atc slot abuse
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 27
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From: UK
atc slot abuse
Recently, whilst boarding a colleague of mine heard a knocking at the cockpit window.The man announced himself as the "Air Traffic Manager" for the airport and that if the flight had any slot then not to worry because he would sort it out.
What does this mean?
Does this person have the power to change slot times?
Is he trying to be clever by suggesting that he can?
Would he tell his ATC staff to ignore the slot time and let the a/c depart on time regardless.
What does this mean?
Does this person have the power to change slot times?
Is he trying to be clever by suggesting that he can?
Would he tell his ATC staff to ignore the slot time and let the a/c depart on time regardless.
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 342
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From: where should i be today????
Sound like a wind-up. He was probably a frequent flyer who had got so pi$$ed off at the front end crew constantly blaming ATC for departure delays that he thought he would pre-empt them trying it again!
Joined: Sep 2003
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From: EGLL
Have heard the same story from a friend and it seems that that the manager concerned is trying to show off. Whether or not he is abusing his power I do not know, but from a flight deck perceptipn he looks like an idiot.
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 246
Likes: 7
From: The world's most liveable city
We've got an assistant like that. Can't be bothered requesting a new slot/sending a delay, so just says 'he can go'. He has set a few people up. He is a complete person whose parents weren't married
Joined: May 2000
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From: EGTT/FAB/LGW/BOH/FAB/LGW
Why was the ATC manager knocking on the window, was he cleaning the windows as a sideline????
I can see it now standing there atop a cherry picker offering a whole host of services, windows buffed, slots cancelled, direct routings offered!!!!
I can see it now standing there atop a cherry picker offering a whole host of services, windows buffed, slots cancelled, direct routings offered!!!!
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Posts: n/a
Slots get re-negotiated every day. It's no big deal.
Many controllers will help out an aircraft or pilot in many ways if no one is inconvenienced and no rules are broken - using a non-duty runway, sorting out a higher initial level for a positioning flight so that the aircraft can go up like a rocket, flying over a kid's party, taking a look at a house a pilot is thinking of buying, checking out how busy the golf course is on the way in. Done them all - without any problems.
But to knock on anything but the flightdeck door for anything but a professional hello is something that only a @rse would do.
But unfortunately, just as in any other walk of life, there are a few @rses in ATC.
Many controllers will help out an aircraft or pilot in many ways if no one is inconvenienced and no rules are broken - using a non-duty runway, sorting out a higher initial level for a positioning flight so that the aircraft can go up like a rocket, flying over a kid's party, taking a look at a house a pilot is thinking of buying, checking out how busy the golf course is on the way in. Done them all - without any problems.
But to knock on anything but the flightdeck door for anything but a professional hello is something that only a @rse would do.
But unfortunately, just as in any other walk of life, there are a few @rses in ATC.
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 19
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From: In a house
the "Air Traffic Manager" for the airport
It happened at LBA about 2/3 months ago
I think
is something that only a @rse would do.
Did he get a result? If so, then good on him. Maybe he had a meeting to get to. Probably saved the airline a bit of money.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 27
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From: UK
He did not know the flight deck otherwise he wouldn't have introduced himself. How would he change the slot once onboard? He wasn't on the jumpseat therefore could not do so by the r/t, therefore he would have to use his mobile which is against the law. Alternatively a quick sprint to the tower may have sufficed. Still I think he made himself and the rest of the ATC ers look like idiots.
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 614
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From: South East
I know of a couple of people in our profession, that boast about demanding special treatment from certain airlines, because they are an ATCO.
I try to explain to them they just make us look like like T*&T$. And its people like that who encourage a them and us attitude. Plus threatens the concessions we are kindly offered.
Can't quite see how he could get the slot cancelled when on board. But maybe there is more to it.
I try to explain to them they just make us look like like T*&T$. And its people like that who encourage a them and us attitude. Plus threatens the concessions we are kindly offered.
Can't quite see how he could get the slot cancelled when on board. But maybe there is more to it.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 27
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From: UK
No I don't work at LBA but elsewhere. I was only interested to see what, if any, influence people had on slot times or if the system could be fiddled or if people were so blase regarding slot times that they were ignored.
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 122
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From: By here now in a minute
if the system could be fiddled or if people were so blase regarding slot times that they were ignored.
who ignores them because it suits them and sod the poor guy who'll be overloaded.The system used to be open to abuse but by stopping the use of retrospective DLA msgs (eg delaying flight to 1020 at 1030) and making all AOs delay flights if they had gone past EOBT +15, the playing field got levelled for all. Therefore it's not fiddleable in that way anymore.
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 112
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From: UK
I would say that 99.9% of ATCOs take slot times very seriously especially as MATS 1 now states that the slot time is an integral part of the clearance and should in thoery be passed with the clearance.
All it takes is for a sector overload to trigger an investigation and with the airfiled movement log any transgressions will soon come to light.
A Manager ATS certainly has no authority to break slots and if tried on me would be politely told to sign the watch log and take over the watch - swiftly followed by submission of a 1261!!
All it takes is for a sector overload to trigger an investigation and with the airfiled movement log any transgressions will soon come to light.
A Manager ATS certainly has no authority to break slots and if tried on me would be politely told to sign the watch log and take over the watch - swiftly followed by submission of a 1261!!
Last edited by This is a crisis; 14th April 2005 at 17:25.