EGWU DVR TB-3 Flight Plan Loss
Guest
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EGWU DVR TB-3 Flight Plan Loss
When filing IFR from EGWU to TB-3 via DVR, my flight plan is lost at London Center? This has happened twice to me, so I do not file this Tacan route anymore. The nice chaps at Northhold operations told me that for some reason London Center sees the Tacan route (TB-3) and cancels the flight plan. I am given start and taxi clearance of course, and the flight plan was previously accepted by Eurocontrol. The last time this happened, I idled at the holding point for Rwy 07 for 45 minutes before I could get a clearance, which was a completely different routing. I would appreciate any input on why this is happening.
Cheers,
Check 6
Cheers,
Check 6
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The TACAN routes are only available at certain times (UTC):
0000-0700, 1700-0000 Mon,Tue, Wed, Fri
0000-1100, 1700-0000 Thu
H24 Sat, Sun and French Public Holidays
You must have cleared the end of the TACAN routes by 0700 (Mon,Tue,Wed,Fri) and 1100 on Thu. If you file outside these times the flight plan will not be sent to LATCC (Civ). With no flightplan in the civil system within UK and if you have a UHF radio LJAO, military controllers who operate in the civil ops room, can get you to the FIR boundary providing that the French have a flight plan.
Regards
Pie Man
[This message has been edited by Pie Man (edited 10 June 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Pie Man (edited 10 June 2000).]
0000-0700, 1700-0000 Mon,Tue, Wed, Fri
0000-1100, 1700-0000 Thu
H24 Sat, Sun and French Public Holidays
You must have cleared the end of the TACAN routes by 0700 (Mon,Tue,Wed,Fri) and 1100 on Thu. If you file outside these times the flight plan will not be sent to LATCC (Civ). With no flightplan in the civil system within UK and if you have a UHF radio LJAO, military controllers who operate in the civil ops room, can get you to the FIR boundary providing that the French have a flight plan.
Regards
Pie Man
[This message has been edited by Pie Man (edited 10 June 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Pie Man (edited 10 June 2000).]
Guest
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Thank you Pie Man. The flights that this happened on were probably outside of those hours. I operate Military C-21 aircraft equipped with UHF and Tacan. What are the mechanics of departing LGWU without LATCC having a flight plan using the military controllers? How do the French controllers get the flight plan? Would this flight plan just show a route from the FIR boundary, i.e. "bagin" point? Thank you, I appreciate your input.
Check 6
[This message has been edited by Check 6 (edited 10 June 2000).]
Check 6
[This message has been edited by Check 6 (edited 10 June 2000).]
Guest
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Check 6,
You still have to file a flightplan (via CFMU) but if it gets lost in the UK civil system (TACAN routes in France are controlled by civilian controllers), as long as the French have a plan, London Military (Lon Mil)can get you to the FIR boundary. A suggested routing is MLD-TB5-WD7-TB7-DVR-TB3 (I believe this routing still works I stopped working in this airspace 2 years ago), a copy of the flight plan should be sent to Lon Mil. I know heading off initially north east is not the most expeditious routing to France but you are more likely to get unrestricted climb to cruising altitude clear of cotrolled air space(CAS). The routing takes you beneath CAS to the north east of Northolt. A handover would then be done to Lon Mil to enable climb clear of CAS. They would do a handover to the controllers in the civil ops room to get you through CAS to the east of London. Through this airspace you can expect to get vectors due to the large numbers of descending and climbing civil tracks but eventually be routed direct along TB3. The big problem is if the French do not have a flightplan, if this is the case the military controllers in the civil ops room will not accept the aircraft as there is nowhere to hold you at the FIR boundary to sort the problem out.
The info I have is 2 years out of date but I can check on Monday (12 Jun) if the above is still valid.
Regards
Pie Man
You still have to file a flightplan (via CFMU) but if it gets lost in the UK civil system (TACAN routes in France are controlled by civilian controllers), as long as the French have a plan, London Military (Lon Mil)can get you to the FIR boundary. A suggested routing is MLD-TB5-WD7-TB7-DVR-TB3 (I believe this routing still works I stopped working in this airspace 2 years ago), a copy of the flight plan should be sent to Lon Mil. I know heading off initially north east is not the most expeditious routing to France but you are more likely to get unrestricted climb to cruising altitude clear of cotrolled air space(CAS). The routing takes you beneath CAS to the north east of Northolt. A handover would then be done to Lon Mil to enable climb clear of CAS. They would do a handover to the controllers in the civil ops room to get you through CAS to the east of London. Through this airspace you can expect to get vectors due to the large numbers of descending and climbing civil tracks but eventually be routed direct along TB3. The big problem is if the French do not have a flightplan, if this is the case the military controllers in the civil ops room will not accept the aircraft as there is nowhere to hold you at the FIR boundary to sort the problem out.
The info I have is 2 years out of date but I can check on Monday (12 Jun) if the above is still valid.
Regards
Pie Man
