of the jet helps! From my personal experience, the majority of the time we are the ones who see you and not vice-versa.
Not meant in an antagonistic way, just an observation
FM
