Farnborough Controller
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Joined: Jan 2005
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From: Ask Crew Control
Farnborough Controller
Does anyone know who the female controller doing the LARS approx 1740 lmt on the 6th of June is ? Have heard her before when I have been working from Blackbushe and like most of the staff there she is professional, patient and above all offers a great service in busy and congested airspace.
Cheers to you all
The Cav
Cheers to you all
The Cav
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,652
Likes: 138
From: 50+ north
Great to hear something positive about ATC outside controlled airspace. All you fliers out there should appreciate that Farnborough LARS (ie 125.250 MHZ) is a dedicated position to provide a service to aircraft outside controlled airspace.
Spare a thought for the guys and girls at Solent who get put upon to provide the same service while they are trying to provide their primary service, ie a radar control service within controlled airspace.
To put the whole thing in perspective, Farnborough, like other LARS units get paid to provide the service (by CAA) Solent do not. If you are outbound Popham/Blackbushe/Elstree/Denham/Goodwood/Lasham/Wycombe Airpark to the Isle of Wight or points south, remaining outside controlled airspace thereof, do Solent a favour and don't call them. If you want a flight information service call London 124.75 or if you want a radar service call Bournemouth 119.47, as a LARS unit, like Farnborough, they get paid for providing you this service.
Spare a thought for the guys and girls at Solent who get put upon to provide the same service while they are trying to provide their primary service, ie a radar control service within controlled airspace.
To put the whole thing in perspective, Farnborough, like other LARS units get paid to provide the service (by CAA) Solent do not. If you are outbound Popham/Blackbushe/Elstree/Denham/Goodwood/Lasham/Wycombe Airpark to the Isle of Wight or points south, remaining outside controlled airspace thereof, do Solent a favour and don't call them. If you want a flight information service call London 124.75 or if you want a radar service call Bournemouth 119.47, as a LARS unit, like Farnborough, they get paid for providing you this service.
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8,266
Likes: 1
From: Berkshire, UK
<<Bournemouth 119.47, as a LARS unit, like Farnborough, they get paid for providing you this service>>
The "organisation" might get paid, but certainly not the controllers! How much do PPLs pay Farnborough for providing the service?
The "organisation" might get paid, but certainly not the controllers! How much do PPLs pay Farnborough for providing the service?
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,652
Likes: 138
From: 50+ north
Heathrow Director
Right on! Where in the real world of business do you get a really free lunch?
I suspect that Bournemouth ATCOs get $hit for the privilege of providing LARS.
Maybe the time has come for CAA to fund NATS at Swanick to provide a UK LARS service. What better place to provide it from with radar data from across the UK?
Right on! Where in the real world of business do you get a really free lunch?
I suspect that Bournemouth ATCOs get $hit for the privilege of providing LARS.
Maybe the time has come for CAA to fund NATS at Swanick to provide a UK LARS service. What better place to provide it from with radar data from across the UK?
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
From: UK
Quote
"Maybe the time has come for CAA to fund NATS at Swanick to provide a UK LARS service. What better place to provide it from with radar data from across the UK?"
Excellent idea!!!! A band 5 LARS
"C/S pass your credit card number expiry date and the 3 numbers on the back of the card "
"Maybe the time has come for CAA to fund NATS at Swanick to provide a UK LARS service. What better place to provide it from with radar data from across the UK?"
Excellent idea!!!! A band 5 LARS
"C/S pass your credit card number expiry date and the 3 numbers on the back of the card "
Joined: Jun 1999
Posts: 978
Likes: 1
From: In the SIM
TCAS FAN,
That is an interesting point you have made there. I will admit, I have always been a little afraid of contacting some ATC units that do not participate in the LARS service for the sake of p**sing them off.
I remember one time when I was flying from Blackbushe to Stapleford, and the majority of the flight south of the Thames was in IMC. After Farnborough terminated my radar service I contacted Biggin for the zone transit and requested from the them if they could request a radar service from Thames Radar for me. Now, I know that Thames provide a radar service for Biggin, for their instrument approaches, however do they welcome pilots calling them for a RIS when pilots are in IMC, and flying very close to their control zone? I have heard a few stories from other pilots about ATCO's getting a little frustrated with pilots treating them like a LARS service, and I can understand that, however I must admit, I feel a lot more comfortable flying in IMC in uncontrolled airspace when I have a radar service.
Just thinking out loud here, would much rather work with ATC, than get on their nerves!
Heathrow Director, well, with regard to CPL/IR holders, perhaps some of the £3000 ish charges for the candidate taking exams and flight tests contributes?
That is an interesting point you have made there. I will admit, I have always been a little afraid of contacting some ATC units that do not participate in the LARS service for the sake of p**sing them off.
I remember one time when I was flying from Blackbushe to Stapleford, and the majority of the flight south of the Thames was in IMC. After Farnborough terminated my radar service I contacted Biggin for the zone transit and requested from the them if they could request a radar service from Thames Radar for me. Now, I know that Thames provide a radar service for Biggin, for their instrument approaches, however do they welcome pilots calling them for a RIS when pilots are in IMC, and flying very close to their control zone? I have heard a few stories from other pilots about ATCO's getting a little frustrated with pilots treating them like a LARS service, and I can understand that, however I must admit, I feel a lot more comfortable flying in IMC in uncontrolled airspace when I have a radar service.
Just thinking out loud here, would much rather work with ATC, than get on their nerves!
Heathrow Director, well, with regard to CPL/IR holders, perhaps some of the £3000 ish charges for the candidate taking exams and flight tests contributes?
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,652
Likes: 138
From: 50+ north
WR
I'm just a simple soul who has tried to get a word in on the Solent frequency when inbound or outbound to/from SOU.
With the advent of Flybe's operation at SOU, IFR traffic inside controlled airspace has increased to unprecedented levels. I just don't want someone, who doesn't need to talk to Solent blocking the frequency when I'm downwind for runway 20 at 2000 FT in IMC, with 90 plus other souls, ending up outside controlled airspace because the controller cannot get the base leg heading change in. It has happened, fortunately with the controller getting through just in time to stop me mixing it with the microlights and the other multitude of traffic at Popham.
It might have appeared in the past to be a good idea to make a courtesy call to Solent, it is no longer. Remember that you may at some time be one of those souls strapped in with me doing 160+ kts downwind, via the Popham circuit onto the ILS.
Unless you need emergency assistance, if you plan to remain outside controlled airspace, stay outside and enjoy the freedom that Class G airspace gives you.
If you are operating under the base of the Solent CTA, get the current Southampton QNH from the ATIS (VOR 113.350), please do not go scooting along at 100 FT below the base on the Regional Pressure setting, using it you can invariably end up in side and on the wrong end of an Airprox or airspace violation report.
PS PA7, assume that you are a Vagabond?
I'm just a simple soul who has tried to get a word in on the Solent frequency when inbound or outbound to/from SOU.
With the advent of Flybe's operation at SOU, IFR traffic inside controlled airspace has increased to unprecedented levels. I just don't want someone, who doesn't need to talk to Solent blocking the frequency when I'm downwind for runway 20 at 2000 FT in IMC, with 90 plus other souls, ending up outside controlled airspace because the controller cannot get the base leg heading change in. It has happened, fortunately with the controller getting through just in time to stop me mixing it with the microlights and the other multitude of traffic at Popham.
It might have appeared in the past to be a good idea to make a courtesy call to Solent, it is no longer. Remember that you may at some time be one of those souls strapped in with me doing 160+ kts downwind, via the Popham circuit onto the ILS.
Unless you need emergency assistance, if you plan to remain outside controlled airspace, stay outside and enjoy the freedom that Class G airspace gives you.
If you are operating under the base of the Solent CTA, get the current Southampton QNH from the ATIS (VOR 113.350), please do not go scooting along at 100 FT below the base on the Regional Pressure setting, using it you can invariably end up in side and on the wrong end of an Airprox or airspace violation report.
PS PA7, assume that you are a Vagabond?
Joined: Jun 1999
Posts: 97
Likes: 0
From: Suffolk
LARS is funded from route charges via Eurocontrol:
How LARS is funded
7. The current level of funding for LARS is approximately £1.6 million per year. The service is paid for via
the Eurocontrol route charges system as an element of the UK's unit rate. All aircraft above 5.7 tonnes pay
route charges and thereby contribute to the cost of LARS. Aircraft between 2 and 5.7 tonnes flying under
instrument flight rules (IFR) also pay route charges. Aircraft between 2 and 5.7 tonnes flying under visual
flight rules (VFR) and all aircraft below 2 tonnes are exempt from route charges. Effectively, this means that
LARS is currently funded by commercial airlines and business aviation of whatever nationality flying in UK
airspace.
Go to www.dft.gov.uk type LARS in search and the link to the whole report will appear.
Funding is allocated to units by opening hours, so Farnborough gets paid not a bean more for being the busiest LARS unit in the UK.
How LARS is funded
7. The current level of funding for LARS is approximately £1.6 million per year. The service is paid for via
the Eurocontrol route charges system as an element of the UK's unit rate. All aircraft above 5.7 tonnes pay
route charges and thereby contribute to the cost of LARS. Aircraft between 2 and 5.7 tonnes flying under
instrument flight rules (IFR) also pay route charges. Aircraft between 2 and 5.7 tonnes flying under visual
flight rules (VFR) and all aircraft below 2 tonnes are exempt from route charges. Effectively, this means that
LARS is currently funded by commercial airlines and business aviation of whatever nationality flying in UK
airspace.
Go to www.dft.gov.uk type LARS in search and the link to the whole report will appear.
Funding is allocated to units by opening hours, so Farnborough gets paid not a bean more for being the busiest LARS unit in the UK.